12
   

Does an ‘individual’ word have meaning…?

 
 
layman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Dec, 2017 10:23 pm
@carpenters,
As I expected, you're hopeless.
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Dec, 2017 04:37 am
@carpenters,
Q: If a kid asks his parents how high the beanstalk that sprouted from the magic beans Jack planted was, what is the correct answer? One mile high? Almost to heaven, or what?

Chompsky: In my view, your question presupposes a false premise. I don't believe there ever was such a beanstalk.

Q: Can you prove that?

Chompsky: Look, I don't pretend to be an expert on the actual facts underlying various myths, fairy tales, fables, and such. I can't "prove" there was no beanstalk with documentary evidence or anything. I just don't believe there was a beanstalk.

Q: I see. So you're admitting that you're not an expert in the area of parental counselling, eh?

Chompsky: What?
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Dec, 2017 05:40 am
@layman,
Oh dear, If I thought you had the ability, I would suggest you researched Chomsky's distinction between 'descriptive adequacy' and 'explanatory adequacy' But since your understanding of theoretical modelling is seriously compromised by your simplistic attitude to modelling in physics, you would have even less chance in linguistics.
layman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Dec, 2017 07:08 am
@fresco,
Yeah, right, eh, Poseur?
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Dec, 2017 07:39 am
Consciousness: Where are Words?
jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Dec, 2017 11:32 am
@hightor,
If man is indeed the "crown of creation" and all functions of nature reside within man then essentially all things are part of man. Maybe it's just a matter of comprehending the relationships we have with other things that give rise to true names? And possibly comprehending the order of things might give rise to adjectives? I think this all happened a long time ago and we just live in a state of perversion now.
0 Replies
 
jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Dec, 2017 01:49 pm
@hightor,
http://i1143.photobucket.com/albums/n629/jerlands/Pyramidion.jpg
0 Replies
 
igm
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 06:00 am
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche

"Of sustained calm and profound insight, it is profound insight that is most important; but profound insight cannot arise without a preliminary calming of the mind. What is crucial here is to calm all the wild thoughts that constantly agitate, unsettle, and condition the mind, for such thoughts give rise to negative emotions which, in turn, you express as the words and actions that comprise the causes of suffering.

Calming the mind is like closing the glass of a lantern around the flame, so that it can shine brightly and steadily, protected from the wind."

jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 12:26 pm
@igm,
igm wrote:

Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche

"Of sustained calm and profound insight, it is profound insight that is most important; but profound insight cannot arise without a preliminary calming of the mind. What is crucial here is to calm all the wild thoughts that constantly agitate, unsettle, and condition the mind, for such thoughts give rise to negative emotions which, in turn, you express as the words and actions that comprise the causes of suffering.

Calming the mind is like closing the glass of a lantern around the flame, so that it can shine brightly and steadily, protected from the wind."




This is a beautiful sentiment... the way I look at it though is if your car has a flat it has to be fixed before you can carry on. I don't think man is autonomous, I think man is part of a whole and it is the whole that needs to survive. There is no calm in war... but only reflections on.
igm
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 01:13 pm
@jerlands,
jerlands wrote:

igm wrote:

Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche

"Of sustained calm and profound insight, it is profound insight that is most important; but profound insight cannot arise without a preliminary calming of the mind. What is crucial here is to calm all the wild thoughts that constantly agitate, unsettle, and condition the mind, for such thoughts give rise to negative emotions which, in turn, you express as the words and actions that comprise the causes of suffering.

Calming the mind is like closing the glass of a lantern around the flame, so that it can shine brightly and steadily, protected from the wind."



...I don't think man is autonomous, I think man is part of a whole...



I agree everything is interdependent. Unfortunately, your post as a whole, seems to me to miss the point of my post, but that is understandable.

jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 01:27 pm
@igm,
igm wrote:

jerlands wrote:

igm wrote:

Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche

"Of sustained calm and profound insight, it is profound insight that is most important; but profound insight cannot arise without a preliminary calming of the mind. What is crucial here is to calm all the wild thoughts that constantly agitate, unsettle, and condition the mind, for such thoughts give rise to negative emotions which, in turn, you express as the words and actions that comprise the causes of suffering.

Calming the mind is like closing the glass of a lantern around the flame, so that it can shine brightly and steadily, protected from the wind."



...I don't think man is autonomous, I think man is part of a whole...



I agree everything is interdependent. Unfortunately, your post as a whole, seems to me to miss the point of my post, but that is understandable.




What? heal yourself and heal the world?
0 Replies
 
jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 01:35 pm
@igm,
Words in and of themselves are active things.
igm
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 02:57 pm
@jerlands,
jerlands wrote:
Words in and of themselves are active things.

The OP is, "Does an ‘individual’ word have meaning…?"

A word without a referent is a meaningless sound. The interdependence of the sound and the referent gives meaning to the sound, which is called by the name 'word'. Therefore an individual word isolated from its referent is meaningless.

A word, in its attempt to describe, fails, because it is not the referent. Reality can never be describe using words because it is 'not' reality, just an attempt to describe it, which must always fail.

Reality experienced directly is where wise, intelligent thoughts, words and actions arise from, full of compassion, used only to point either directly or indirectly at how to experience the true nature of reality directly. The experience of which is ineffable but conventionally it is called non-dual happiness.

jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 03:05 pm
@igm,
igm wrote:

jerlands wrote:
Words in and of themselves are active things.


The OP is, "Does an ‘individual’ word have meaning…?"

A word without a referent is a meaningless sound. The interdependence of the sound and the referent gives meaning to the sound, which is called by the name 'word'. Therefore an individual word isolated from its referent is meaningless.

A word, in its attempt to describe, fails, because it is not the referent. Reality can never be describe using words because it is 'not' reality, just an attempt to describe it, which must always fail.

Reality experienced directly is where wise, intelligent thoughts, words and actions arise from, full of compassion, used only to point either directly or indirectly at how to experience the true nature of reality directly. The experience of which is ineffable but conventionally it is called non-dual happiness.




Breath, expansion and contraction results in an exchange. Non-Duality does not exist as long as you're breathing. The universe breaths. We only are able to enter into temporal bliss.
0 Replies
 
jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 03:09 pm
@igm,
Is there any reason we keep coming down to earth? Why don't we just fly away?
0 Replies
 
jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 03:14 pm
@igm,
igm wrote:

jerlands wrote:
Words in and of themselves are active things.

A word without a referent is a meaningless sound. The interdependence of the sound and the referent gives meaning to the sound, which is called by the name 'word'. Therefore an individual word isolated from its referent is meaningless.

That is quite apparent. A bird isn't a bird unless it's considered in reference to something else. If you put everything together would it give a sound? Is so then that sound would contain the meaning of everything.
igm
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 03:26 pm
@jerlands,
jerlands wrote:

igm wrote:

jerlands wrote:
Words in and of themselves are active things.

A word without a referent is a meaningless sound. The interdependence of the sound and the referent gives meaning to the sound, which is called by the name 'word'. Therefore an individual word isolated from its referent is meaningless.

That is quite apparent. A bird isn't a bird unless it's considered in reference to something else. If you put everything together would it give a sound? If so then that sound would contain the meaning of everything.

As long as that sound isn't described using a word or words.

jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 03:32 pm
@igm,
igm wrote:

jerlands wrote:

igm wrote:

jerlands wrote:
Words in and of themselves are active things.

A word without a referent is a meaningless sound. The interdependence of the sound and the referent gives meaning to the sound, which is called by the name 'word'. Therefore an individual word isolated from its referent is meaningless.

That is quite apparent. A bird isn't a bird unless it's considered in reference to something else. If you put everything together would it give a sound? If so then that sound would contain the meaning of everything.

As long that sound isn't described using a word or words.




Here we go again... sounds are associated into words. words are parts of sound.
jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 03:40 pm
@igm,
igm wrote:

As long as that sound isn't described using a word or words.


It's said man isn't capable of containing the entire word.
0 Replies
 
jerlands
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2018 03:44 pm
@igm,
What are we talking about here? The written word or the oral word?
0 Replies
 
 

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