Actually the roots of 5th Nov stretch way back before the Gunpowder plot. There was a Pagan tradition after the Autumn Equinox, to light bonfires in order to feed the weakening Sun. This tradition was hijacked by the Government to make it about the Gunpowder plot, in the same way the Christians hijacked the Saturnalia to give us Christmas.
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IRFRANK
2
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Mon 9 Jul, 2012 07:12 am
@aidan,
Quote:
I think people love their countries and want to defend them and the way of life they experience there because, as with families, it is what they are most familiar with and most people find familiarity comforting and worth defending and preserving.
We are naturally pack animals. It's in our nature, for survival. It can serve us by providing strength and safety of numbers. It can also provide a vehicle to do great harm, justifiy acts we would never do as individuals. Numerous examples are easily found. Like most things there are two aspects. Benefits and costs.
If there is a moral it's be careful about who you follow.
Usually the group is founded for justifiable reasons; survival, quality of life improvement. Then the power is found and abused. We become the aggressor instead of the defender. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
Well yeah- it goes without saying that that certainly can and does happen, but I was just explaining why I wasn't all worried about Gracie expressing her love of her home - I understand it.
I also understand why Irish people love Ireland and why English people love England. I understand why Welsh people love Wales and Scottish people love Scotland.
I wasn't trying to tackle the philosophical and/or clannish motives behind imperialism. And I don't think Gracie was either.
Still listening to Bruce Springsteen. Somewhere on this thread, pages back, Farmerman said he was one of the chroniclers of our age - I agree. Here's one off his new album that says alot about America right now - and no it's not all good - but it celebrates what it has been and could be again someday if we listened to the gospel of Bruce- he's not giving up on it and I think that's what Gracie is saying - neither has she:
One
One
One, two, three, four
Great morning light splits through the chain
Another day older and closer to the grave
I'm closer to the grave and come the dawn
I woke this morning shackled and drawn
Shackled and drawn, shackled and drawn
Pick up the rock, son, and carry it on
Trudging through the dark in a world gone wrong
Woke up this morning shackled and drawn
I always love the feel of sweat on my shirt
Stand back, son, and let a man work
Let a man work, is that so wrong
I woke up this morning shackled and drawn
Shackled and drawn, shackled and drawn
Pick up the rock, son, and carry it on
What's a poor boy to do in a world gone wrong
Woke up this morning shackled and drawn
Freedom, son, is a dirty shirt
The sun on my face and my shovel in the dirt
The shovel in the dirt keeps the devil gone
I woke up this morning shackled and drawn
Shackled and drawn, shackled and drawn
Pick up the rock, son, and carry it on
What's a poor boy to do but keep singing this song
I woke up this morning shackled and drawn
Gambling man rolls the dice, working man pays the bills
It's still fat and easy up on bankers hill
Up on bankers hill the party's going strong
Down here below we're shackled and drawn
Shackled and drawn, shackled and drawn
Pick up the rock, son, and carry it on
Trudging through the dark in a world gone wrong
Woke up this morning shackled and drawn
Shackled and drawn, shackled and drawn
Pick up the rock, son, and carry it on
What's a poor boy to do but keep singing this song
I woke up this morning shackled and drawn
