After life (soul), does it exist, is it real.

@beyondme,

beyondme wrote:

I have had 2 experiences that could be viewed as life outside th body. The first time was when |I was about 32. I was a drug addict on the street in terrible physical emotional shape. I had been awake fro 4 daqys I think and I had taken just over 1/2 gram of heroin. My plan was to die because of my miserable life. The second last thing I remember was in an alleyway having just taken the down intervenously. The next time I was in St. pauls hospital looking down at myself from what seemed close to the ceiling. I remember thinking that I was finshed this journey on earth and I felt so at peace. It wasn't like a feeling, more just a sense of a journey over. I saw 3 nurses and a Doctor working on my body. I can't remember what they said just they were frantic. What seemed like a long time and suddenly I felt my body again and great pain. I in that momment had no fear of death and suddenly realized thjat we do go beyond. I didn't see any flashing lights, no ghostly apperations or nothing like that. But I do believe I was in that momment beyond this human experience. And another experience that was more haunting

Thank u. WHICH experience was "more haunting" ??

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@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

Cyracuz wrote:
There is no factual answer to your question in the headline.
OmSigDAVID wrote:
Whatever the actual extant state of affairs is,
is the "factual answer."

Cyracuz wrote:
A common assumption among those who reject ideas of afterlife and gods is that
those dreams are merely memories happening
in your subconscious while you sleep.
Those who want to believe in a life after death often read more into such dreams.
Either way, dreaming of someone you've lost can be a powerful emotional impact,
and if you miss those people, it can be a welcome and comforting experience.
In my experience, dreams, especially powerful dreams that linger after waking,
are usually my own subconscious trying to tell me something.
If I have a problem in life that I either ignore or don't know how to deal with,
I've sometimes experienced that seemingly unrelated dreams put me
in a mind frame where I can relate to and resolve these issues easier. Might be coincidental, though.
I do not know. All I know is that I like dreams and dreaming. ["Life is but a dream. Its what u make it."]
OmSigDAVID wrote:
All of MY out-of-body experiences have been in a state of wakefullness,
most of them on-the-job in court, while actively engaged
in taking testimony from witnesses, not sleeping.

David

Rickoshay75 wrote:
Or they could be an hallucinations -- depending on the emotion of the situation.
Only my second OOBE occurred in emotional circumstances.
The others occurred in tranquility.
In OOBE, I was alone, about to bite into
my lunch in a Friendly Ice Cream Restaurant.

Rickoshay75 wrote:
MY OOB experience could have been one too

There have been OOBEs that resulted from temporary death
of the human body, during surgery, when the decedent's consciousness
went out into the waiting room and saw his family there,
one of whose members was bad-mouthing decedent.
Accordingly, after he returned to human life,
the ex-decedent sought out his estate lawyer
and he disinherited the defaming relative.
Does that have a bearing upon the question
of hallucinations? or is all existence itself
a hallucination ?

To me, the only real experience is what I can detect with one or more of my senses. Everything else is either an allusion or hallucination

Logistics – one step at a time toward an unpredictable future

2 Replies

@Rickoshay75,

" Is all that we see, and seem,
but a dream within a dream ? " Ed. A. Poe

1 Reply

@Rickoshay75,

Quote:

To me, the only real experience is what I can detect with one or more of my senses. Everything else is either an allusion or hallucination

Question, Rick: You KNOW that what you detect with one or more of your senses is NOT an (I think you meant) illusion or hallucination...

...how???

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Exactly, David. Second time I agreed with what you wrote in this thread.

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@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

Quote:
To me, the only real experience is what I can detect with one or more of my senses. Everything else is either an allusion or hallucination

Question, Rick: You KNOW that what you detect with one or more of your senses is NOT an (I think you meant) illusion or hallucination...

...how???

By pinching myself to see if I'm awake, alert.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fate leads him who follows it, drags him who resist. Plutarch

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@Rickoshay75,

Rickoshay75 wrote:

By pinching myself to see if I'm awake, alert.

R u able to dream that u r awake & alert
and to BELIEVE it ??

What u believe is true to U
for so long as u believe it.

David

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@Rickoshay75,

Quote:

By pinching myself to see if I'm awake, alert.

But how do you KNOW it is not all an illusion?

(In the good spirit of Thanksgiving, allow me to give you a hint: You do not know.)

Now, I'd appreciate an answer to my question...(using the hint, in you choose.)

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

Quote:

By pinching myself to see if I'm awake, alert.

But how do you KNOW it is not all an illusion?

(In the good spirit of Thanksgiving, allow me to give you a hint: You do not know.)

Now, I'd appreciate an answer to my question...(using the hint, in you choose.)

As I said, things not real are illusions, and as one who lives in the real world, it's easy to tell the difference.

1 Reply

@Rickoshay75,

Quote:

As I said, things not real are illusions, and as one who lives in the real world, it's easy to tell the difference.

And you are sure the "real world" is not an illusion....how?

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

Quote:
As I said, things not real are illusions, and as one who lives in the real world, it's easy to tell the difference.

And you are sure the "real world" is not an illusion....how?

Why am I so sure -- because I say so!!

As an engineer I designed things that worked, real solutions to real physical problems, the proof they were real was they were material, could be physically demonstrated -- illusions can't be physically demonstrated so they only exist as shadows in the mind.

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@Rickoshay75,

Of course illusions are real...how could they be real illusions otherwise ? Mr. Green

...as for the remaining well you will have a problem with virtual reality pretty soon ! Wink

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@Rickoshay75,

Quote:

Quote:
Re: Frank Apisa (Post 5175156)
Frank Apisa wrote:

Quote:
As I said, things not real are illusions, and as one who lives in the real world, it's easy to tell the difference.

And you are sure the "real world" is not an illusion....how?

Why am I so sure -- because I say so!!

As an engineer I designed things that worked, real solutions to real physical problems, the proof they were real was they were material, could be physically demonstrated -- illusions can't be physically demonstrated so they only exist as shadows in the mind.

I see.

So you are the one person on the planet who can never be delusional...you can never mistakenly think something.

Glad to meet you.

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@Rickoshay75,

Rickoshay75 wrote:

Why am I so sure -- because I say so!!

As an engineer I designed things that worked, real solutions to real physical problems,
the proof they were real was they were material, could be physically demonstrated -- illusions can't
be physically demonstrated so they only exist as shadows in the mind.

R u able to sleep and dream
that u r an engineer who designs things that work
and dream that thay r "material"??

Do u allege that dreams (or other illusions)
CANNOT be convincing ?

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Over the past years scientists have devoted much study to the mysterious world of dreams. With the aid of volunteers in specially equipped “dream labs” some interesting facts have come to light.
Scientists have noted, for instance, that a sleeping person experiences rapid eye movements (REM) about once every ninety to a hundred minutes through the night. These REM periods, which suggest that a person is dreaming, may last from ten minutes to half an hour and recur three or four times a night.

Some, however, have reported dreams that they believe are “supernatural” in origin.
Such experiences have led many to become fascinated with dreams, feeling that they may come from God and hold the key to important future events in their lives. They note, for instance, that on a number of occasions God imparted vital information, even long-range prophecies, to people by means of dreams.

It is important to note, though, that with the completion of the Bible canon by the end of the first century C.E., God made available a complete inspired record in written form for the guidance of mankind. After that there was no need for God to communicate with man in dreams, or in any other miraculous way. As to “spiritual gifts,” including supernatural “prophesying,” the Bible shows that these were not to be permanent, but were to be “done away with.”—1 Cor. 12:1; 13:8-10.

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@Rickoshay75,

I think eternity does, whatever happens, awareness moves on, it is the state of environmental calm which gently hides the totality of all truths from people, though one must be free of certain factors present beyond the general state of normalcy which surrounds everyone usually, to grasp what they really preferred to avoid, despite its clear benefit to them with regards their questions.

At death as 'self' incinerated.
A dream state or not, you will have a dream eventually, unless entirely alone and solely reason of self, then you will generate a dream, though others will move you along, in their simple ways, thinking you are not aware before that. (which cannot often happen on earth) even after energy level dispersal, only 0.00000~% of 'you' will find that is the case and not for eternity... So at worst it is akin to having an exceptionally powerful thought which leaves you emptier than you were for the pure EM release at your brain extremus.

That calmer and less busy minds exist out there. Proves a small center of you can be redeployed, though the benefits of that are debatable, if one can will into being ones own self assertions.

Contrary to popular belief, God dislikes fear as much a scientific pondering.. which leaves only the bold, who grow absent of enemy and become equally as hated. So unfortunately, the way of it is often that dreamers, get attacked in huge numbers, hence we gave them the wickerman, please ignore our plight. Though bear in mind, they build boys who are really girls inside etc at our request for their 'pump fest' this is not a fairy tale.

1 Reply

@nothingtodo,

If all went well, your wool fudged 20% of that.

I refuse to explain what causes the attack, you need not that one.

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@Rickoshay75,

Latest theories about black holes state information sucked into them isn't destroyed. So why would mere death of an organism be more destructive than a black hole?

Everything's information. You, me, tables, and chairs, it's all 'information.' But in the same way we can recycle a newspaper to make another newspaper, or roll of toilet paper and other paper-based products, just because the newspaper ceases to exist doesn't mean the information does. For the same reason, what makes a person an individual is happening in our brain. Information (in the more usual sense) is being encoded on brain cells called neurons. When the organism dies those encoded neurons still exist along with the information contained in them. As the body decomposes, the 'meat' breaks down but the atoms which comprise them don't blink out of existence or otherwise cease to exist. And the information remains as well.

What I personally believe is we're going to discover what some might call a soul but not in the usual religious sense. A kind of continuation of a different sort of consciousness than we're used to begins when our bodies die. But everything that made us individuals remains along with it. No heaven or hell or God, but a kind of existence after this one.

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@Rickoshay75,

First, let me say how sorry I am for the loss of those you love. Death is truly or enemy and not a friend. But to your question, it is true that many have had similar dreams regarding those they have lost, but in this the Bible can help us. For example, it can help us understand what God says the condtion of a person is when they die. At Ecclesiastes chapter 9 and verses 5 & 10 it shows that when a person dies they are conscious of nothing. Psalm 146 and vers 4 shows that even the thought process of the person stops. Thus they enter into a state of complete inactivity, as though in a deep sleep.

When Jesus was on the earth he confirmed this just before he resurrected or woke Lazarus from the sleep of death. Read the account at John 11:11-14. In this account Jesus clearly compares Lazarus' death to his being sleep. How comforting to know that our loved ones are only sleeping and not somewhere worrying about us becaue they may see us suffering their loss or in some other distress. And how wonderful to know that just as Jesus woke Lazarus from his sleep, Jesus will awaken our loved ones as John 5:28, 29 and Acts 42:15 show. There is going to be a resurrection.

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@Krumple,

yes 100% . There is no heaven or hell so to speak... When you die you leave your physical body however your "soul" lives on. There is a process that happens when we die where you do go to talk about your life here on earth. The Spirit World is where souls go regardless of how you lived your life hear or how you died. I will not get into the evil people that do bad things here or the people that do great here at this time. But we do experience our afterlife differently according to the life we lived here, and we get many chances for do-overs until we get it right IF we want. This has all been verified for years through hypnosis for past life regression. I actually have studied this for a long time. Have many books I could recommend for the believers and non.

1 Reply

After life (soul), does it exist, is it real.

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