Fri 21 Nov, 2003 03:07 pm
In both their respective primes, who do you think would have won in a fight: Mike Tyson, or Ali?
I know Ali had tougher competition overall, but Tyson was just devastating when he was in his prime.
No "back in my day, guys KNEW how to fight...they swallowed teeth, and loved it! stories."
Tyson. I used to argue this with a 50 year old guy who hated Tyson and loved Ali. He eventually became convinced.
I thinkAli could beat Tyson if he held him, Tyson's never reacted well to grabbers. But I think Tyson's speed and power would overwhelm Ali's skill.
I met Ali, twice. He's huge. I imagine if Tyson caught him early, he might win. More than five rounds though and Ali would take him out just like he did everybody else.
I agree with that. Tyson had the longetivity of Forrest Gump looking at a naked broad.
ali was also smart. He would adjust his strategy in order to make the fight last more than the three power rounds of Tyson.
Tyson really needed to win quickly.
I say Ali would have pounded the piss out of Tyson. Ali beat both Joe Frazier and George Forman -- and either of those guys would have beaten Tyson too.
Yall sound like the folks who were certain that Ali was a dead man in his fight with Foreman. Don't you remember what happened that night? Ali would have outsmarted Tyson and whupped his ass like he was his daddy. No doubt about it.
Foreman was not as fast as Tyson. Tysons power leaves his speed underestimated.
With both in their prime, I would still go with Ali. Tyson is quick and devestatingly powerful, but not the brightest bulb on the block. I think Ali could have avoided being hit early, and then use his psychological warfare and stamina to bring Tyson down.
Tyson is not in Ali's league.
Tyson isn't/wasn't stupid, mind you. Not even when fighting Evander. (he was just pissed!). But Ali was smart and moved like the wind, and don't underestimate his power. He took Foreman down in a flurry but, slowing the tape down, there was one lightening punch that did the damage. You could practically see George's eyes roll back in his head.
Ali. No doubt about it.
Ali was bigger, smarter, and as fast as Tyson.
Foreman would've beaten Tyson.
Strength on strength leaves it big man vs. little man.
Joe Frazier would've beaten Tyson.
Two very evenly-matched fighters, but Frazier wins because of his boxing skills; something missing from the most recent generation of heavyweight pugilists.
Tyson is a beast,i think every opponent will be a little afraid.
Yeah every opponent will be afraid, and probably lose, if they view him as a beast. But he's not a beast, he's a man.
Ali all the way, Tyson has the punch but Ali has the feet and the heart, if he kept moving he would win. Even when foreman had him against the ropes and ali had no where to go he took it and stayed standing the was heart. As far as tyson not being stupid, as far as in the ring maybe not but I would find it hard to believe he was \is a academic scholar...when mad we do stupid things and Tyson is angry alot.
Alot of gray area between stupid and academic scholar. Matter of fact, I've known several academic scholars who were quite stupid.
as have I but my statement was suposed to be taken in a broad sense meaning when I judge him by his actions It leads me to believe he does not have a high intelligence in either academic matters or general knowledge. I could be wrong as I do not know the man but if your actions don't speak for you whats it matter? true intelligence is shown by what you do in life.
eat one ear, and your chances of winning a nobel Prize are severely reduced
rape 1 or 2 ppl and start drunken bar fights and your chances of winning the same award drop even more.
Tyson vs. Ali
Each of the hundreds of forums I visit regarding this topic spill forth the same jargon every time: "Tyson couldn't last the late rounds and Ali was quick & smart..."
This leads to several conclusions. The first is that nobody ever actually watched Tyson when his head was screwed on properly (albeit, this didn't happen often, but there were occasions). Against Mitchell, Rodriguez, Ruddock, and several others, Tyson was forced into later-round matches. Each of which saw Tyson still attacking and assaulting in rounds 7, 8, 9, and 10 with the same ferocity as rounds 1-3. It was all in the conditioning. If Tyson was prepared for a fight, which was the case while Cus was alive, he conditioned himself for a fight of any length. After Cus died, his wife also left (and tried to take his money), Teddy Atlas threatened to kill him, and Don King took over his (Tyson's) life; Mike was a wreck of a man psychologically. In the Buster Douglas fight, Mike stood flat footed for 10 rounds, not caring about his 42:1 underdog of an opponent, figuring that this was a primer for Evander Holyfield. Even in this situation, Tyson managed to knock Douglas down for a 9 count in which the referee stopped the count before Buster was even on his feet. All of the above events took place during the course of just one year. Remove these factors and Tyson would have been 50-0. Since this didn't happen, however, let's just go back to Tyson's prime in the late 1980's and pretend that he was well-trained and properly conditioned.
Muhammad Ali was physically in his prime in the late 1960's, but he reached his boxing prime in the 1970's. He was smarter, while a bit slower, and held the title (on-and-off) for over 5 years. Let's combine the two and make one, super, Muhammad Ali. He could dance, he could flick the jab, and he could smack-talk anyone into a frenzy. This would prove difficult against an early Mike Tyson, as his focus was on studying boxing history, as well as tearing people to the ground. But even a disciplined Tyson under Cus would be subject, at least a little, to Ali's verbal abuse.
Ali vs. Tyson I "The Greatest" and "Iron Mike"
In the early going, Tyson would bob and weave after Ali, looking for openings and weaknesses. Ali's incredible speed makes this difficult. He flicks the jab at a head that consistently bobs left and right in an attempt to score some early points. Eventually, in the 3-4 round, Tyson starts to cut off the ring distance, much like he did against Larry Holmes, and chops at Ali's conditioned mid-section. As good as his body is, the prolific slams to the ribs take their toll. Eventually, Ali's head falls a little carelessly and Tyson catches Muhammad with a devastating uppercut, knocking Ali out in round 5 or 6. Conclusion: Tyson would most likely surprise Ali with his ability to dodge, duck, and weave his way into a taller opponent's space, and work the body until it couldn't handle the abuse any longer.
Ali vs. Tyson II The Thrilla and The Killa rematch
As always, when Don King is involved, there would be a rematch. This time, however, Ali is far more prepared, and Tyson is probably arrogant. Tyson comes out in the early rounds and attempts to chop the taller man down again. This time, Ali pokes at the eyebrows of a slower-moving Tyson to get him flailing with wild haymakers. Ali clinches Tyson against the ropes until the ref separates the two fighters. In the mid, to late rounds, Tyson begins showing signs of frustration. He starts to sneak elbow shots and low body shots that get him a few warnings. His eyes are showing signs of puffiness from Ali's precision punching. Both fighters are pretty tired towards the end of the fight, but Ali continues to win on points. At the end of all rounds, it's clear that Ali does have much greater stamina, and he wins a uninanimous decision. Conclusion: Ali, in a similar fashion to Ali vs. Frazier II, would have made far fewer mistakes. While his opponent's aggression would still take it's toll, Ali would have greater respect for Tyson, and would play it cautiously until the fight was over.
Ali vs. Tyson III Settled
Chances are, Tyson would come out more aggressive in this fight than in any other. His punches would be wild, however, and Ali, with his ability to slip by the big shots, would manage to strafe away. Tyson would then slow down, take some patient shots, and attempt to cut down Ali's body again. The master of the ol' Rope-A-Dope would probably draw Iron Mike in and allow him to punch himself out. Tyson's arms don't punch out so easily though, and Ali's head begins to dip a little. Round 9 comes along and Ali sets himself on cruise control, as both fighters basically clinch their way through this round. With less than a minute to go in the round, Ali gives himself some distance, and catches Tyson with a surprise 1-2 left & right combination. In typical Butterfly fashion, his goes on a flurry that forces Tyson to cover up and wait for the bell. With Tyson cut and frustrated, he debates even leaving the stool for round 10. Nonetheless, he comes out with a second-wind and starts going to work on the more experienced fighter. Mike's punches are glancing, but they're drawing a lot out of his own tank. Ali survives the assault and takes a breather. The next round sees Ali plant his feet to get behind his punches and he lands straight rights and lefts to the cuts above Iron Mike's eyes. Eventually, his eyes, nose, and cheeks are bleeding. True to form, Ali is an amazing finisher and puts Tyson through a clinic with a flurry of accurate blows which forces the referee to stop the fight. Ali wins by a TKO. Conclusion: Ali would get better against any fighter with time. If you give him multiple attempts at any fighter throughout history, he would win the majority of those battles. Furthermore, Tyson, when focused, could have ripped down any fighter in any era. His style was his own, and his punches were devastating. He had fast, powerful combinations that landed with surprising accuracy. What separates Mike Tyson from other "power" or "volume" punchers was the fact that he could hit with either hand in any form. Joe Frazier was solely a left-hook. Sonny Liston was a straight-shot. Rocky was all about the right hand. Joe Louis, left hook. While these fighters proved themselves to be champions by not allowing their personal lives to ruin their great careers, this is all hypothetical anyway.
Final Results: Ali 2, Tyson 1
Hopefully this was an interesting little scenario for everybody (if this post is even still read anymore). Thanks for reading.