Elliot Rodger

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Everyone has a right to express an opinion; yes ???

And apparently misandry is a socially accepted opinion, and "misogyny" is not.

Amanda Hess is a known misandrist firefly.

Just stop.

Everyone has a right to express an opinion; yes ???





David

Yep, and Hess free to argue that the fact that Roger killed both men
and women is just more proof of how much he hated men.

Quote:

The argument is ALWAYS:

Men suck

Men are dangerous

Men need to be oppressed for the good of the collective.

Don't forget that men are disposable too! Otherwise every war in history would've been fought by women!

OmSigDAVID wrote:

nononono wrote:

Amanda Hess is a known misandrist firefly.

Just stop.

Everyone has a right to express an opinion; yes ???





David

Yep, and Hess free to argue that the fact that Roger killed both men and women is just more proof of how much he hated women

Quote:

Elliot Rodger targeted women out of entitlement, their male partners out of jealousy, and unrelated male bystanders out of expedience. This is not ammunition for an argument that he was a misandrist at heart—it’s evidence of the horrific extent of misogyny’s cultural reach.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2014/05/29/elliot_rodger_hated_men_because_he_hated_women.html

Two problems though....1) the argument makes little to no sense and 2) one gets the impression that if Rogers killed only women that she would using Rogers life to make the exactly the same argument.


The argument is ALWAYS:

Men suck

Men are dangerous

Men need to be oppressed for the good of the collective.





The argument is always this same argument, no matter were the facts fall. The argument will always be the same no matter what men do, because the facts dont matter.

We are free to have opinions only up to the point that they are the "right" opinions....which means that we are in fact not free.

Inside the ‘manosphere’ that inspired Santa Barbara shooter Elliot Rodger
By Caitlin Dewey
May 27 2014

Elliot Rodger will forever be known as the 22-year-old who murdered six people in Santa Barbara on May 23. But Rodger’s extensive digital footprint, as well as his stomach-turning YouTube send-off and 137-page manifesto, suggest that he may have identified himself differently: as an “incel,” or involuntary virgin; as an aspirational, if frustrated, pick-up artist; and as an adherent of the so-called “manosphere” — that corner of the Internet where boys will be boys, girls will be objects, and critics will be “feminists,” “misandrists” or “enemies.”

If you’re not familiar with these terms, you’re not alone: The manosphere and its various components tend to only make mainstream news over tragedies (like this one) and controversies (like one “activist’s” opposition to date-rape seminars on college campuses). But to thousands of men across the Internet — including, apparently, Rodger — they’re home.

Rodger has personally been linked to an account on the pick-up site PUAhate.com, where he advocated an overthrow of “this oppressive feminist system” and envisioned “a world where WOMEN FEAR YOU.” On YouTube, he followed a number of accounts that claimed to teach pick-up artistry — a skill that’s equal parts pseudoscience, manipulation and objectification. In his last YouTube video, in which he chillingly announces the start of his killing spree, Rodger even cops some classic pick-up lingo: “You will finally see that I am, in truth, the superior one. The true alpha male.” (Emphasis mine.)

Let’s be clear: None of this suggests that (a) the manosphere is somehow to blame for Rodger’s killing spree, (b) that other factors like mental health or gun laws are less critical, or (c) that every would-be “pick-up artist,” or PUA, is one rejection away from mass murder. Making those kinds of sweeping conclusions would be, as critics have pointed out, really irresponsible and dumb.

That said, Rodger’s misogynistic rhetoric seems undeniably influenced by the manosphere, and his manifesto has kicked off a loud debate about how modern society treats women, online and off. If there was ever a time to take a closer look at online misogyny, it’s now.

Alas, even from a distance, it doesn’t look too pretty.

Mapping the manosphere

When people talk about the “manosphere,” they’re basically talking about a vast, diverse network of blogs and forums that take a certain antagonistic stance toward women and dating. Not all branches of the manosphere are overtly appalling; not all of them are even run by men. That said, their core philosophy basically boils down to this: (1) feminism has overrun/corrupted modern culture, in violation of nature/biology/inherent gender differences, and (2) men can best seduce women (slash, save society in general) by embracing a super-dominant, uber-masculine gender role, forcing ladies to fall into step behind them.

This philosophy plays out differently in different places. Hundreds of Web sites are dedicated to teaching “game” to hapless daters. But often, if not always, “game” involves reducing women to sexual targets, rating their attractiveness on a scale of 1 to 10, and deploying techniques like “negging” to get a girl to notice you. (“Negging” = insulting a woman to throw off her confidence. For instance: “Your hair is hideous. Is that a wig?”)

The blog Chateau Heartiste, one of the forerunners in the manosphere/PUA scene, even publishes quizzes for men and women to determine their “dating market value.” The questions for men include, “What is your occupation?” and “Have people besides your family called you funny?” The questions for women include, “How long are your legs in relation to your height?” (Long: +1 point; average: 0 points; short: -1 point.)

It’s rude, of course. And it’s a painfully cynical way to interpret interpersonal relationships. But taken to extremes, that belief in retro gender roles has fueled a whole system of sites that denigrate women and advocate for a socio-cultural regression that puts ladies back in the kitchen and bedroom. Sometimes these sites brand themselves as dating sites; others proudly fly the “Men’s Rights” flag, in solidarity with a movement that essentially claims guys have it rough, too. (Important note: MRA sometimes, though not always, describes a push to reform divorce, visitation and alimony laws — clearly separate issues from what we’re addressing here.)

In either case, the “manosphere” is frequently enough to make any progressive lady — or guy! — choke back bile. The Southern Poverty Law Center, which identifies hate groups, even went so far as to publish a report on it in 2012. (“Although some of the sites make an attempt at civility and try to back their arguments with facts,” the report read, “they are almost all thick with misogynistic attacks that can be astounding for the guttural hatred they express.”) The very next year, the comically named Return of Kings — which has, among other things, talked up eating disorders and hitting women — topped our list of the most-hated sites on the Web.

Manosphere doctrine, in a nutshell

To most people, it’s probably not difficult to see why the manosphere offends. At the most basic level, much of that community advocates for inequality between men and women, a problem called out by the SPLC report. In the U.S., at least, that’s not generally a value that the mainstream rallies around.

The manosphere doesn’t just preach inequality between men and women, however. I’ve spent more than a year observing several large sites within this community, and its ideology regarding the “right” kinds of men and women is pretty inflexible, too. Gay, lesbian or transgendered people are, needless to say, completely out. “Masculine” women (i.e. women with short hair, women with high-powered jobs, women with outspoken opinions) also earn the manosphere’s derision. But the community reserves a special kind of disdain for “effeminate” or “beta” men — men who either do not have “game” or who are still taking what believers call the “blue pill.”

Per the blog Red Pill Room — where, needless to say, betas aren’t welcome — the blue pill is like a metaphor for the mainstream mindset:

The subconscious pattern of behaviors, often informed by feminism, feminists and mainstream society, that encourages men to forego traditionally and truly masculine behavior and attitudes in favor of those in which capitulation to female whimsy.

In other words, red-pilled men are alphas who have seen the light and seized the sex/power/glory owed to them by their biology. Blue-pilled guys are the hapless, sexless dummies still treating women as equals and asking them out in conventional, non-pushy ways.[/I]

This distinction, while it sounds ridiculous, is actually pretty critical to understanding Rodger and his place in the manosphere … such as it was. While Rodger evidently followed a number of pick-up sites and YouTube channels, his most notable postings were on a site called PUAhate — a forum for malcontents complaining that the “game” didn’t work. There, and on other forums, Rodger identified as an “incel, or “involuntary celibate” — a virgin who couldn’t get girls, even after taking “the red pill.” On the manosphere totem pole, there’s nothing quite so pathetic. Besides women, anyway...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-intersect/wp/2014/05/27/inside-the-manosphere-that-inspired-santa-barbara-shooter-elliot-rodger/

Truest words in this ENTIRE thread.

Quote:

We are free to have opinions only up to the point that they are the "right" opinions....
which means that we are in fact not free.

Truest words in this ENTIRE thread.

And apparently man hating feminist hyperbole rhetoric is the "right" opinion,
as deemed so by our matriarchal society.

Quote:

Truest words in this ENTIRE thread.

When I was a boy in the 60's/70's it was not true,
if someone said something that you did not agree with the response
was " I dont not agree, this is what I think"

Then it became " I dont not agree, this is what I think and you are not
as good a person as me because you are wrong".

You and Hawkeye are definitely red pill popping, misogynistic, card-carrying member of the "manosphere".

Can you imagine if ANY other ideology aggressively promoted the idea that if ANYONE disagreed with them, that automatically made them social outcasts who are AUTOMATICALLY "at fault" and "part of the problem"; that that AUTOMATICALLY discredited their stance (simply by disagreeing or suggesting a differing viewpoint)? They would be looked at as a fanatical, delusional, joke!

When I was a boy in the 60's/70's it was not true, if someone said something that you did not agree with the response was " I dont not agree, this is what I think"

Then it became " I dont not agree, this is what I think and you are not as good a person as me because you are wrong" .

Then it became I dont not agree, this is what I think and you are not as good a person as me because you are wrong and you should watch how much you advertise your stupidity"

Then it became " only neanderthal think that way so I am not going to listen to your opinion"

Then it became " You are not allowed to say that and thinking that way goes to prove how fucked in the head you are, so SHUT UP!"

Next will be " Hello 911? Yes, you need to send over a crew to pick up a mentally ill person, we have a guy who said something bad".


At least I will likely be dead before the worst of it gets here.

And we still have A2K for the moment, I will miss it when it is gone (TWO THUMBS UP TO ROBERT)

And we still have A2K for the moment, I will miss it when it is gone ...

I have never been able to think like I am told to think.

I am a flawed individual.

hawkeye10 wrote:

And we still have A2K for the moment, I will miss it when it is gone ...

I will miss it too, when it's gone. Could the exit be approaching?

This entire article you posted focuses SOLELY on the pick up artist community. The pick up artist community IS NOT representative of the entire "Manosphere" (a term used in this piece in a very condescending way to undercut REAL men's organizations and issues.) It doesn't at all mention organizations (most of which that are struggling precisely because of horseshit mainstream media coverage like this) that aim to empower men who are struggling....

Intelligence Report, Spring 2012, Issue Number: 145
Misogyny: The Sites

The so-called “manosphere” is peopled with hundreds of websites, blogs and forums dedicated to savaging feminists in particular and women, very typically American women, in general. Although some of the sites make an attempt at civility and try to back their arguments with facts, they are almost all thick with misogynistic attacks that can be astounding for the guttural hatred they express. What follows are brief descriptions of a dozen of these sites. Another resource is the Man Boobz website (manboobz.com), a humorous pro-feminist blog (its tagline is “Misogyny: I Mock It”) that keeps a close eye on these and many other woman-hating sites.

Alcuin
Alcuin is a blog that promotes the “Intellectual Renaissance of the Western Tradition.” “Just as the Nazis had to create a Jewish conspiracy as a way to justify mass slaughter,” one post declares, “so feminists have to create patriarchy as a way to justify mass slaughter of innocent unborn, and the destruction of men and masculinity. Rape is now a political crime, not a crime of sex or violence. A man doesn’t have to rape in order to be a rapist. A man is a rapist until he somehow proves himself innocent.” Another post, titled “Having their cake,” asserts that “Western women … act, dress, and look like hairy fat pigs, but get angry when they can’t find a man … act like bitches, but expect men to respect them … don’t know what the hell they want, but seek power over men and over everything.”

Boycott American Women
This site’s mission statement describes American women as “generally immature, selfish, extremely arrogant and self-centered, mentally unstable, irresponsible and highly unchaste. The behavior of most American women is utterly disgusting.” Plus, they supposedly pose a higher risk of divorce than women from such countries as Russia, Thailand and the Philippines, where the blog suggests men find their mates. The site is rife with posts from outsiders, like the recent one that said: “I think we should export all american [sic] bitches to other countries and take in women from other places. … Have you noticed how fat these sluts get AT AN EARLY AGE… . f you were allowed to beat your wife we wouldn’t be dealing with this crap.”

The Counter Feminist
Its tagline probably won’t be set to music any time soon, but it does capture the flavor of the site: “The female-supremacist hate movement called ‘feminism’ must be opened to the disinfecting sunlight of the world’s gaze and held to a stern accounting for its grievous transgressions.” Recent headlines, like December’s “More Proof That Feminism is a Social Cancer,” reflect the same sensibility. “Fidelbogen,” the otherwise unidentified Washington state man who operates the blog, also runs the False Rape Task Force and Women Doing Lousy Things blogs and is heavily involved in the Counter-Feminist YouTube Channel.

The False Rape Society
The False Rape Society is an Internet news aggregator, subtitled “Community of the Falsely Accused,” that features stories about allegedly false rape accusations and “feminist”-crafted “anti-male” legislation. While the site focuses heavily on news stories about false rape allegations, it frequently veers into such posts as the New Year’s Day item attacking a female supporter of then-presidential aspirant Michelle Bachmann for telling a reporter, “It takes a woman to get things done.”

In Mala Fide
This blog, whose name translates from the Latin as “In Bad Faith,” describes itself in its mission statement as “[a]n online magazine dedicated to publishing heretical and unpopular ideas. Ideas that polite society considers ‘racist,’ ‘misogynistic,’ ‘homophobic,’ ‘bigoted’ or other slurs used to shut down critical thinking and maintain the web of delusions that keep our world broken and dying.” The unifying idea is this: “Feminism is a hate movement designed to disenfranchise and dehumanize men.” The site carries ads for such offerings as the HardKnight “male enhancement system,” PolishLasses (“Over 5,000 … candid photos”), and the racist 1922 classic The Revolt Against Civilization by Lothrop Stoddard.

MarkyMark’s Thoughts
Run by a New Jersey Tea Partier with a financially underwater house and a chronic medical condition, Marky Mark’s blog is filled with edifying thoughts like “Even Nice Girls are Sluts.” His blog is not without pathos, however; to say the least, his is not a happy existence. “Do I go through life and all its trials and tribulations alone? Do I go through them with a nagging, selfish bitch who won’t help me anyway? … Or, do I go through them alone, divorced, and poor?” But mostly, this blog is just plain nasty. “Boys,” a January posting urges Marky Mark’s readers, “don’t get involved in American women; they’re sluts, skanks, and disease ridden whores.”

MensActivism
This website tracks news and information about men’s issues from around the world, with a focus on activism — and outrage. Par for the course are lurid headlines like this one: “Pakistani wife kills, cooks husband for lusting over daughter.” The site also runs stories like the one it headlined “Australia: Girl, 13, charged after taxi knife attack” that involve no abuse accusations, but are merely meant to undermine what the site claims is “the myth that women are less violent than men.”

Reddit: Mens Rights
A “subreddit” of the user-generated news site Reddit, this forum describes itself as a “place for people who feel that men are currently being disadvantaged by society.” While it presents itself as a home for men seeking equality, it is notable for the anger it shows toward any program designed to help women. It also trafficks in various conspiracy theories. “Kloo2yoo,” identified as a site moderator, writes that there is “undeniable proof” of an international feminist conspiracy involving the United Nations, the Obama Administration and others, aimed at demonizing men.

RooshV
Roosh Vörek is a Maryland-raised PUA (“pick up artist”) whose specialty is sex with foreign women; his blog is a sales vehicle for his books like Bang: The Pick Up Bible and Bang Iceland: How to Sleep With Icelandic Women in Iceland, which one Icelandic feminist group described as a “rape guide.” Vörek likes to talk about his many “notches” (seductions) and such things as “American cunts who I want to hate ****.” He adds: “I’ll be the first to admit that many of my bangs in the United States were hate fucks. The masculine attitude and lack of care these women put into their style or hair irritated me, so I made it a point to **** them and never call again.”

SAVE Services
The acronym in SAVE Services stands for Stop Abusive and Violent Environments; “Protecting Victims, Stopping False Allegations, Ending Abuse” is its tagline. In practice, that means lobbying to roll back services for victims of domestic abuse and penalties for their tormentors, while working to return the focus to the “true victims of abuse” — the falsely accused. The site trumpets as a “key fact” that “[f]emale initiation of partner violence is the leading reason for the woman becoming a victim of subsequent violence,” even though a study shows that approximately twice as many women as men are injured during incidents of domestic violence.

The Spearhead
The Spearhead is an online magazine that features a range of “voices in defense of ourselves, our families and our fellow men.” One post calls the recently released American version of the movie thriller “The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo” “hate porn for feminists” and describes its strong female lead as “like a kind of dyke junkie.” Another post includes this fairly typical summation: “I have said it before, and I will say it again; I don’t hate women. I just hate what they do to men.”

A Voice for Men
A Voice for Men is essentially a mouthpiece for its editor, Paul Elam, who proposes to “expose misandry [hatred of men] on all levels in our culture.” Elam tosses down the gauntlet in his mission statement: “AVfM regards feminists, manginas [a derisive term for weak men], white knights [a similar derisive term, for males who identify as feminists] and other agents of misandry as a social malignancy. We do not consider them well intentioned or honest agents for their purported goals and extend to them no more courtesy or consideration than we would clansmen [sic], skinheads, neo Nazis or other purveyors of hate.” Register-Her.com, an affiliated website that vilifies women by name who have made supposedly false rape allegations (among other crimes against masculinity), is one of Elam’s signature “anti-hate” efforts. “Why are these women not in prison?” the site asks.
http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-report/browse-all-issues/2012/spring/misogyny-the-sites