8
   

Please help me interpret these scriptures!

 
 
Reply Mon 5 May, 2014 12:54 am
My brother seems to have devoted his life to trying to discredit Christianity and I refuse to let him influence My FAITH but I wish I had a response to sum of his questions. Sorry there are sooo many but here is a list of scriptures he is using to claim that "The God of Scriptures is hypocritical". I apologize if that phrase makes you cringe as much as me.

“If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman…they shall be put to death” (Leviticus 20:13). “One of the children of Israel came and brought unto his brethren a Midianitish woman…And when Phinehas…saw it, he rose up from among the congregation, and took a javelin in his hand…and thrust both of them through, the man of Israel, and the woman through her belly. So the plague was stayed from the children of Israel” (Numbers 25:6-8). “He slew all the house of Baasha, he left him not one that pisseth against a wall, neither of his kinsfolks, nor of his friends. Thus did Zimri destroy all the house of Baasha, according to the word of the Lord” (1 Kings 16:11-12).
“Whosoever he be of thy seed in their generations that hath any blemish, let him not approach to offer the bread of his God. For whatsoever man he be that hath a blemish, he shall not approach: a blind man, or a lame, or he that hath a flat nose, or any thing superfluous, Or a man that is brokenfooted, or brokenhanded, Or crookbackt, or a dwarf, or that hath a blemish in his eye, or be scurvy, or scabbed, or hath his stones broken; No man that hath a blemish of the seed of Aaron the priest shall come nigh to offer the offerings of the Lord made by fire: he hath a blemish; he shall not come nigh to offer the bread of his God” (Leviticus 21:17-21). “And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Command the children of Israel, that they put out of the camp every leper, and everyone that hath an issue, and whosoever is defiled by the dead: Both male and female shall ye put out, without the camp shall ye put them; that they defile not their camps, in the midst whereof I dwell” (Numbers 5:1-3). “He that is wounded in the stones, or hath his privy member cut off, shall not enter into the congregation of the Lord” (Deuteronomy 23:1).
“And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend in the siege and straitness” (Jeremiah 19:9). “And toward her young one that cometh out from between her feet, and toward her children which she shall bear: for she shall eat them for want of all things secretly in the siege and the straitness” (Deuteronomy 28:57). “Through the wrath of the Lord of hosts is the land darkened, and the people shall be as the fuel of the fire: no man shall spare his brother. And he shall snatch on the right hand, and be hungry; and he shall eat on the left hand, and they shall not be satisfied: they shall eat every man the flesh of his own arm” (Isaiah 9:19-20). “Whosoever toucheth the dead body of any man that is dead, and purifieth not himself, defileth the tabernacle of the Lord; and that soul shall be cut off from Israel: because the water of separation was not sprinkled upon him, he shall be unclean; his uncleanness is yet upon him” (Numbers 19:13).”
“And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death” (Exodus 21:17). “If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy firend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods…thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die” (Deuteronomy 13:6-10). “And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved” (Matthew 10:21-22).
“And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell. And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee” (Matthew 5:29-30; see also Matthew 18:8-9; Mark 9:43-48). “For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother’s womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven’s sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it” (Matthew 19:12). “And no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb” (Revelation 14:3-4). “They shall not make baldness upon their head, neither shall they shave off the corner of their beard, nor make any cuttings in their flesh” (Leviticus 21:5).
“And when the Lord thy God hath delivered [a city] into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword: But the women…shalt thou take unto thyself” (Deuteronomy 20:13-14). “And whosoever lieth carnally with a woman, that is a bondmaid, betrothed to an husband, and not at all remeemed, nor freedom given her; she shall be scourged; they shall not be put to death, because she was not free. And he shall bring his trespass offering unto the Lord, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, even a ram for a trespass offering. And the priest shall make atonement for him” (Leviticus 19:20-22). “If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found: Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel’s father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife” (Deuteronomy 22:28-29).
“And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished. Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money” (Exodus 21:20-21). “Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell” (Proverbs 23:13-14).
“Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac…And God said unto Abraham…harken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called…And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba” (Genesis 21:10-14). “Ye shall not give your daughters unto their sons, nor take their daughters unto your sons, or for yourselves. Did not Solomon king of Israel sin by these things? yet among many nations was there no king like him, who was beloved of his God, and God made him king over all Israel: nevertheless even him did outlandish women cause to sin. Shall we then hearken unto you to do all this great evil, to transgress against our God in marrying strange wives?…Thus cleansed I them from all strangers, and appointed the wards of the priests and the Levites, every one in his business” (Nehemiah 13:25-30). “If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple” (Luke 14:26; see also Mark 10:29-30; Luke 18:29-30).
“Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination” (Leviticus 18:22). “[David said] I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women” (2 Samuel 1:26). “And as soon as the lad was gone, David arose out of a place toward the south, and fell on his face to the ground, and bowed himself three times; and they [Jonathan and David] kissed one another, and wept one with another, until David exceeded” (1 Samuel 20:41). “And [David] had seven hundred wives, princesses, and three hundred concubines: and his wives turned away his heart (1 Kings 11:3) “For this cause God gave them up into vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet” (Romans 1:26-27).
“But those that encamp before the tabernacle toward the east, even before the tabernacle of the congregation eastward, shall be Moses, and Aaron and his sons, keeping the charge of the sanctuary for the charge of the children of Israel; and the stranger that cometh nigh shall be put to death” (Numbers 3:38). “If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour’s wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you” Deuteronomy 22:23-24).

Again I would appreciate anybody's input on making better sense out of some of these, I'm sorry he came up with sooo many!
 
maxdancona
 
  3  
Reply Mon 5 May, 2014 06:36 am
@Landoneous7,
Have you considered the possibility that your brother is correct?

Once you have to start "interpreting" scriptures, they become meaningless.

Landoneous7
 
  1  
Reply Mon 5 May, 2014 04:29 pm
@maxdancona,
I tried to make it less offensive but here is the original email he sent me.

1. Murder is a sin, unless your victim is:

Correct Answer: D (Any of the above.) “If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman…they shall be put to death” (Leviticus 20:13). “One of the children of Israel came and brought unto his brethren a Midianitish woman…And when Phinehas…saw it, he rose up from among the congregation, and took a javelin in his hand…and thrust both of them through, the man of Israel, and the woman through her belly. So the plague was stayed from the children of Israel” (Numbers 25:6-8). “He slew all the house of Baasha, he left him not one that pisseth against a wall, neither of his kinsfolks, nor of his friends. Thus did Zimri destroy all the house of Baasha, according to the word of the Lord” (1 Kings 16:11-12).

2. Intolerance toward the handicapped is a sin, unless the discrimination takes the form of:

Correct Answer: D (Any of the above.) “Whosoever he be of thy seed in their generations that hath any blemish, let him not approach to offer the bread of his God. For whatsoever man he be that hath a blemish, he shall not approach: a blind man, or a lame, or he that hath a flat nose, or any thing superfluous, Or a man that is brokenfooted, or brokenhanded, Or crookbackt, or a dwarf, or that hath a blemish in his eye, or be scurvy, or scabbed, or hath his stones broken; No man that hath a blemish of the seed of Aaron the priest shall come nigh to offer the offerings of the Lord made by fire: he hath a blemish; he shall not come nigh to offer the bread of his God” (Leviticus 21:17-21). “And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Command the children of Israel, that they put out of the camp every leper, and everyone that hath an issue, and whosoever is defiled by the dead: Both male and female shall ye put out, without the camp shall ye put them; that they defile not their camps, in the midst whereof I dwell” (Numbers 5:1-3). “He that is wounded in the stones, or hath his privy member cut off, shall not enter into the congregation of the Lord” (Deuteronomy 23:1).

3. Cannibalism is a sin, unless you eat:

Correct Answer: B (Your children, infants, friends and self when God destroys everything else so these are all that are left to eat) “And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend in the siege and straitness” (Jeremiah 19:9). “And toward her young one that cometh out from between her feet, and toward her children which she shall bear: for she shall eat them for want of all things secretly in the siege and the straitness” (Deuteronomy 28:57). “Through the wrath of the Lord of hosts is the land darkened, and the people shall be as the fuel of the fire: no man shall spare his brother. And he shall snatch on the right hand, and be hungry; and he shall eat on the left hand, and they shall not be satisfied: they shall eat every man the flesh of his own arm” (Isaiah 9:19-20). “Whosoever toucheth the dead body of any man that is dead, and purifieth not himself, defileth the tabernacle of the Lord; and that soul shall be cut off from Israel: because the water of separation was not sprinkled upon him, he shall be unclean; his uncleanness is yet upon him” (Numbers 19:13).”

4. Murdering your own child is a sin, unless your child:

Correct Answer: D (Any of the above) “And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death” (Exodus 21:17). “If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy firend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods…thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die” (Deuteronomy 13:6-10). “And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved” (Matthew 10:21-22).

5. Self-mutilation is a sin, unless:

Correct Answer: A (You remove a body part that has engaged or is about to engage in sin, such as slicing off your genitals to remain a virgin) “And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell. And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee” (Matthew 5:29-30; see also Matthew 18:8-9; Mark 9:43-48). “For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother’s womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven’s sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it” (Matthew 19:12). “And no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb” (Revelation 14:3-4). “They shall not make baldness upon their head, neither shall they shave off the corner of their beard, nor make any cuttings in their flesh” (Leviticus 21:5).

6. Rape is a sin subject to the greatest of punishments, but is easily overlooked and forgiven if the victim is:

Correct Answer: D (Any of the above) “And when the Lord thy God hath delivered [a city] into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword: But the women…shalt thou take unto thyself” (Deuteronomy 20:13-14). “And whosoever lieth carnally with a woman, that is a bondmaid, betrothed to an husband, and not at all remeemed, nor freedom given her; she shall be scourged; they shall not be put to death, because she was not free. And he shall bring his trespass offering unto the Lord, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, even a ram for a trespass offering. And the priest shall make atonement for him” (Leviticus 19:20-22). “If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found: Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel’s father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife” (Deuteronomy 22:28-29).

7. Savagely beating another person with a weapon is a sin, unless you stop just before your victim dies and the victim is:

Correct Answer: C (Either of the above) “And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished. Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money” (Exodus 21:20-21). “Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell” (Proverbs 23:13-14).

8. Abandoning your family is a sin, unless

Correct Answer: D (Any of the above) “Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac…And God said unto Abraham…harken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called…And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba” (Genesis 21:10-14). “Ye shall not give your daughters unto their sons, nor take their daughters unto your sons, or for yourselves. Did not Solomon king of Israel sin by these things? yet among many nations was there no king like him, who was beloved of his God, and God made him king over all Israel: nevertheless even him did outlandish women cause to sin. Shall we then hearken unto you to do all this great evil, to transgress against our God in marrying strange wives?…Thus cleansed I them from all strangers, and appointed the wards of the priests and the Levites, every one in his business” (Nehemiah 13:25-30). “If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple” (Luke 14:26; see also Mark 10:29-30; Luke 18:29-30).

9. Homosexuality is a sin, unless:

Correct Answer: B (You’re one of God’s favorite children, and you have many wives in addition to your boyfriend) “Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination” (Leviticus 18:22). “[David said] I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women” (2 Samuel 1:26). “And as soon as the lad was gone, David arose out of a place toward the south, and fell on his face to the ground, and bowed himself three times; and they [Jonathan and David] kissed one another, and wept one with another, until David exceeded” (1 Samuel 20:41). “And [David] had seven hundred wives, princesses, and three hundred concubines: and his wives turned away his heart (1 Kings 11:3) “For this cause God gave them up into vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet” (Romans 1:26-27).

10. Killing someone is a sin unless your victim is:

Correct Answer: D (Any of the above) “Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live” (Exodus 22:18). “But those that encamp before the tabernacle toward the east, even before the tabernacle of the congregation eastward, shall be Moses, and Aaron and his sons, keeping the charge of the sanctuary for the charge of the children of Israel; and the stranger that cometh nigh shall be put to death” (Numbers 3:38). “If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour’s wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you” Deuteronomy 22:23-24).
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Mon 5 May, 2014 04:45 pm
@Landoneous7,
Your brother has a point, doesn't he? I would quibble with a few of the points he made (for instance it is not clear that David had sex with Jonathan), and I would add a few examples such as God telling Joshua to commit genocide-- including killing women and children.

The God in the Bible supports slavery, racism, the killing of children, and genocide. He opposes woman's equality and Democracy. There is no way to get around this.


ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Mon 5 May, 2014 04:49 pm
@Landoneous7,
Landoneous7 wrote:
I wish I had a response to sum of his questions.


good luck with your research.
Butrflynet
 
  2  
Reply Mon 5 May, 2014 05:12 pm
@ehBeth,
Landoneous, isn't this the job of your minister? I was under the impression that their whole purpose is to aid worshippers in understanding the bible and helping them apply it to their own lives.

Your minister is probably the best source for this.
0 Replies
 
Landoneous7
 
  0  
Reply Mon 5 May, 2014 08:34 pm
@maxdancona,
Hey Max, I'm listening man I just didn't want 2 get off topic in case somebody wanted to shine a better light on the original post. To be honest I've never read the old testament, I'm almost done with the New Testament which I can make sense out of and have found sum very deep wisdom in. I come from a spiritual seeker background and Christianity is the Newest thing I've found. The parts that they do have correct...God & Jesus Christ I've found to be the Highest POWER in all of Creation. When you Experience this Power called Faith or the Actual tangible Presence of God it is enough to make you say, "I don't care if I'm wrong about every single thing thought I've Ever had as long as I can just Experience more of THIS!" Now that being said I do not come from a Christian background and don't know the context for all of the scriptures above yet. Can you provide me with sum examples of "The God in the Bible supports 1. slavery, 2. racism, 3. the killing of children, and 4. genocide." May I also ask what your spiritual background is? It seems like you know the bible but don't agree with all of it. You also seem to be polite & intelligent so I am curious, What do you believe?


chai2
 
  1  
Reply Mon 5 May, 2014 08:39 pm
@Landoneous7,
You can't discuss being a christian unless you've also read the old testament.

Christians use the OT when it's convenient for them, and ignore it when it's not.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 May, 2014 03:28 am
Asking that question here is like going to a whore house and asking about morality.

You'll get an answer...but...
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Reply Tue 6 May, 2014 07:25 am
@Frank Apisa,
.. it'll be upsetting to the whores.
Smileyrius
 
  2  
Reply Sat 10 May, 2014 09:59 am
Whatever you seek in the bible, you will likely find.

Questions like the ones your brother has asked are important. Without knowledge, no understanding can be found, without understanding, questions will dominate your thinking. So my advice to you is to take in a broader knowledge, get a bigger picture view.

If you want the answers, study each of the passages quoted and look into the root language, a decent concordance (perhaps strongs) will help, by studying and cross referencing you will progressively understand the relationship and rulership of God over the Israelites, the meaning and execution of his law with them, what slavery was in Israelite times and and how visions recorded in scripture, if taken as literal would make for some very screwed up reading as seen above.

I wish you well my friend in your endeavors
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  2  
Reply Sun 11 May, 2014 12:24 am
@Landoneous7,
Taking only from the part about homosexuality . . .
Landoneous7 wrote:
“[David said] I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women” (2 Samuel 1:26).
The scriptures speak often of principled love, rarely, if ever, about erotic love. It should be obvious there was no sexual component to the love David had for Jonathan. Indeed, the most important form of love, the love God and Jesus have for us, is principled love.

There are too many subjects on your post for me to consider in one reply. It would take pages. But there are answers.
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  2  
Reply Sun 11 May, 2014 12:25 am
@bobsal u1553115,
Laughing Laughing
0 Replies
 
sunyata
 
  2  
Reply Sun 11 May, 2014 05:34 pm
@Landoneous7,
http://www.deadseriousnews.com/tebow-jesus-gave-me-a-donkey-punch/
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 May, 2014 05:42 pm
@sunyata,
Tebow is hardly a representative Christian.
sunyata
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 May, 2014 05:44 pm
@neologist,
no true christian fallacy
0 Replies
 
graceforall
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Aug, 2014 06:26 pm
@maxdancona,
Why do you believe God supports these things?
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Aug, 2014 06:37 pm
@graceforall,
I read the Bible.
0 Replies
 
AugustineBrother
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2016 02:46 pm
@Landoneous7,
The fact he has s0 many shows he's wrong. If he had even one drop-dead discrediting argument he would highlight that. Why don't people use guided missiles in duels ? Because you only need a gun.
0 Replies
 
anthony1312002
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2016 08:29 am
@Landoneous7,
The best approach is to remember what the Bible says at 1 Corinthians 2:13-15. The Bible approaches matters from God's point of view which is of course higher than mere human reasoning. Because most people approach the Bible from a physical (human) point of view they miss the true meaning of what the Bible teaches since these things can only be examined spiritually.

Understanding this will help prevent you from becoming frustrated when people make assertions that the God of the Bible is cruel or hypocritical.
0 Replies
 
 

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