24
   

Canada: the English & the French ...

 
 
George
 
  2  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2009 05:12 pm
@George,
George wrote:

ehBeth wrote:

Did Whitey get a radio program?

Yep. I guess you remember my speaking of him before.

Whitey -- then and now
http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/637/whitey.jpg
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2009 05:35 pm
@George,
Quote:
From a few years back :
How can you tell an American backpacker from a Canadian backpacker in
Europe?
The American has two Canadian flags sewn on his pack.


I know, George!
They'd go to considerable lengths to make their national identity 100% clear.
That what I was kinda trying to allude to, in my obscure, beating around the bush sort of way ...... Wink
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2009 06:39 pm
@fbaezer,
fbaezer wrote:


Quote:
Americans can go unnoticed in Canada, and Canadians can go unnoticed in the U.S.

It's no big deal
.

In Mexico, though, you can tell the difference.

Canadians are whiter (some times like a sheet of paper), smile a lot, and always remind you that they're Canadians, not Gringos.




Are only USAians "gringos"?

I'd have assumed I was one, too.
fbaezer
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2009 08:03 pm
@dlowan,
dlowan wrote:

fbaezer wrote:


Quote:
Americans can go unnoticed in Canada, and Canadians can go unnoticed in the U.S.

It's no big deal
.

In Mexico, though, you can tell the difference.

Canadians are whiter (some times like a sheet of paper), smile a lot, and always remind you that they're Canadians, not Gringos.




Are only USAians "gringos"?

I'd have assumed I was one, too.


You're not a Gringa, dlowan. You're Australiana.
Only USAians that call themselves "American" are Gringos. Gringo is a synonym for "americano", but we never use that word. A polite Mexican will say "estadounidense" (unitedstatesian) or "norteamericano". In the news, we use, mostly "estadounidense".
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2009 10:49 pm
@fbaezer,
I had some friends who went to Mexico every year during the 1960s and -70s (i lost track, so i don't know how long they continued the custom). They were mostly members of an informal biker "gang," who all had in common November birthdays. You didn't have to be a biker, or fit any other criterion to fit in, as long as you got along with some of them. I went a couple of times with some of them i knew.

One year (1976?), we drove to Houston, picked up a woman i knew for years and years, and then drove to Monterrey. We partied all night, and then took in turns to drive through the desert (beautiful at night) to Zacatecas. From there, we went to Guadalajara, where we spent a week in a pension. Years before, some of them had met a high school girl, and treated her respectfully (as apparently one could not rely on older tourists to do), and she introduced them to her family, including her father, an army officer. They had by then gotten lots of advice and introductions, so we made contact again, enjoyed their sophisticated, old world hospitality, and headed for the Pacific coast.

We ended up in Bara de Navidad, a resort town frequented by Mexicans (at least at that time), which meant it was super cheap by our standards. We rented a house for a ridiculously low sum. It was unfurnished, but it had a fridge and a range, and these were bikers--we had been driving for literally thousands of miles and roughing it, so it was pure luxury to have a roof over our heads and access to a hot shower.

Our neighbors were Canadians. They acted strangely, in our collective opinion, and we tended not to party with them or spend time with them. They kept bugging us to give a ride in our van up into the mountains. We would just blow them off with "maybe tomorrow," or "yeah, after we can get an oil change." After we had been there about a week, we went down the coast (up the coast?) to Mazatlan, and we were partying in a disco with this ranchero type, with the white levis and the tooled leather boots, and after a comment by our waiter, we asked him it it were true that he was a federale. He admitted it without demure, and then suggested that that explained why he had such good reefer. Eventually, one of us mentioned the Canadians, and he just laughed. He said to stay away from them, that it was a set-up. His comment was that the Canadians seemed more naive than the Americans, and would buy reefer from just about the first person who offered it to them. Either they got ripped off, or they were busted by someone like him. Then they'd set them up to entrap Americans, who he claimed were, in his experience, more cautious, only making contact through other Americans, or through Mexicans they had introductions to, or had gotten to know on their own. He said that his advice was to stay away from the Canadians. Even if it was a set-up, he said they were bad news, and would attract trouble, because they were such stumble bums, and were so obvious.

We had pretty well decided by that point that we didn't trust that bunch of Canadians, anyway. The federale treated us to lots of Sauza, and we smoked some prime joints with him, and he gave us some pointers on dealing with the federales and the army. The last thing he told us was that if we saw him in the daytime, he would be on duty, he wouldn't know us, and when he was on duty, he didn't have any gringo friends. We took that to heart.

The second time i went there, we went with some people who wanted to do the tourist thing, stayed in hotels, wanted to see all the sights--it was a drag. The first trip, though, was a gas. The exchange rate was 12 and half pesos to the dollar, and going where the Mexicans went, and avoiding the gringo tourist traps, we lived like kings. We avoided the Canadians.
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2009 11:40 pm
@fbaezer,
Well! You learn something every day!
0 Replies
 
fbaezer
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Dec, 2009 12:56 pm
@Setanta,
Oh, the jolly 70s!
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Dec, 2009 03:31 pm
@fbaezer,
I think things were not so jolly for everybody on the Gringo Trail . . . we avoided the impoverished hippies, too . . .
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Dec, 2009 03:33 pm
You know, this reminds me of something i wanted to ask you, but which i forgot last night. Was there, in the 70s, any sincere effort to stop the drug trade, which has since fallen to corruption? Or, is it a case of the corruption having always been there, but only now coming to light?

(Incidentally, i once heard an interview of a former Justice Minister--a recent one, maybe Fox's man?--who pointed out that if your police are corrupt, you would not be justified in deploying resources and spending money to make the police more efficient.)
fbaezer
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Dec, 2009 04:28 pm
@Setanta,
(derailing the thread)

There was at least one sincere effort in the 70s, called Operación Cóndor, in Sinaloa. With the military.
I lived in Sinaloa in the late 70s and can attest to it.
But then, the following governor was cahoots with the druglords, IMO.


Corruption has always been there (and is much less in the armed forces than in the police), but there had never been so much money involved as today (the shift from old pot to metamphetamines and chemical precursors: the narcos went from agriculture to industry).
0 Replies
 
tsarstepan
 
  2  
Reply Sun 3 Jan, 2010 04:32 pm
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jan, 2010 04:56 pm
@tsarstepan,
Damn.
Now now I can't stop singing Blame Canada!
I blame you for this, tsar.


(Catchy little song, isn't it? )
tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jan, 2010 04:57 pm
@msolga,
You're welcome msolga! Razz
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jan, 2010 05:01 pm
@tsarstepan,
Ha.

I hope I can restrain myself singing it in the streets! People will wonder, I'm certain ...
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jan, 2010 05:02 pm
@msolga,
I have to slow that down to read the italian (I'm a dolt). Jolly though.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jan, 2010 05:06 pm
@ossobuco,
Take care, osso.
It sort of lodges its self in your brain! Neutral
0 Replies
 
Mame
 
  2  
Reply Sun 3 Jan, 2010 05:11 pm
@Merry Andrew,
That's the common thought but is not actually true. I've been to Quebec several times, on business, and even though I studied French in high school, it was many years ago and it's no longer on the tip of my tongue. I wound up inserting some English in with my French (which is NOT the French we learned in school) and they not only took it in stride but often did the same (when they were speaking English). They knew I was Cdn and had no problem with me. I likewise had no problem with them. They all seemed to be very polite and friendly. Anyway, I didn't sense any antagonism.

I think most of the misconceptions about the 'hostilities" between the two groups are the doings of the press and a few politicians... not all Anglos or Francos even care that much about the issues (separation, language, etc) - in Prince Rupert (northern BC), why would anyone give it a thought?? There might be ONE francophone there, maybe two, so... not an issue.

My daughter did a 3 month exchange in Grade 10 with a teen from Lac Etchimin (sp?) and her parents spoke no English at all. It took her about two or three weeks to figure out the French they were speaking (it's like 17th Century English, ie archaic, apparently) and they told her they never listened to the separatists. They didn't want to leave Canada. I'm sure there are plenty of others, particularly in rural areas ,who feel similarly.

The only thing that bugged me about the Referendum was that we Anglos didn't get a vote. If they don't want to be here (and that's by no means certain), then why can't we vote whether we want them? I don't want them to leave, but if they want to, I'll help pack their bags (like I offered to do for my 12 yr old who threatened that) or give them $ to assist them. The point is, if it's a divisive move that will affect all Canadians, then all Canadians should get a vote.

Anyway, that issue is dead in the water right now and I'm glad. We have much to offer each other, and frequently enjoy much of the other's culture. They are as much an asset and an irritation as the rest of the cultures in Canada, so we can certainly say we're family!
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jan, 2010 07:34 pm
@Mame,
Good post, Mame.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 05:07 pm
All these references to Vancouver in the news over the past few days .... it struck me that Vancouver is quite an unusual name for a place. Could any of you Canadians tell me how Vancouver got its name? Was there a Mr Vancouver, perhaps? Smile
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 05:10 pm
@msolga,
Early growth
The Fraser Gold Rush of 1858 brought over 25,000 men, mainly from California, up the Fraser River, via New Westminster (founded Feb 14 1859) on the Fraser River which was the access to the BC interior, bypassing what would become Vancouver. Vancouver is among British Columbia's youngest cities; the first European settlement in what is now Vancouver was not until 1862 at McLeery's Farm on the Fraser River, just east of the ancient village of Musqueam in what is now Marpole. A sawmill established at Moodyville (now the City of North Vancouver) in 1863, began the city's long relationship with logging. It was quickly followed by mills owned by Captain Edward Stamp on the south shore of the inlet. Stamp, who had begun lumbering in the Port Alberni area, first attempted to run a mill at Brockton Point, but difficult currents and reefs forced the relocation of the operation to a point near the foot of Gore Street. This mill, known as the Hastings Mill, became the nucleus around which Vancouver formed. The mill's central role in the city waned after the arrival of the Canadian Pacific Railway (CPR) in the 1880s. It nevertheless remained important to the local economy until it closed in the 1920s.
The settlement which came to be called Gastown grew up quickly around the original makeshift tavern established by "Gassy" Jack Deighton in 1867 on the edge of the Hastings Mill property. In 1870, the colonial government surveyed the settlement and laid out a townsite, renamed "Granville" in honour of the then-British Secretary of State for the Colonies, Lord Granville. This site, with its natural harbour, was eventually selected as the terminus for the Canadian Pacific Railway to the disappointment of Port Moody, New Westminster and Victoria, all of which had vied to be the railhead. A railway was among the inducements for British Columbia to join the Confederation in 1871, but the Pacific Scandal and arguments over the use of Chinese labour delayed construction until the 1880s.

Incorporation
The City of Vancouver was incorporated on 6 April 1886, the same year that the first transcontinental train arrived. CPR president William Van Horne arrived in Port Moody to establish the CPR terminus recommended by Henry John Cambie, and gave the city its name in honour of George Vancouver. The Great Vancouver Fire on 13 June 1886, razed the entire city. The Vancouver Fire Department was established that year and the city quickly rebuilt.[27] Vancouver's population grew from a settlement of 1,000 people in 1881 to over 20,000 by the turn of the century and 100,000 by 1911.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Vancouver
 

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