could anyone help me with this ?

Forums: Poetry, Language, Savonarola, Signoria, Piazza Della Signoria
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I read a poem in a novel, but I am not sure about its exact meaning.

savonarola to the sognoria
I drink the cup, returning thanks.
(The rack that turns one cripple in an hour
draws a man's throat to nothing with the pain.)
so let them hear me first and last,
the Florentines that keep death's holiday

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[+4] - George - 04/18/2011For what it's worth, here's what I get out of it. First, it should be "signoria", not "sognoria". This is a reference to the Piazza della Signoria, where Savaronola was...

View best answer, chosen by jeremykong

@jeremykong,

If you are just not exactly sure, you're probably doing far better [damn those inexact phrases all to hell] than most of us, Jeremy. People make careers out of discussing and trying to figure out the meanings found in writers and poets' works.

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@jeremykong,

For what it's worth, here's what I get out of it.

First, it should be "signoria", not "sognoria". This is a reference to the
Piazza della Signoria, where Savaronola was executed.

Savoronola has apparently been given something to drink.
He thanks them. He says that the rack, an instrument of
torture, can make a cripple of you in less than an hour and
that the pain will constrict your throat. Therefore, he will
say what he has to say now, while he still can. He addresses
his words to the citizens of Florence who are celebrating
his execution day as a holiday.

Painting of Savonarola's execution in the Piazza della Signoria.

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@George,

I should say that your explanation is great
Thanks a lot!

1 Reply

@jeremykong,

You're welcome, jeremykong.

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@George,

George wrote:

the citizens of Florence who are celebrating
his execution day as a holiday.

Note that it is not HIS execution day;
it is the execution day of his death sentence.

2 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

Note that it is not HIS execution day;

Note that Om is being pedantic in the pejorative sense of the word.

Exact phrase google for "his execution day" yields
About 60,000 results

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@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

George wrote:
the citizens of Florence who are celebrating
his execution day as a holiday.
Note that it is not HIS execution day;
it is the execution day of his death sentence.

Note that it is his execution day; in English a person who is sentenced to death can be said to be executed when the sentence is carried out. It is the day of his execution, or his execution day.

Do you ever think before hitting that reply button?

2 Replies

@contrex,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

George wrote:
the citizens of Florence who are celebrating
his execution day as a holiday.
Note that it is not HIS execution day;
it is the execution day of his death sentence.

contrex wrote:

Note that it is his execution day; in English a person
who is sentenced to death can be said to be executed
when the sentence is carried out. It is the day of his execution, or his execution day.

Do you ever think before hitting that reply button?

No. If the prisoner is executed before he is killed,
then he will get away and his death warrant cannot
be executed unless and until he is re-captured.

That can be dangerous, in that many people who have been sentenced
to death r malicious. Hence, public safety may well require
them to be KILLED before thay r executed.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

No. If the prisoner is executed before he is killed,
then he will get away and his death warrant cannot
be executed unless and until he is re-captured.

That can be dangerous, in that many people who have been sentenced
to death r malicious. Hence, public safety may well require
them to be KILLED before thay r executed.

I retract my previous statements. Om was trying to be pedantic, in the pejorative sense of the word. He is simply being dumb.

Any number of things can be executed; people, legal judgments, computer commands, plans, ... .

I'm wondering in what possible meaning found in the English language, how "f the prisoner is executed before he is killed, then he will get away".

There might be one.

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wow

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@contrex,

contrex wrote:

Note that it is his execution day;

Well, admittedly, it is possible
that what is left of him might be executed
on the same day that he has been killed.
There might not be any particular reason
to keep his remains inside the prison AFTER
he has been killed, so execution thereof can happen,
after competent medical authority has pronounced him: dead.

In the alternative,
after he has been killed, his remains can be buried
in a prison cemetery, in which case, he need never be executed.

In the (unlikely) event that his family wants his remains back
for re-burial in its own private plot, the body can be exhumed
and executed at that time (which is a lot safer for the rest of us
than executing him while he remains alive).

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

It is abundantly clear (it was before!) that David is a time wasting troll.

1 Reply

@contrex,

contrex wrote:

It is abundantly clear (it was before!) that David is a time wasting troll.

When your mental capacity is insufficient,
u retaliate by hurling personal insults.

2 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

I have to say that I agree with OmSigD. While his bafflegab is silly, it must be that he thinks he has a point.

I don't see how that makes him a troll, which is rather a childish default insult.

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@OmSigDAVID,

contrex wrote:

It is abundantly clear (it was before!) that David is a time wasting troll.

OmSigDAVID wrote:

When your mental capacity is insufficient,
u retaliate by hurling personal insults.

I 've changed my mind.
I withdraw my last characterization of Contrex.
In truth, he has failed to convince me that he is stupid
(as, indeed, other posters on this forum have proven),
but Contrex is simply failing to use his mind analytically,
choosing to hurl personal insults, instead of reasoning out
the subject matter (which, I may add HE brought up).

He is just being mentally lazy; either that, or
he is just FAKING IGNORANCE,
when, in actual fact, he does understand.

The concept is not difficult.
Its not like figuring out how to split the atom.

David

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execute
ex·e·cute /ˈɛksɪˌkyut/ Show Spelled
[ek-si-kyoot] Show IPA
verb, -cut·ed, -cut·ing.
–verb (used with object)
1. to carry out; accomplish: to execute a plan or order.
2. to perform or do: to execute a maneuver; to execute a gymnastic feat.

[All emfasis has been added by David.]

execution
mid-14c., from Anglo-Fr. execucioun (late 13c.),
O.Fr. execucion "a carrying out" (of an order, etc.),
from L. executionem (nom. executio) "an accomplishing,"
noun of action from pp. stem of exequi/exsequi "to follow out," ` from ex- "out" (see ex-) + sequi "follow" (see sequel).

Sense of "act of putting to death" (mid-14c.) is from M.E. legal phrases such as don execution of deth "carry out a sentence of death."
Literal meaning "action of carrying something into effect" is from late 14c.

Note that many things can be executed, NOT only death sentences.
Other sentences can be executed e.g. fines or imprisonment.

Wills can be executed.
Contracts can be executed.
Plans can be executed; followed out to their proper conclusions.

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When the Warden of a prison
has an inmate killed in fulfilment of judicial process to that effect,
the DEATH WARRANT is being executed, not the prisoner.

If the Warden executed a living prisoner
(i.e., carried him out or followed him out of the prison,
like a bar room bouncer with an obstreperous drunk)
then that ex-prisoner woud get away, to recidivate another day.

(In candor, attorneys and judges ofen make that error.
In candor, attorneys and judges ofen make many errors.)

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

More nonsense from OMsig.

OED

Quote:

Execute

6.

a. To inflict capital punishment upon; to put to death in pursuance of a sentence. More fully, †to execute to death [= French †exécuter à mort] . †to execute by the head : to behead.
1483 Caxton tr. Caton B iij b, To robbe and to stele wherfore they be hanged or otherwyse executed by Justyse.
1523 Ld. Berners tr. J. Froissart Cronycles I. clxxxvii, They were executed by dyuers tourmentes of dethe.
1548 Hall's Vnion: Henry IV f. xiijv, Sir Thomas Blonte and all the other prysoners were executed.
1577 M. Hanmer tr. Eusebius in Aunc. Eccl. Hist. ix. xi. 183 First of all Theotecnus him selfe‥he executed to death.
1579 G. Fenton tr. F. Guicciardini Hist. Guicciardin iv. 233 Hee was executed by the head the day following.
1603 J. Florio tr. Montaigne Ess. iii. vi. 548 Divers of their chieftaines have beene executed to death.
a1687 W. Petty Polit. Arithm. (1691) Pref. sig. A iij, No more Beggars in the Streets, nor executed for Thieves, than heretofore.
1715 M. Davies Athenæ Britannicæ I. 133 Prosecuting and Executing those to death, who [etc.].
1847 G. P. R. James Gowrie xlvi, Three of the Earl's faithful servants were executed at Perth.

1 Reply

@contrex,

I stand by what I already said and quoted.

U choose not to REASON and hope that no one will notice.

David

1 Reply

could anyone help me with this ?

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