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Does God need to be concious?

 
 
Doorsopen
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 May, 2009 03:00 am
@nameless,
nameless;65190 wrote:

My reference to 'control' was relating to the 'control' of the priest class over the laity.
I don't know what a 'spirit' is, and thus 'spiritual facilities', Doorsopen. Like 'Casper the Friendly Ghost' is a 'spirit'? And where he works out would be a 'spiritual facility'? (see how silly these attempts at sarcasm can be?)
Care to share 'your beliefs'/define 'spirit'?
Actually, I'd rather you didn't, not that I don't appreciate your attempt at sarcasm...
(darn, there I go again!)


My request was not an attempt at sarcasm, it is a challenge for you to give me a thoughtful interpretation from the Bible now that it is no longer the exclusive domain of the clergy. This would prove to us that you are knowledgeable enough on the subject to make such statements. I also fault the form of your original argument (as a series of rhetorical questions) to release yourself from the responsible of substantiating it. Prove me wrong.
Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 May, 2009 03:18 am
@Greg phil,
Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krumple http://www.philosophyforum.com/forum/images/PHBlue/buttons/viewpost.gif
There are some who do love god with or without consequences but they are a rare breed and typically they are more fanatical and mean to other people because of it.

Please justify this statement.


Well I've had several experiences with such individuals but I'll share one in particular.

A close friend of mine's mother is one such person I am referencing when I made the statement. She is very devoted to her god and I've had several conversations with her about what she believes. She says she doesn't believe the fire and brimstone bit that jesus threatens us with in the new testament. She believes in the separation argument, which the way she puts it sounds very reasonable. She says god is not cruel and would never torture a being for not believing but instead grants it extinction from existence. So she says, the atheists get what they wanted, to cease to exist upon their death. She also called it death of the soul and says those who accept god will live for ever with him. Sounds all clear cut and she seems like she would be a rather nice person but shes not.

Since she doesn't actually believe in hell, she bashes people for not accepting god. She is rude, racist, unforgiving, ignorant, self righteous because she feels she is privelaged by god since she believes in god, god blesses her above all those who don't accept god.

She calls me unworthy of living because I do not accept god. That she is baffled why god should allow me to continue to exist but she writes it off that he is allowing me more time to think it over before it's too late to change my mind. Then goes into her defensive statements, something to the effect of this, "See how loving god is, he allows people like you who hate him to live."

I think you get the picture...
0 Replies
 
nameless
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 May, 2009 05:01 am
@Doorsopen,
Doorsopen;65205 wrote:
My request was not an attempt at sarcasm, it is a challenge for you to give me a thoughtful interpretation from the Bible now that it is no longer the exclusive domain of the clergy. This would prove to us that you are knowledgeable enough on the subject to make such statements. I also fault the form of your original argument (as a series of rhetorical questions) to release yourself from the responsible of substantiating it. Prove me wrong.

A) if you want me to respond, you are going to have to ask me specific questions about something specific that i have posted. Your general sarcastic vague 'challenge' doesn't interest me.
Heres my original post. Tell me what it is that you cannot understand, and perhaps I can help you;
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg
Does God need to be concious?

Does wind 'need' to blow?
Does a vaccuum 'need' to suck?
What kind of pathetic anthropomorphic 'god' has 'needs'.
God is Consciousness/Mind.
Of course, god is whatever you think It is, as we are the only way that Consciousness can 'perceive' itself (Mind).

- God cannot know himself without me. - Meister Eckhart

I have nothing to prove to you or anyone else.
If you have any understanding of, much less have read, the bible a couple of times, you would already understand that I am being accurate in my representations. If you have not read it (as your question and attitude suggest), then your challenging egoic tone shows me that nothing that I say will get past your radar, and I'd be "casting my pearls before swine" (it's in the book).
Your apparent vague unease with my statements mean nothing to me. This is a philosophy forum.
Ask a specific and respectful question, indicate that you are making an attempt to understand rather than to argue from ignorance couched in vagueries obfuscations, and I'll respond.
One teaches, with proper questions, those capable of learning. Thought processes are guided into understanding.
And asking me to 'sustain' teaching questions is a sure sign that critical thought is a challenge for you. And challenging me to "prove you wrong" just shows me that all you are interested in is a juvenile pissing contest. Sorry, it's been too long since I was a 'juvenile'.
Now, if you want to try this again after you achieve a specific thoughtful question, fine.
Otherwise, maybe I'll see you around...
Peace
Didymos Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 May, 2009 06:05 pm
@nameless,
I'm sorry to find you unimpressed by obvious counter-examples to your claims, nameless.
0 Replies
 
Rumoroo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 May, 2009 06:46 pm
@Greg phil,
Great question! God as an entity is a good example of the utilitarian roots of religion. Its easier for people to direct their worship towards the personification of a law or concept rather than the concept itself, as shown by the early pantheons of gods as unique characters who represent aspects of their worshippers lives.

I am personally drawn god as a law instead of god as a conscious entity simply because there is too much human speculation involved in imagining such an entity. Too many qualities have been given to god that strike me as having human origin and not divine origin. God as a law being simpler and requiring less speculation is more believable to me. I can see how you came to this. Plus I am all about evaluating the Catholic god haha!

Your post reminds me of my very first ridiculous philosophy paper, where I talked about the possibility of god being very different than what most propose. Its about god being, on a different scale, like one of us; I mention the possibility of our entire existence being the result of an alien elementary school experiment, or our unintentional creation via alien loogey haha!
0 Replies
 
Earl phil
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2009 09:51 pm
@JeffD2,
It is that God creates all, but it is not that we create God. Consciousness is value which we beget, and it is ambiguous at best. We assign value to things that we encounter, but we have yet to witness God in His tangible form; therefore, we don't know His nature. If we are to observe, however, we might assign values towards Him, but whether He is actually conscious or not is not dependent on what we believe for a word as that is up to the eye of the beholder in the first place.
0 Replies
 
 

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