if free-will is not possible ?

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then where does this lead us ?

in terms of thought and new thinking , in the now and the future ?

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@north,

I do not want ... Can you give your opinion ?

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@north,

north wrote:

then where does this lead us ?

in terms of thought and new thinking , in the now and the future ?

Where does what land us? What is important is whether something is true. It certainly will not land us anywhere unless it is true. Rather, it will just crash.

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@north,

we know that differnet ways of thinking is based upon the ability to think outside the box

so if free-will is not possible then how thinking out-side the box possible ?

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@north,

north wrote:

we know that differnet ways of thinking is based upon the ability to think outside the box

so if free-will is not possible then how thinking out-side the box possible ?

Well, we may be determined to think outside the box. In that case, of course, if we don't have free will, we are not free to think inside the box if we are determined to think outside the box.

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@kennethamy,

kennethamy wrote:

north wrote:

we know that differnet ways of thinking is based upon the ability to think outside the box

so if free-will is not possible then how is thinking out-side the box possible ?

Well, we may be determined to think outside the box. In that case, of course, if we don't have free will, we are not free to think inside the box if we are determined to think outside the box.

yet to think " outside " the box is based on that the thinking " inside " the box leads to no answer to a suggested question or inquiry inside the box

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@north,

north wrote:

kennethamy wrote:

north wrote:

we know that differnet ways of thinking is based upon the ability to think outside the box

so if free-will is not possible then how is thinking out-side the box possible ?

Well, we may be determined to think outside the box. In that case, of course, if we don't have free will, we are not free to think inside the box if we are determined to think outside the box.

yet to think " outside " the box is based on that the thinking " inside " the box leads to no answer to a suggested question or inquiry inside the box

But I thought that according to determinists it isn't up to anyone whether to think inside or outside the box, since (according to determinists) nothing is up to anyone. This kind of determinism just reduces to fatalism and the empty tautology that "whatever will be will be".

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@kennethamy,

quote="kennethamy"]
[ This kind of determinism just reduces to fatalism and the empty tautology that "whatever will be will be".
[/quote]
4 ounce

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If free will is not possible, its not likely anything would change. As much as we enjoy blaming others for our shortcomings we cannot bear to give them credit for our successes. The ideal of free will must remain so that we may retain our self image

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@GoshisDead,

WE will break free of ID's

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@Pepijn Sweep,

Pepijn Sweep wrote:

WE will break free of ID's

Kudos, Pep. It makes one wonder what we will call ourselves then. Now this is something to think about. Perhaps then we will be known as numbers. If that is the case, I wonder who the number one would belong to? He would be a good one too, let's all hope, for all the others to rely on, huh!?

William

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@William,

How would I know. I am Six

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@Pepijn Sweep,

Quote:

quote="kennethamy"]
[ This kind of determinism just reduces to fatalism and the empty tautology that "whatever will be will be".

[/quote]
Youv'e give away your method of posting quotes. Now I have your power.

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@tomr,

tomr wrote:

Quote:
quote="kennethamy"]
[ This kind of determinism just reduces to fatalism and the empty tautology that "whatever will be will be".

Youv'e give away your method of posting quotes. Now I have your power.
[/quote]

What are you talking about now? Supposing you are talking about anything at all.

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so can we say then that without free-will , there would be NO progress in going beyond merely instinct thinking and reactions ?

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@north,

north wrote:

so can we say then that without free-will , there would be NO progress in going beyond merely instinct thinking and reactions ?

You can say what you please. But you have to argue for it.

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@kennethamy,

he doesn't have to argue for anything if doesn't want to, he has free will.

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@GoshisDead,

GoshisDead wrote:

he doesn't have to argue for anything if doesn't want to, he has free will.

No, you are intellectually compelled to argue for what you assert, unless, of course, you want to be a dummy.

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@kennethamy,

Why would someone be compelled to argue. its enirely possible one does want to be a dummy. It is also entirely possible they prefer not to argue. It is also even more possible they are not so impressed with the person with whom they would argue and so do not care enough to argue.

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@GoshisDead,

GoshisDead wrote:

Why would someone be compelled to argue. its enirely possible one does want to be a dummy. It is also entirely possible they prefer not to argue. It is also even more possible they are not so impressed with the person with whom they would argue and so do not care enough to argue.

Well sure. I am just assuming that people do not want to be dummies. Just as a person is not compelled to eat if he wants to starve to death. When I say that people are compelled to eat, I am assuming that they do not want to starve to death. But yes, if you want to be a dummy, you needn't argue, and if you want to starve to death, you needn't eat.

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if free-will is not possible ?

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