Reply Thu 14 Jul, 2011 08:42 am
A recent (though not new) take on an old issue: whether or not postseason stats should count toward athletes' career totals.

Career Totals: Why not count postseason?
Steve Aschburner

Quote:
In reaching the big, round hits’ threshold that historically conveys Hall of Fame status on all who cross it (except, y’know, Pete Rose), Jeter — like the 27 men who preceded him — actually amassed 3,000 hits in regular-season games. Nothing else counted. Not spring training or minor league games, naturally, and not MLB postseason games either.

Which prompted more than a few folks to ask: Why? Why shouldn’t hits that Jeter stroked in Yankees’ postseason games — in the various levels of American League playoffs and in the World Series — count toward his lifetime total?


Quote:
The standard objection to counting postseason stats with those compiled in the regular season is, hey, those playoff and World Series games are bonus opportunities that other players do not get. To which a legitimate response would seem to be: Whose fault is that? Players, working together on a team, earn those postseason games. Some might argue that players on playoff-bound teams sacrifice more, and actually get fewer opportunities to attend to individual achievements, than somebody playing out the final 70 games each season in the second division.

Mix in all the other differences among players — date of career debut, time stuck backing up a star teammate, total seasons played, injuries — and it seems arbitrary to make postseason accomplishments off-limits from career totals (or to relegate them to a separate category).


(Here's an amusing factoid: if we counted postseason stats, then Jeter's 3,000th MLB hit came on 12 June 2010... and it was also a home run.)

Quote:
It might be helpful or at least interesting for people to know that Michael Jordan didn’t just outscore Wilt Chamberlain by 873 points — he outscored The Dipper by 3,253 points because Jordan, with 5,987 postseason points, ranked No. 1 in that category to Wilt’s No. 15 (3,607).

Or that Boston’s John Havlicek jumps four spots, from No. 15 in regular-season points (26,395) to No. 11 in combined points (30,171), if he’s given credit for his playoff production for the Celtics. Oh, but he got way more chances than players stuck in Detroit or Cincinnati. OK, but Havlicek — or somebody else on his team — might not have had the green lights that Dave Bing or Oscar Robertson had.

If we kept and ranked according to total points, nothing would change at the top except the enormous numbers: Kareem Abdul-Jabbar’s 5,762 playoff points would push his lifetime total from 38,387 to 44,149. Karl Malone (41,689) would join him as the only two members of the NBA’s 40K Club.

But Shaquille O’Neal (33,846) and Kobe Bryant (33,148) both would leapfrog over Moses Malone (31,793) into the sixth and seventh spots — and Malone gets credit for his points scored in the ABA. Hakeem Olajuwon would pass both Elvin Hayes and Dan Issel. And Jerry West would leap from No. 19 on the scoring list, regular-season points, to No. 12 (25,192 plus 4,457).
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Region Philbis
 
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Reply Thu 14 Jul, 2011 09:27 am
@Shapeless,

playoff stats should definitely count since they are accrued in meaningful, high-stakes games...
Shapeless
 
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Reply Thu 14 Jul, 2011 01:52 pm
On a whim I looked up the all-time MLB playoff stats and was mildly surprised to learn how much Jeter dominates most of the categories:

- 1st in games played (147), at-bats (599), and plate appearances (679)
- 1st in runs scored (101)
- 1st in hits (185)
- 1st in total bases (283)
- 1st in singles (131)
- 1st in doubles (30)
- tied for 2nd (along with eight others) for triples (4)
- 3rd in home runs (20)
- 4th in RBIs (57)
- 6th in walks (63)
- 6th in stolen bases (17)


Jeter is also 1st in playoff strikeouts.
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Jul, 2011 04:16 pm
@Shapeless,
There's a reason for that: Jeter has played more postseason games than anyone else. Jeter has played 147 postseason games. In contrast, Yogi Berra played in only 75. But Berra played in the world series exclusively (by comparison, Jeter has played in 38 WS games -- Babe Ruth played in 41). There weren't three rounds of playoffs when Berra was playing. So Jeter's postseason stats are inflated because the postseason itself has been inflated.
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joefromchicago
 
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Reply Thu 14 Jul, 2011 04:17 pm
@Region Philbis,
Region Philbis wrote:


playoff stats should definitely count since they are accrued in meaningful, high-stakes games...

They do count. They just count in a separate category.
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