19
   

Did Waterboarding lead to the death of Osama?

 
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 02:15 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
It's just the sort of high minded thinking that leads you to find it amusing to burn someone in effigy.


Or the high minded thinking of a people who celebrate the illegal assassination of one of their close friends.
raprap
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 02:27 pm
@izzythepush,
As long as she didn't talk I'd do her.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 02:47 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Anyway, poor old Guido Fawkes has paid his due, he was tortured, and narrowly avoided being hung drawn and quarted by jumping from the scaffold and breaking his back. His effigy has been burned on a bonfire every 5th November, as is our tradition. (I understand you get up to some pretty freaky things at Halloween) Time to give the poor chap a break, burn a Palin, it's a lot more fun. And also a lot more pertinent. She's a greater threat to democracy than Guy Fawkes ever was. If she ever becomes president I think we should disband Nato and ask Putin if he'd consider reforming the Warsaw pact.
0 Replies
 
Renaldo Dubois
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 03:35 pm
@JTT,
Are you calling Obama a war criminal?
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 03:46 pm
@Renaldo Dubois,
Another simplistic question from Mr. Dubois, like a sad drunk in the bar. 'You looking at my bird?'
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 03:58 pm
@Renaldo Dubois,
I don't have to, Ren.

US president -> war criminal
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:01 pm
I think it was in this thread, wasn't it, DrewDad?

Here's Chai2 replying to CalamityJane in Post: # 4,610,872

Quote:
Duh.
Bobby Sherman.


Smile
0 Replies
 
raprap
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:04 pm
@JTT,
Bush, the lesser, is a war criminal? I'd a thought I'd never heard you admit it bubby.

The Pugnacious pissant

Rap
Renaldo Dubois
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:10 pm
@JTT,
Oh, that's right. I forgot that you hate the USA.
Renaldo Dubois
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:11 pm
@raprap,
Yep, you're a parrot. I'll find some more new words for you. At least you're teachable.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:13 pm
@Renaldo Dubois,
Quote:
Oh, that's right. I forgot that you hate the USA.


You learn these tired old canards easily, Ren. You must be a conservative.

The facts tell us that US presidents are war criminals. Care to review the facts with me?
Renaldo Dubois
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:19 pm
@JTT,
Naw. I'm convinced you believe our Presidents are criminals and the USA is the big Satan. You have a lot in common with the Islamic nutjobs you defend.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:35 pm
@Renaldo Dubois,
Mr. Dubois, do you remember me telling you about the difference between news channels and propagada networks. I mentioned Fox TV alongside RT( Russian TV) and Press TV(Iranian TV). Of all three channels Fox is the most crude and blatant propaganda. Press TV and RT are a lot more subtle, they know we're not going to believe anything they say about their own countries. We're not going to believe that Ahmadinejad really quite a nice bloke after all. So they don't say anything about Iran, apart from what the weather's like (Sunny). What they do instead is broadcast all the horrible things that America has been getting up to over the past few years. That way they don't have to tell any lies, because they're not short of stuff to broadcast. So that's the propaganda of the 21st Century, keep quiet about your own crimes, and shine a spotlight on your enemies.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:36 pm
@Renaldo Dubois,
More canards, Ren. You really are conservative, aren't you? As I said the facts show that 'US president' and 'war criminal' are synonymous.

Do you think that Former USAF veteran (Honorably Discharged) and Elder Statesman, Douglas Herman hates the USA.

His report is a little dated as R McNamara is dead, but the others are all still alive, walking free in a country that so often brags about being a rule of law country.

Would you like to see some more facts or are you content to live in your little bubble?

Quote:
Criminals Living Freely Today


Rense Exclusive
By Douglas Herman
12-14-5

A war crime is a punishable offense, under international law, for violations of the law of war by any person or persons, military or civilian. Every violation of the law of war is a war crime. Also, war crimes are those committed during wartime in violation of international conventions intended to protect civilian populations and prisoners of war. You will note that many on this list, categorized as war criminals, ironically, are among the most powerful and wealthy US citizens

1. Robert McNamara. Former US Secretary of Defense, helped kill approximately 2-3 million, mostly poor Vietnamese, Cambodians and Laotians. Not to mention a sizeable portion of the 58,000 dead US servicemen pressed into that war. Not to mention that equal number of US veterans who committed suicide in the years to follow. McNamara is an Elder Statesman now, walking around freely today.

2. Henry Kissinger. Former US Secretary of State, had a hand in the killings mentioned above. Plus condoned thousands of additional killings in Chile, under the sponsorship of US foreign policy. Won a Nobel Peace Prize for his efforts. Elder Statesman, walking around freely today.

3. Bill Clinton. Former, disgraced US President. Initiated bombing raids against Yugoslavia and Iraq, neither country able to defend itself, resulting in the deaths of thousands. Conducted punitive sanctions against Iraq, resulting in hundreds of thousands of civilian deaths. Presided during Waco Massacre and Oklahoma City Bombing, thinly-disguised war crimes against US citizens.. Elder Statesman, walking around freely today, amply rewarded for book deals and speaking engagements.

4. George HW Bush. Former super spy, former US President, the first to graduate from the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) into the presidency and bring lessons learned at CIA headquarters directly into US policy. While serving under Ronald Reagan, helped encourage the Iraq-Iran war, resulting in deaths of one million people, allowing US oil and arms dealers to profit greatly. During the 'Eighties, helped encourage US sponsored military dictators in Latin America, guilty of extermination of thousands of ordinary citizens, via US-trained "death squads." Conducted pre-emptive war with Panama, resulting in 1,000-4,000 deaths, simply to topple former CIA henchman and drug lord, Manuel Noriega. Elder Statesman, walking around freely today, basking in limelight.

5, Madeline Albright. Former US Secretary of State under Clinton. Condoned the punitive sanctions against Iraq that resulted in an estimated 500,000 deaths of children. Remarked that such sanctions were "worth it." Elder Stateswoman, walking around freely today.

6. George W. Bush. Two term US president, elected using electronic, "black box" voting methods that permit no verification of actual vote count. Conducted two pre-emptive wars, resulting in excess of 100,000 US. Iraqi and Afghani deaths. Condones the use of torture as US policy. Condones rejection of the Geneva Convention, becoming the first US president to openly do so. Considers the US Constitution "A Goddamned piece of paper." Embattled Statesman, walking around freely today.

7. Dick Cheney. Former US Secretary of Defense, and signator of the PNAC, and current Vice President. Accused mastermind of the 911 "terrorist" attack against the US (unproven), Cheney has been called "The Vice President For Torture" by the Washington Post. A staunch supporter of the Middle Eastern War Without End, Cheney, like Wolfowitz and Rumsfeld bears particular responsibility for the conduct of the war. Elder Statesman, walking around freely today.

8. Paul Wolfowitz. Former US Deputy Secretary of Defense and architect of the Middle Eastern War Without End. Casualties in two pre-emptive wars now exceed 100,000 deaths, not including the estimated 2,000+ US deaths and 15,000 wounded. Won a Presidential Medal of Freedom for his work and a promotion to the head of the World Bank. Elder Statesman, walking around freely today.

9. Donald Rumsfeld. US Secretary of Defense during the Middle Eastern War Without End. A signator of the PNAC document that calls for pre-emptive hostile acts of US imperialism conducted by overwhelming military means (War) against weaker nations possessing scarce resources. Aside from the estimated 100,000 Iraqi deaths, the estimated 15-20,000 US casualties (dead and injured), and the untold tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands (millions?) who will suffer from the effects of depleted uranium in the years to come, Rumsfeld remains convinced the "war on terror" is just. A long time political appointee, Rumsfeld is an Elder Statesman, walking around freely today.

10. Ruppert Murdoch. Token American. Media baron. Never met a war he didn't like. Responsible for tens of thousands of deaths and untold millions of refugees through media encouragement of harsh, US foreign policy. Owns a sizable chunk of the US news media. Murdoch is the most visible Godfather of the Mainstream News Mafia (MNM). Elder Statesman and multi-billionaire news baron, walking around freely today.

Former USAF veteran (Honorably Discharged) and Elder Statesman, Douglas Herman

http://www.rense.com/general69/tpten.htm
raprap
 
  2  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:42 pm
@JTT,
Now you've done it JTT. You've accused Rupert Murdock of being a war criminal. Rennee worships Murdock's lotus flower feet.

Rap
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:53 pm
@raprap,
It seems that Ren has retired to the bar for the day, Rap.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 04:57 pm
@JTT,
I wonder, Renaldo, does Tom Stephens, a lawyer from Detroit, also hate the USA?

Quote:
May 13, 2005

A Chronology of US War Crimes & Torture, 1975-2005

The Crimes of Empire

By TOM STEPHENS


I. BACKGROUND, 1975-1989

April 30, 1975
South Vietnam falls. The end of a massive US campaign of imperial aggression, including the systematic use of torture, dating back to 1962. At the time, a low point in US international prestige. The last several years of direct US military involvement featured widespread mutiny in the military, troops killing their officers, and intense social conflicts at home between the government and militant peace and civil rights movements. Beginning of the "Vietnam Syndrome," in which US leaders hesitate to unleash mass murder on the world, for fear of such domestic political repercussions.

1976-80
President Jimmy Carter rhetorically supports human rights,
and calls for energy conservation programs that are "the moral equivalent of war," partly to deal with US reliance on unstable and unjust regimes in the oil-rich Middle East, long recognized by US strategic planners as one of the greatest material prizes in world history, and therefore targeted for US influence, control and dominance. Carter's energy programs fail.

1979
Iranian revolution against the US-supported Shah. 52 US hostages held at the embassy in Tehran until January 20, 1981. Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, and massive US CIA support for the Afghan mujahadeen resistance, also involving Pakistani and Saudi intelligence agencies. These same Islamic resistance fighters would later organize the international Islamic terror network symbolized by Al-Qaeda.


READ ON RENALDO, AT,

http://www.counterpunch.org/stephens05132005.html


Renaldo Dubois
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 06:15 pm
@izzythepush,
Oh, for sure. Fox news is total propaganda. You're too smart for this place.
Renaldo Dubois
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 06:16 pm
@JTT,
So why are all these criminals walking around free?
Renaldo Dubois
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 06:18 pm
@JTT,
Oh my. How terrible.

Where do you live? I assume you aren't an American or am I wrong.
 

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