Boy Trapped in Flying Balloon

Oh farmerman a gentleman just stated on CNN that this balloon was an internet kit not something that the father/"scientist" builded.

Nowif true all I need is to find this kit and see how must if state it can lift and the matter is closed.

Oh sorry I am assuming he read the kit manual and know how must it can lift so he is not off the hook if it can not lift more then a few pounds.

Why didnt you report his entire discussion. He said that "At sea level" it would just lift the kid on a tether box, but intimated that at the elevation of Colo it wouldnt have been as difficult. The only thing he stated is that he knew the kid wasnt inside at the higher elevations. Another balloonist stated about the same thing. "The kid wouldve been lifted by the balloon but, in order to get as high as it did, the kid would have fallen out".

You seem to want to accuse the father because (lets face it) he seems to be a raving squirrel. Isaw him on a clip from some TV show he was on and you want to punch his lights out hes such a douche bag. HOWEVER, that doesnt mean that he had anything to do with this. I think the older kid pulled it off and got his little brother to take the fall "for a tv show"

You seem to want to accuse the father because (lets face it) he seems to be a raving squirrel. Isaw him on a clip from some TV show he was on and you want to punch his lights out hes such a douche bag. HOWEVER, that doesnt mean that he had anything to do with this. I think the older kid pulled it off and got his little brother to take the fall "for a tv show"
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Sorry I did not see the guy until an hour ago or so and did not know about the TV show until after I ran my heeh calculations and came to the conclusion that it was a hoax by reason of those heeh calculations ALONE.

And of course the father would known what that balloon could or could not lift and if he was not dead center in this hoax his reaction to his son comment would not be as it was for all to see. in my opinion.

But all this came afterward I came to my conclusion base on the plain laws of the universe and common sense.

Would you like to back down now or wait until this whole thing come out in detail?

To sort of conclude based on some facts


1The father, nor will anybody be charged with anything. The issue was perhaps some monumental screw up and miunderstanding by the kids AND the parents. (This is from the latest news


2The ballons bouyancy WAS never an issue becauae several "Expwerts" had done calculations and (one guy even went to the specs of the balloon from its ad in magazines and the internet). The balloon WAS able to, by virtue of its volume (which was 2400 cu ft) able to carry the kid. However, what everyone said was that the balloon wouldnt have reached the altitude it did in Colo with a kid weighing 50 lb. The "expwerts" all felt that the kid fell out.

Oft times, when we get so smug about our math and our calculations, the second rule of physics is that you chck all your facts and numbers (It appears that your site's calcs were almost half off because the error in displacement was to add another 1200 cu ft of helium).
The additional bouyancy conveyed by the warmer temp and the elevation at ground level was the final factor that would allow the balloon to take off with the kid inside. THIS WAS the fact that the father had in mind, and he was familar enough with the lift potential of the "flying saucer"

As the news plays out, your "back of the envelope" calc had apparemntly missed something. AND to base your accusation of the father on a faulty calculation is poor forensic science, IMHO.(Usually when one does such calcs, one tries to develop a "window" of possible scenarios and ranges of bouyancies. Apparently all you did was come up ith a bouyancy of He at sea level and a volume of the balloon ( both of which were off by half an order)

Well, the guy on the blog claims to have done so. And he admits it was after the balloon landed. Easy to claim foreknowledge of past events, eh?

Good job, Bill! You came here after the balloon landed! Way to gain credibility.....

1The father, nor will anybody be charged with anything. The issue was perhaps some monumental screw up and miunderstanding by the kids AND the parents. (This is from the latest news


2The ballons bouyancy WAS never an issue becauae several "Expwerts" had done calculations and (one guy even went to the specs of the balloon from its ad in magazines and the internet). The balloon WAS able to, by virtue of its volume (which was 2400 cu ft) able to carry the kid. However, what everyone said was that the balloon wouldnt have reached the altitude it did in Colo with a kid weighing 50 lb. The "expwerts" all felt that the kid fell out.
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Keep saying it over and over and it might be turn into the truth<grin> but no amount of TV "experts" can change the laws of nature.

Oh I had some nice swamp land for sale you might be able to farm please send me a check and if you have any question on the worth of this farmland I will send you a statement from an expert.

Lord it amaze me what people are willing to buy into if they hear it from an "expert" on TV.

Now with the FAA involve the truth will come out and I will enjoy hearing you eat your postings concerning the experts<smile>.

Second how did you do listening to the experts on the stock market? For some strange reason I did not listen and my 401k did not go down a dollar in the last years.

TV experts heeh heeh heeh right back to you.

2The ballons bouyancy WAS never an issue becauae several "Expwerts" had done calculations and (one guy even went to the specs of the balloon from its ad in magazines and the internet).
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Experts experts you pick the experts however I will go with the laws of physics.

In any case below is a news story that they had found experts that claim the balloon could indeed not go up with the boy.

As I said who need experts when it is simple physic but what the hell as you seem to worship at the alter of experts here is one for you.
=================================================
Balloon at center of Falcon Heene drama not your average hot air balloon
By Rosemary Black
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER

Updated Friday, October 16th 2009, 1:02 AM

Both hot air and helium balloons typically are piloted by a pilot with a license. Related NewsArticlesFalcon Heene, 6, believed lost on runaway balloon found safe in his home after desperate searchThe homemade balloon contraption that soared through the air in eastern Colorado for several hours is vastly different from the giant hot air balloons that are seen at festivals and that are used for recreational purposes, experts say.

Nearly all the giant balloons that drift and bob through the air are hot air balloons that are filled with air and fueled by propane, explains Howard Freeman, executive producer of the Quick Chek New jersey Festival of Ballooning in Reddington, New Jersey. As the air inside the balloon heats up to a temperature higher than the outside air, the balloon rises, he explains. Helium balloons rise because helium is lighter than air, he explains. The contraption, owned by Richard and Mayumi Heene, may have risen even higher than it would have otherwise since the heat would have caused the helium to expand further, Freeman explains.

Both hot air and helium balloons typically are piloted by a pilot with a license, he says.

"A skilled pilot licensed by the Federal Aviation Authority can go to different altitudes and although he can't steer a hot air balloon, a pilot can get it going in the general direction that he wants," Freeman explains.

Hot air balloons generally have 70,000 cubic feet of volume, are seven stories high, and can carry 760 to 800 pounds, or about four adults, Freeman explains.
===============================================
The flying saucer-shaped silver balloon owned by the Heenes looked to be carrying about 1,500 cubic feet of helium, Freeman estimates. "Some experts are saying that it could not have carried anyone over 70 pounds," he says. "You figure that it takes about 1,000 cubic feet of helium to give you 40 pounds of lift."
===========================================

Helium balloons are flown by licensed pilots and if they are not, they could pose a potential problem to planes and helicopters, says Ken Tadolini, a hot air balloon pilot, FAA certified balloon repairman, and owner of Rocky Mountain Hot Air in Denver. They are used more for long distance, competition purposes, he says.

"This is the first time I have seen anything like this," he said of the Fort Collins contraption. "What is very disturbing is knowing the potential for disaster here. If anyone was in the balloons, they could have hit power lines. It was lucky that it had a really soft landing, nice and easy. Not five minutes later, in that same field right where the balloon landed, there was a dust devil that created a circular moving column of air and would have turned that balloon upside down if it had been landing."

Another potential problem if a balloon goes too high in the air is that its occupants can have difficulty breathing, Freeman explains. He said he believed the Heenes' balloon only ascended to 8,500 feet. "But between 10,000 and 12,500 feet, you can get hypoxia, which is the technical term for a lack of oxygen."



Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2009/10/15/2009-10-15_homemade_balloon_in_colorado_works_quite_differently_than_average_hot_air_balloo.html#ixzz0U74WeSIx

You seem to rely on your laws of physics from Newsppaper reporters and web sites of some high school kids. As I said (AND YOUVE NOT REFUTED) The EXPERTS calc's the helium volume at 2300 Cubic feet from the dimensions of lift off (not as it was descending) and from the very specs of the balloons manufacturer.
I think that the laws of physics are not a friend to BillRM's world

You are something, even looking at this tiny internet toy video you would know it not going to lift a 100 pounds or 50 pounds for that matter!

Look at this toy lifting off on the now released lift off Video and tell me with a striaght face this could get off the ground with a 6 year old in it or even a heavy cat for that matter<grin>

And where is the links to all those experts you are claiming are stating that the law of physic does not apply or the link to the kit manufactor of this toy that you are claiming list a lift off force of a 100 pounds?

Where are your links my friend for your silly statements as we had one "expert" on CNN and that seem all you need a TV expert. Straight forward math and physic that a 10 greader could do can tell anyone that this is a toy that have no ability to lift any real weight off the ground.

So where are your links??????? Let begin with the kit manufactor website.

why not play with yourself. Im through with you. Im not even interested in the topic and youre so bent on doin some chest thumping. Ive found enough from watching the news and Im satisfied that there are enough calcs out there that totally debunk yours. Why not go buy one of the saucers and test whether it holds 1000 or 2300 Cu ft, and whether the TP relationships are valid. When youre done , write me about 2500 words on what youve found. Im certain I shall be holding mine breath.

Toodles ya putz.

Sorry no need to test such a device as if the law of physic is so far off we have far more problems then a toy lifting a child off the ground or not!

Oh please take note when I ask for a few links of what he been claimings he does not wish to play any more but just wish to take his ball and run home.

He claimed many experts support of a hundred pound lift off force and that the kit manufactor claims the same and when I ask him to give me a few links to such experts and the kit/balloon manufactor he ran away.

Seem we had a secondary hoax here.

A law of "Physic" has to do with laxatives, whereas a law of "Physics" maybe what youre reaching for

So now, you are running to a typo as a defense. <LOL>

Where is the links for your claims of many experts supporting a 100 pound of lift off force for this toy balloon UFO and where is the kit manufacture website that also claimed this amazing force for such a tiny balloon?

Trying to win a discussion on the internet by claiming support that is not there is somewhat shameful and it seem that the only support you have is a scientist on CNN that should have his “slide ruler”/calculator taken away from him.

With wide spread googling I could not find one person that ran the numbers coming up with a force over 70 pounds maximum and that would be total force including the need to lift off the weight of the balloon.

The average estimate of the force of lift was in the range of 40 pounds total force and once more including the need to lift of the weight of the balloon.

Ok if would seem that you are busted if you cannot come up with your claimed links to those experts of yours.

Nobody cares, Bill.

Coming here after the balloon landed and crowing "I knew it! I knew it!" just sounds kinda pathetic.

So you are speaking for everyone for else on this website?

And it does not matter before or after the landing as the question is not if someone could do the numbers before anyone had a real solid knowledge of how big this toy happen to be but if the father had used his son to play a hoax on the whole nation. at great cost to the taxpayers.

The fact that this toy could not had gotten off the ground with a 6 years old and the father must had been aware of that fact before mean that it is a hoax.

I had a feeling you are not too bright but even so it not a hard of a concept for anyone even you to understand.

Sheriff: Charges Will 'Likely Be Filed' Against Balloon Boy's Parents
By Vickie Bane

Originally posted Saturday October 17, 2009 11:20 PM EDT
The Heene Family
Was it a hoax after all?

After a second interview late Saturday with Richard and Mayumi Heene " the parents of the now-infamous balloon boy " Larimer County, Colo., Sheriff Jim Alderden says that misdemeanor charges will now "likely be filed" against one or both the parents.

Alderden would not elaborate on what changed his mind from Friday, when he told reporters during a nationally televised press conference that he was "convinced" the family was telling the truth.

However, Alderden added that he would be checking with federal officials to see if they would be filing charges as well.

The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) was the first agency that the Heene's called Thursday to report their 6-year-old son Falcon was in a flying saucer-shaped balloon that escaped from the family's backyard.

Richard Heene, who has steadfastly maintained the balloon incident was not a publicity stunt, posted a sign on the door of his Fort Collins home late Friday saying he would not be giving further interviews, only to step outside on Saturday to tell reporters that a "big announcement" was coming.

The announcement turned out to be a rambling explanation about why he would from now on be taking questions from reporters submitted in written form to a box to be answered at a later time.

More is expected from the Sheriff on Sunday.

Well Farmerman now the expert stated that the balloon could not get off the ground with the child.

See what happen when you take the word of a expert without thinking for yourself even if they place the title of scientist under his smiling face on TV?

It never too late to start thinking for yourself Farmerman.

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CNN) -- As authorities confirmed the "balloon boy" saga was a hoax, they checked the vessel created by Richard Heene to see whether it could have actually carried his 6-year-old son Falcon.


The balloon is displayed at the sheriff's department in Fort Collins, Colorado, on Sunday.

1 of 3 During the incident Thursday, when Heene said his 37-pound son may have been inside the flying-saucer-shaped balloon, the sheriff's department contacted a specialist at Colorado State University to determine whether it could carry the child.

Based on the dimensions for the balloon that Heene provided at the time, the specialist "determined that it was, in fact, possible for this balloon to have launched," Larimer County Sheriff Jim Alderden told reporters Sunday.

But after they recovered the balloon and checked the actual measurements, authorities discovered "it was not capable of lifting off" with the boy on board, Alderden said.

The reason, according to the sheriff, is that the contraption weighs 18 pounds more than what Heene said. Watch sheriff say, "This is a hoax" »

Authorities have also tested the base part of the balloon, into which Heene said his son may have crawled.

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Alderden said that section consisted of a very thin piece of plywood and cardboard sides held together by string and duct tape.


"Certainly we wanted to question whether that was strong enough to support the weight of Falcon," he said.

Alderden said they came to a "bizarre" finding, that the section actually could handle 37 pounds without breaking. However, in order to go airborne with those 37 pounds inside, the base would need to be attached to a more powerful balloon, he said.
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No reason to be such a smug dick about it Bill.

No reason to be such a smug dick about it Bill.
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Why not Gentel?

Farmerman was so sure that someone with the title of scientist under his name on CNN could not be wrong and way wrong at that.

Anyone who could run simple numbers knew that this was a hoax from the first time we saw the real size of the balloon on TV.

That's what I've been saying.

You come here after the balloon has landed, and after the boy has been found, crowing "you fools, I knew all along!"

Suuure you did.