Are atheists being more illogical than agnostics?

@Frank Apisa,

You're kinda funny in your hyperbolic way...

I use the classic definition of truth: a correct (true) representation of what is the case.

2 Replies

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

I use the classic definition of truth: a correct (true) representation of what is the case.

So you define truth by what is true.
OK!

2 Replies

@neologist,

To me truth is a representation of reality that is faithful to it. It is not the same thing as reality.

Thus, if there existed no sentient being, the concept of truth would have no meaning. In fact, no concept would even exist, truth included.

How do YOU define "truth"?

0 Replies

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

You're kinda funny in your hyperbolic way...

I use the classic definition of truth: a correct (true) representation of what is the case.

If it means that much to you not to acknowledge you were wrong that you are actually willing to go through what you are going through, Olivier...

...you really should not be discussing nor debating on the Internet...

...or anywhere else for that matter.

1 Reply

@neologist,

If the comment “There is no Universal Truth” were true…(it is not!)…then it would itself be a universal truth.

But it cannot be; it contradicts itself.

Olivier seems unable to acknowledge this…and will play word games for as long as is necessary to dodge that responsibility.

Unfortunately, it appears he does not have the ethical wherewithal to engage in a discussion of this sort in a reasonable, logical way.

The last thing in the world he should be treating…is TRUTH.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

…and will play word games for as long as is necessary to dodge that responsibility.

Ah-hahahahahahahahahaha . . . oh the irony . . .

You can't beat this place for unintentional comedy.

1 Reply

@Setanta,

Setanta wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
…and will play word games for as long as is necessary to dodge that responsibility.

Ah-hahahahahahahahahaha . . . oh the irony . . .

You can't beat this place for unintentional comedy.

I thought that same thing when I read your comment, Setanta.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

I'm sure you did . . . however, whenever you use the verb "to think," i get another dose of hilarity.

1 Reply

@Setanta,

Setanta wrote:

I'm sure you did . . . however, whenever you use the verb "to think," i get another dose of hilarity.

So you want to start up again, huh. Great! Helps make the day pass with lots of fun. Wink

I'm sure you get a dose of many things, Setanta.

In any case, it makes as much sense for me to be bothered by you questioning my ability to think...

...as it would for me to be bothered by you questioning my ability to stay slim and fit.

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk17/frankapisa/Jabba_zps78fce165.jpg

Know what I mean?

Ball in your court.

0 Replies

No, the ball is out, rolling down the street. Go out in the traffic and see if you can catch it Frank. It's easy to see when your feeble imagination fails you--you default to personal insult. That's because you lack intelligence and finesse.

1 Reply

@Setanta,

Setanta wrote:

No, the ball is out, rolling down the street. Go out in the traffic and see if you can catch it Frank. It's easy to see when your feeble imagination fails you--you default to personal insult. That's because you lack intelligence and finesse.

Oh, so you think the fact that I am saying you are morbidly obese; ugly as sin; and have the personality of a rabid badger are personal insults.

I see.

I understand you smell bad...and have lots of pimples also.

Would it be a personal insult if I mentioned that?

How's that for intelligence and finesse??? Wink

0 Replies

@Frank Apisa,

I think you shouldn't be debating on the Internet Frank, because you are not smart enough to understand that you are wrong, and even if you were smart enough for that, you wouldn't be honest enough to acknowledge it.

The map is not the territory, Frank. Truth is not the same thing as reality. Truth implies a representation of reality that accords well to it.

Truth - noun, plural truths [troothz, trooths]

1. the true or actual state of a matter: He tried to find out the truth.

2. conformity with fact or reality; verity: the truth of a statement.

3. a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like: mathematical truths.

2 Replies

@Olivier5,

I wouldn't bother with definitions for Frank.

He thinks that the world has to bend to his homemade definitions.

1 Reply

@JimmyJ,

You're right, but to state the obvious, any productive conversation between several persons implies agreeing somewhat on the meaning of the words used in the conversation. I don't use a bizarre or far fetched definition of "truth", just the common-sensical one. Frank is welcome to invent his own language but at the very least he should explain what he means by "truth" and "ultimate truth", as I have done up-thread.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

I think you shouldn't be debating on the Internet Frank, because you are not smart enough to understand that you are wrong, and even if you were smart enough for that, you wouldn't be honest enough to acknowledge it.

The map is not the territory, Frank. Truth is not the same thing as reality. Truth implies a representation of reality that accords well to it.

Truth - noun, plural truths [troothz, trooths]

1. the true or actual state of a matter: He tried to find out the truth.

2. conformity with fact or reality; verity: the truth of a statement.

3. a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like: mathematical truths.

Nice evasion, Olivier.

I don't blame you. Obviously acknowledging that you are wrong would unbalance you...so the only way to deal with being wrong is the way you have...to evade.

By the way, I am more than intelligent enough for this kind of thing.

0 Replies

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

You're right, but to state the obvious, any productive conversation between several persons implies agreeing somewhat on the meaning of the words used in the conversation. I don't use a bizarre or far fetched definition of "truth", just the common-sensical one. Frank is welcome to invent his own language but at the very least he should explain what he means by "truth" and "ultimate truth", as I have done up-thread.

I am still waiting for you to create a scenario in which there is no Ultimate Truth. You cannot do it...because there is an Ultimate Truth...and that Ultimate Truth is the REALITY...it IS what IS.

2 Replies

@Frank Apisa,

Stop putting oil on your head. It's too damn shiny.

1 Reply

@JimmyJ,

JimmyJ wrote:

Stop putting oil on your head. It's too damn shiny.

Nice try!

http://www.smiley-lol.com/smiley/humour-blague/clown-jonglerie/clown.gif

0 Replies

@Frank Apisa,

You are the one evading the question.

Define "Ultimate Truth"!!!

And "Truth" also, once you're at it...

You can't get what you want till you know what you want...

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

You are the one evading the question.

Define "Ultimate Truth"!!!

And "Truth" also, once you're at it...

You can't get what you want till you know what you want...

No, Olivier...it is you who are evading the question.

I've asked you to produce a scenario in which there is no Universal Truth...as you suggested in the assertion that started this diversion discussion.

I'll even use your first definition:

Truth: 1. the true or actual state of a matter: He tried to find out the truth.

It is the actual state of a matter.

The Ultimate Truth is the actual state of ALL THAT IS. That is why I said I prefer to use the term Ultimate REALITY.

Now...give me an actual scenario where that does not exist.

Make one up.

Give it a shot rather than trying to evade it, Olivier...and then accusing me of doing the evading.

Or finally be man enough to acknowledge that you were wrong~!

1 Reply

Are atheists being more illogical than agnostics?

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know