43
   

Are atheists being more illogical than agnostics?

 
 
failures art
 
  1  
Wed 10 Aug, 2011 02:12 am
Doesn't the OP question assume too much? Why are atheist and agnostic mutually exclusive?

I think they fundamentally address two separate questions. One is of knowledge ("gnosis" vis a vis agnostic), and the other addresses a belief.

Agnostic is not some middle point between theist and atheist.

A
R
T
igm
 
  1  
Wed 10 Aug, 2011 04:16 am
@failures art,
failures art wrote:

Doesn't the OP question assume too much? Why are atheist and agnostic mutually exclusive?

I think they fundamentally address two separate questions. One is of knowledge ("gnosis" vis a vis agnostic), and the other addresses a belief.

Agnostic is not some middle point between theist and atheist.

A
R
T

I now agree and probably set the question to find out what others' believed and why... to some extent (see previous posts). Smile
0 Replies
 
Dan Samba
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 11:35 am
@igm,
Agnosticism is the ONLY logical stance on theism. Since the god provoking people of the world have NO proof but a contradictory fairy tale book in which is offered a "demandment" "thou shalt not kill" and then "god" kills everyone on earth except Noah and friends! Trust god after mass murdering? OK then I can not accept atheism either because if your are LOGICAL you are aware that it is IMPOSSIBLE to prove a "negative", such as "there is NOT a god" Well to prove this you must go throughout the infinite universe and time and not find god! So either way you feel is completely illogical! Be Agonistic or be stupid, it is your choice!
igm
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 02:27 pm
@Dan Samba,
Dan Samba wrote:

Agnosticism is the ONLY logical stance on theism. Since the god provoking people of the world have NO proof but a contradictory fairy tale book in which is offered a "demandment" "thou shalt not kill" and then "god" kills everyone on earth except Noah and friends! Trust god after mass murdering? OK then I can not accept atheism either because if your are LOGICAL you are aware that it is IMPOSSIBLE to prove a "negative", such as "there is NOT a god" Well to prove this you must go throughout the infinite universe and time and not find god! So either way you feel is completely illogical! Be Agonistic or be stupid, it is your choice!


Who needs to prove there is not a God? Just let go... that is where happiness can be found... it's not found by holding onto useless concepts.

rhymer
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 05:34 pm
@igm,
I know that Gods and Goddesses exist as human concepts.
I do not believe that any God or Goddess has ever existed, or ever will.
It is for each individual to be respected for their own beliefs.

According to wikidotanswersdotcom there are at least 330million Gods and Goddesses in the world (excluding the first two thousand years since man has been writing).
How does one choose the 'right' deity?
Most of the time it is by accepting ones parents belief.
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  0  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 05:39 pm
Quote:
Rhymer said: According to wikidotanswersdotcom there are at least 330million Gods and Goddesses in the world (excluding the first two thousand years since man has been writing).
How does one choose the 'right' deity?

Here's a clue..Smile-

Christianity has Jesus the Son of God himself as its central core.
Islam - doesn't
Judaism - doesn't
Sikhism - doesn't
Buddhism - doesn't
Hinduism - doesn't
Spiritism - doesn't
Bahai - doesn't
Jainism - doesn't
Shinto - doesn't
Taoism - doesn't
Zoroastanism - doesn't
Paganism - doesn't
Rastafarianism - doesn't
Scientology - doesn't
Chinese traditional - doesn't
African tribal - doesn't
Cao Dai - doesn't
Tenrikyo - doesn't
New Age - doesn't
Unitarian - doesn't
Native American - doesn't
Fairy-worshipping cults, atheism, agnosticism etc - don't
0 Replies
 
tenderfoot
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 06:20 pm
@Setanta,
I always think of the old saying.... "Give me the child till it's ten" I then let my imagination try to conger up what those 10 years of teaching can accomplish.
Setanta
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 07:18 pm
@tenderfoot,
Indoctrination.
0 Replies
 
carnaticmystery
 
  1  
Thu 28 Nov, 2013 01:26 am
@igm,
every conceivable 'position' with regard to religion, reality, life or any other human concept, is necessarily limited and based on false assumptions.

i agree with you that an agnostic is more logical than a theist or atheist. but being agnostic is limited in logic also, because it implies that you still consider the possibility of a god. this means you are still a slave to the concept of god vs no god, maintaining an 'i don't know' position. this implies there is a possible resolution to the question.

non-duality offers a resolution to the question, as a paradoxical truth that everything that exists is all one thing, and because of this, it is itself not necessarily 'absolutely existent'. therefore the question of the absolute existence of anything, whether it is god or the material universe or consciousness, does not arise anymore, because the very questioner does not absolutely exist anymore.

however, clinging to the concept of non duality as the ultimate solution to the question of god vs atheism vs agnosticism is also another illusion, because what non duality points to is an eternal nothingness, which cannot actually resolve any finite human problems.
0 Replies
 
igm
 
  1  
Thu 28 Nov, 2013 06:00 am
@igm,
igm wrote:

Who needs to prove there is not a God? Just let go... that is where happiness can be found... it's not found by holding onto useless concepts.

To be clear I am an atheist... I can see how some could interpret my previous quote (see above) to mean something other than I intended... to me, God is a useless concept.

Also, the OP was a question and not my view... after discussing it with others (over nine pages and back in 2011), I concluded that if I had to be labelled an atheist or an agnostic then I would call myself an atheist.
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  -2  
Thu 28 Nov, 2013 08:34 pm
A bunch of atheists fronted by Dawkins (naturally) paid 150,000 GB pounds (245,000 USdollars) to have these adverts splashed on Brit buses, but nobody (including me) can figure out WHY?
Are they saying they don't enjoy their life and that they worry? Worry about what?
And they say "there's probably no God", which means they're not sure!
"Probably" is not a very scientific word anyway, does it mean 10% or 25% or 75% or what?

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/atheistbus.gif
igm
 
  2  
Fri 29 Nov, 2013 01:17 am
@Romeo Fabulini,
You do repeat yourself; have you run out of original things to say or is each thread treated to the same posts? Just an observation...
0 Replies
 
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Fri 29 Nov, 2013 04:54 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
I don't like Richard Dwakins, I think he made a poor job defending atheism against William Lane Craig, and frankly Atheism deserved better leadership...that all said and nonetheless, I don't see what is it that you don't understand. Is it that 150.000 GB pounds is not much to educate people in need of education ? Or is it that probably means a strong possibility that God, as described in classical terms, is not the case ?
Or finally why do you think I need to be sure of something to take action ? It seams to me having good reason needs nothing else then good probability to be justified.
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  -1  
Fri 29 Nov, 2013 06:32 pm
Dawkins and his atheist chums say "There's probably no God".
That's like a russian roulette player saying "There's probably no bullet in the chamber when i pull the trigger"..Smile
http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/9595/tfa5.jpg
fresco
 
  1  
Sat 30 Nov, 2013 02:29 am
@Romeo Fabulini,
No its not ! Its like saying aspiring Russian Roulette participants are almost certainly playing with toy guns. And atheists are too mature to play games !
0 Replies
 
JLNobody
 
  1  
Sat 30 Nov, 2013 12:17 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
I'm an atheist not because I believe there probably is no God; I'm neither a theist nor an agnostic because the (fundamentalist) notion of God makes no sense to me.
timur
 
  1  
Sat 30 Nov, 2013 12:20 pm
@JLNobody,
I'm an atheist because I've neither need nor use for a god.
JLNobody
 
  1  
Sat 30 Nov, 2013 03:03 pm
@timur,
O.K., add that to my list of justifications.
And more and more I feel content with life on its own terms.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Sat 30 Nov, 2013 03:22 pm
I am an atheist because I am hardwired that way. But I like to think I would change my mind if any evidence at all to the contrary surfaces.
JLNobody
 
  1  
Sat 30 Nov, 2013 06:58 pm
@edgarblythe,
Yes, Edgar: to say that you are "hardwired" to be an atheist because of the absence of evidence is to indicate also that you are "hardwired" to be a theist in the face of good evidence.
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.72 seconds on 12/22/2024 at 04:51:27