@Theaetetus,
So clean air, clean water, healthy soil, and access to resources have no intrinsic worth?
There are ways to "exploit" the environment without wasting it. There are good and bad ways to do anything.
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Mr. Fight the Power wrote:Most of these socialists are the socio-economic equivalent of MJA.
Now that is just blatant use of poisoning the well. Sure, many socialist may be off base, but so are many anarchists or others from other socio-economic thinking. The point is drawing on good ideas wherever they may come from.
Mr. Fight the Power wrote:
The notion that man must dominate nature is a biological fact. Men who attempt and succeed at dominating nature are more evolutionary fit.
Every creature that better exploits its environment will be evolutionary successful.
You are correct, but the species that over exploit their environment fail from an evolutionary perspective because they no longer have the resources to evolve.
Mr. Fight the Power wrote:The part that really bugs me is the "competitive nature" of modern capitalism, and how it "pits man against man". This line of thinking is endemic within socialists, and its about as subtle as Green Day lyrics. Market relations, and the division of labor it allows breeds a spontaneous cooperation. The farmer cannot support his current lifestyle on his own, so he tends his fields exclusively with the understanding that he will be able to trade his crops for furniture from a carpenter or clothes from a tailor.
It may not be the glorious social revolution that many utopian socialists want, but it is cooperation, it is the understanding that two can be their own ends simultaneously by freely consenting to be each others means.
The funny thing about your post, is that Murray Bookchin was a libertarian socialist that called for a society be built upon the ideas of division of labor and cooperation by rebuilding the notion of community. He saw the importance of socialism at the community level, not the ridiculous notion of being able to legislate social concerns at the national level. It is a mistake to equate bureaucratic socialism with libertarian socialism.
Khethil wrote:
- The passage seems to place, at the feet of the capitalist, the sole blame for over consumption. I'm not sure any economic system does any better or worse - environmentally. Consumption is an matter-of-existence for most lifeforms on our planet; it isn't endemic to any particular system, per say.
I don't think that it is so much calling out capitalism in general, but instead the form of capitalism that is currently practiced. It seems to me to be more of a critique of corporate capitalism that holds profit at all costs gospel, which undermines communities and individuals ability to live in a free and just society. To a corporation in New York, what value does a community have in Idaho other than consumable resources? There is a failure to see Idaho as a community with people trying to make a living.