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Thu 18 Jun, 2009 07:29 pm
After giving this some thought, i believe that anger, hatred, grudges, ect. have no positive effects whatsoever. I haven't looked up any substantial philosophical references to this subject matter so excuse me if some of this has been said already. Mainly, it is very easily to be angered by something but in the end, anger and hatred seem to only bring negative effects. Obviously this isn't easy but if we were to control our emotions, we could always have clear thought, i any situation. All of our thoughts and actions would be rational and not out of anger and frustration. This is obviously easier said then done, but anger is in fact a mental idea. Does anger help relieve stress or even unwanted emotions? It might but again, all of these are mental and can be completely controlled by us if we are disciplined enough.
It just seems like being frustrated is something that can very easily be done and we can slip into anger uncontrollable. But being honest, i see no survival origin for anger and it only brings us negative effects. Hatred and grudges towards, people, ideas, anything is not beneficial whatsoever. This is not to say you should avoid people that you do not like or have done harm to you but this does not mean that you should hate them or hold grudges against them. Grudges seem to make everything worse and people bitter and cold which is not what we'd like.
Anyway, i was just wondering the purpose for anger and why there is so much hatred among us.
@Yogi DMT,
Yogi,
I personally believe that there is a time and a place for all human emotions, and none is
inherently negative. But all human emotions can be carried to a pathologic extreme. We're psychologically constructed to defend ourselves and our loved ones, and without the capacity to become enraged we might never be able to defend ourselves.
@Yogi DMT,
Maybe, but i see anger and hatred only as something that causes us to do irrational things. Even defending ourselves might be easier if we had a clear head, possibly our physical stength would be reduced, but that might be the only downfall of staying calming watsoever. Emotions are emotions and i understand that but i can't seem to find the benefit or purpose for anger and if we learn to control anger and even more specifically hatred towards our enviroment, we could live in a better world.
@Yogi DMT,
But Anger might lead to you staying out of confrontational situations with other people who can cause you harm. Therefore anger is useful. It is useful for stopping other bad things from happening in the future. If there was not reaction from society, then that episode would keep happening unabated.
@Yogi DMT,
Anger might makes you less prone to social interaction but whose to say that these confrontational situations are negative? And with that, you might tend to want to express anger physically not verbally which makes matters even worse. Anger does not cut us off from any interaction with our enviroment which is a flaw of the emotion.
@meditationyoga,
Hi there,
I have observed in myself and in others, and I tend to believe that anger is the way the mind (individual consciousness) tells itself that it is not happy with itself. When I see something in someone else, that I do not like in myself, I get angry. It works.
As for hatred, I think it is akin. When one does not see part of oneself, that yucky stuff, they may tend to get hate someone who mirrors it to the person's own mind. It is interesting how the mind teaches itself things.
This is one of my favorite quotes of Oscar Wilde from Dorian Gray:
"The highest as the lowest form of criticism is a mode of autobiography."
Isn't it great. Works every time. Observe the criticism of others and see if it is not a reflection? Observe your own.
Rich
@Yogi DMT,
Yogi DMT;70221 wrote:Maybe, but i see anger and hatred only as something that causes us to do irrational things.
Our makeup is basically irrational, though. Reason is an arbiter between the irrational forces within us, but it is easily and frequently overwhelmed. We do irrational things out of hunger, out of love, out of fear, out of fantasy, and -- believe it or not -- we do irrational things because we THINK we're being rational.
@Yogi DMT,
I daresay if you looked at it from the point of view of evolutionary biology you would find that anger/hatred are adaptive behaviours. I mean, observe mating rituals of many animals, they are violent in the extreme, often resulting in death. From the viewpoint of 'the selfish gene' it is all fair game because the winner - being the stronger - gets to proliferate and therefore it is their genes that survive. Zoologists have witnessed extreme violence amongst chimps involving murder and infanticide.
But the human species has now matured to the point that these behaviours are no longer purely instinctive, nor at all productive (not that you would know by looking at the news every night.) Our violent nature is, one could argue, acknowledged in the spiritual traditions in the 'myth of the fall' and the idea of 'our animal nature', the overcoming of which requires the abandonment of instinctive behaviour and the adoption of a civilized ethic of compassion and altruism. It is a very difficult task, however, because these instincts are planted very deep indeed and to be aware of them and to be able to root them out is perhaps the most important and difficult thing we can do in this life. (Especially because it suits many consumer marketers if we all behave like beasts.)
@Yogi DMT,
Thanks jeepers, IMO, your post was definitely on target as was Paul's. Anger is that "emotion" that awakens when power is being used to "control", whether it be a society or individual especially as one witnesses the oppression of an innocent. In another post I referred to the movie "Lonesome Dove" that to me depicted the "rightous" use of anger, as it carried it to it's inevitable end of loneliness and death for those who had no choice but to act in the only way they new how as they rendered justice to "remove" those sadistic powers. As you relate to "civilized" and "altruism" I agree and as we become more considerate of the entitlements of others as to those values we need to live, will sooth that "savage beast" in man and show the heart that lies beneath that will allow it to beat as it has never beat before. Acquiescence is not the answer for it strenthens those "chains" of power that effort to "control" using the "innocent ignorance" of those of lesser means to beckon to their call, such as Ahab strapped to back of the whale as he also beckoned others to aid in his vengeance. Empathy and apathy inflict the heart of us all, but in the end serve no purpose that would end those "attacking" emotions of conscience which only the irradication of injustice, will do. IMO.
William
@William,
I dont see how any one can say they have never felt anger,it could be a daily event if the news demands it.It is a human response to injustice and compels man to act against it.It is a judge of the seriousness of an event, if it stirs you to anger. Hatred is another matter, that can consume you and it serves no purpose.
@Yogi DMT,
If you didn't have anger you'd let people just walk all over you. As xris says, hatred is something that consumes you, they are not necessarily the same thing.
@Caroline,
Why must people be angry before they stand up for themselves?
@Didymos Thomas,
Didymos Thomas;74708 wrote:Why must people be angry before they stand up for themselves?
maybe anger is intoxicating and some people need it to overcome their fear. it seems to me that it shouldnt be repressed but it needs to be curtailed, and though i seldom get angry i try not to react in any way until later when i have had time to think about it.
there are enough anger management courses and plans, i believe courts sometimes send abusers to them. anyone who knows his anger is going to get him in trouble and make him do things he wouldnt have done otherwise needs to look into these, i think.
hatred, on the other hand, is something that hurts the person who hates more than anyone else. i never heard of a hatred management class-i think it would be a much more deeply rooted psychological issue than one of emotional excess. hatred can be resolved by forgiveness for one thing-but that is one of the hardest things to learn. i remember the last person i hated, and how liberating it was to finally be free of that. i also remember the last person that i would have surely hated had i not resolved the issue and am still amazed that i dont hate him too! it can be overcome...
@Yogi DMT,
Curious post. Assuming you are correct, what are the negative effects of negativity? Surely there are some positive aspects of it? For example, we can say that harm in itself brings negative effects, but the negative effect of a deep gash on my knee may bring the positive effect of experience and learning from my mistakes.
@Didymos Thomas,
Didymos Thomas;74708 wrote:Why must people be angry before they stand up for themselves?
I dont think you have to be necessarly angry to stand up for yourself. But I'd rather be assertive then passive.
@Caroline,
There are degrees of anger,from midly offended to outright steaming.Anger can be productive when it stimulates you to do good.Its a human emotion to deny you ever get angry is just plain silly,its how you handle these feelings is the point to debated.
@salima,
salima;74721 wrote:maybe anger is intoxicating and some people need it to overcome their fear. it seems to me that it shouldnt be repressed but it needs to be curtailed, and though i seldom get angry i try not to react in any way until later when i have had time to think about it.
Hi,
My theory about anger stems from the Imago Theory about relationships. Imago Theory posits that we seek relationships that help us work out problems with our parents from childhood. So our partners are an
image of one of our parents and we use our partner and the relationship as sort of a lab for solving some issues.
It is a very interesting theory and I find it has lots of merit as I observe relationships.
Now for anger. I use to get more angry about things than I do no. I very rarely get angry anymore. It seems the more I accept and see my shadow side, the less I see this side in other people. So acceptance of our own hidden self seems to be a key - at least for me and others who have acknowledged this idea and seek to incorporate it in their lives.
As for anger as a defensive emotion. I have not found this to be valid in my studies of martial arts. The more calm a person is in a situation, the more that person is able to observe and the faster he/she can react.
Rich
@richrf,
richrf;74762 wrote:Hi,
My theory about anger stems from the Imago Theory about relationships. Imago Theory posits that we seek relationships that help us work out problems with our parents from childhood. So our partners are an image of one of our parents and we use our partner and the relationship as sort of a lab for solving some issues.
It is a very interesting theory and I find it has lots of merit as a observe relationships.
Now for anger. I use to get more angry about things than I do no. I very rarely get angry anymore. It seems the more I accept and see my shadow side, the less I see this side in other people. So acceptance of our own hidden self seems to be a key - at least for me and others who have acknowledged this idea and seek to incorporate it in their lives.
As for anger as a defensive emotion. I have not found this to be valid in my studies of martial arts. The more calm a person is in a situation, the more that person is able to observe and the faster he/she can react.
Rich
So when you read about a certain injustice that by its consequences lives are at risk you calmy take it as if thats life.Grumpy anger must come with age then.
Defence is not about anger, its a managed affair with no emotion.
@xris,
xris;74768 wrote:So when you read about a certain injustice that by its consequences lives are at risk you calmy take it as if thats life.Grumpy anger must come with age then.
Defence is not about anger, its a managed affair with no emotion.
Hi,
I wouldn't say I get angry. With all of what is happening as we speak all around the world, all of the time, I would be angry all the time about life and the world. This is somewhere I would not want to be. So, I look at it from a different point of view.
I do not profess that I never get angry. There are times that I do, and then I look at myself and ask myself what is it that I see that bothers me so that may be a shadow within myself. If I become aware of it and accept it as being within myself, it appears that the anger is gone and it is replaced with other feelings and emotions.
Observe on this forum the words people use about others when they get angry. It reveals a lot.
Rich
@Yogi DMT,
The hatred and rage mentioned seems to be more like a mental state of being than a simple emotion.
Just as infatuation triggers a complete and utter change in mentality (and rationality), hatred and rage create a completely different mindset.
Therefore there is no reason to even look for rationality in these emotions, as it is quite clear that they have reactionary causes and their uses rarely fit the context that trigger them.
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