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Memphis gives gun permits to criminals

 
 
Reply Fri 13 Mar, 2009 10:04 am
Memphis 'Commercial Appeal' Uncovers Dark Secrets Among Gun Owners
Published: March 13, 2009
A & P

MEMPHIS A newspaper review of public records has found dozens of handgun permit recipients in Shelby County with histories of arrests or convictions for robbery, assault and other crimes.

The review by The Commercial Appeal of Memphis comes amid a statewide debate over public access to Tennessee handgun permit records, and the newspaper has stirred those discussions by posting a database of license holders on its Web site.

The state Legislature is considering a call to close the handgun records, with proponents arguing that open access violates the privacy of permit holders.

The database posted by The Commercial Appeal gives burglars "a lighted pathway to the homes of gun owners," said Chris Cox, a lobbyist for the National Rifle Association.

But open records advocates disagree.

"There needs to be public scrutiny over the permitting system ... by the media and others to ensure the system is working," said Brian Malte, state legislative director for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.

More than 32,000 Shelby County residents have handgun permits, and statewide, there are more than 220,000 license holders. The Commercial Appeal checked on 154 permit recipients, 28 of whom had their licenses revoked last year and 126 who appeared to have outstanding arrest warrants as of February.

The newspaper said at least 70 permit recipients had records of arrests or convictions on criminal charges before getting their handgun licenses. Kiandre Sims was licensed to carry a handgun in 2005, the newspaper said, when he kicked in a door of an ex-girlfriend's residence and sexually assaulted her. In 2007, he pleaded guilty to assault and attempted rape in that attack.

The state had renewed Sims' gun permit in 2004 despite two prior arrests and a 2001 protective order involving another woman. That order had expired when Sims renewed the license, but another was issued in 2005 and was overlooked by the state.

His gun permit finally was revoked last year.

Bernard Avery had been arrested 25 times " including 17 times as a juvenile " before getting a handgun permit in 2006. Charges for those arrests included assault, burglary and robbery.

Within weeks of getting the permit, Avery acknowledged involvement in a murder and was charged with a string of robberies. A murder charge against him was dismissed on a determination that he was mentally incompetent to stand trial.

His gun permit was revoked this month after The Commercial Appeal began asking about him.

Reginald Miller was arrested 11 times before getting a gun permit in 2006. His record includes a felony drug charge bargained down to a misdemeanor and three separate assault allegations from women who later declined to testify against him.

He pleaded guilty to a drug charge last year and is now wanted for probation violations. His handgun license was revoked this month following an inquiry from the Memphis paper.

Last year, WTVF-TV in Nashville reported that the state had lost access to the FBI national criminal database and was improperly renewing handgun permits for convicted felons. The Tennessean reported four months later that the state was slow to revoke the permits mistakenly issued to felons.

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Type: Discussion • Score: 2 • Views: 2,432 • Replies: 9
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nimh
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Mar, 2009 05:32 am
@BumbleBeeBoogie,
BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:
The database posted by The Commercial Appeal gives burglars "a lighted pathway to the homes of gun owners," said Chris Cox, a lobbyist for the National Rifle Association.

Eh - that doesnt make any sense, does it? Isnt the whole point gun defenders always trot out that having a gun will discourage burglars?

It would actually make more sense the other way round: release of the database gives burglars an advance warning which households not to target. So in that logic, if anything, it's the non-gun owners who should be worried by the publication.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Mar, 2009 09:12 am
In New Mexico (where BumbleBee lives) there is no permit required to openly carry a loaded firearm or to have a loaded firearm in your car.
An applicant for a concealed carry permit must be a resident of New Mexico and at least 21 years of age. Each permit specifies the category and caliber of handgun that may be carried, but is also valid for a smaller caliber. The applicant must complete a state approved training course that includes at least 15 hours of classroom and firing range time, and must pass a shooting proficiency test for that category and caliber of handgun. A permit is valid for four years, but license holders must pass the shooting proficiency test every two years.
0 Replies
 
Rockhead
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Mar, 2009 09:28 am
"Memphis 'Commercial Appeal' Uncovers Dark Secrets Among Gun Owners "


this is kinda misleading.

Shelby county is a rural county south of Nashville.

I lived there when concealed carry passed. It became much like Dodge City within six months. I worked with a guy (building cars) that wore his .45 on his hip all day as he welded.

I was invited to the Saturday (2) class to obtain a permit, but decided I dint belong there.
0 Replies
 
A Lone Voice
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Mar, 2009 02:43 pm
@BumbleBeeBoogie,
As usual, reporters can shape a story to influence the emotions of people:

Quote:

MEMPHIS A newspaper review of public records has found dozens of handgun permit recipients in Shelby County with histories of arrests or convictions for robbery, assault and other crimes.



Shouldn't we remain consistently fair here?

SOME of these permit holders may have not ever been convicted of any type of crime. But the reporter does not tell us about this; he/she lumps arrests and convictions together, perhaps to inflate the numbers and make a more compelling story?

Obviously, any criminal allowed to obtain a permit reveals a flawed system. But recognize most reporters have biases and agendas, just like the rest of us.

They're just a little better at concealing it...
kajabla
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 05:50 pm
@A Lone Voice,
A little further digging shows how badly the reporter lied - oops, I mean "mislead" - in her story.

There are nearly 300,000 concealed weapons permit holders in the state. The 154 permit holders that the 'Memphis Commercial Appeal' supposedly investigated were selected because they had a record. They also included folks with arrest warrants which means anyone with a warrant due to something as simple as unpaid traffic tickets could be in that number.

It is already illegal for a felon to get a permit. If ever this happens it is a mistake on the part of the police department. The rest of us gun owners are not guilty of anything as the morons writing this crap would like you to believe.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 08:04 pm
@BumbleBeeBoogie,
Quote:
MEMPHIS A newspaper review of public records has found dozens of handgun permit recipients
in Shelby County with histories of arrests or convictions for robbery, assault and other crimes.


US CONSTITUTION - SUPREME LAW OF THE LAND:
Amendment 14 -
Citizenship Rights. Ratified 7/9/1868.

" 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States,
and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States
and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or
enforce any law
which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of
citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty,
or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person
within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."


If Martha Stewart goes for a walk,
or goes fishing, she has as much right as anyone else
to defend herself from rapists and from cougars or bears.

People whose histories of violence prove that thay r intolerably dangerous
shoud be ISOLATED from the decent people.
Long prison sentences after felonious convictions will accomplsh the job admirably.





David

0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 09:10 pm
@kajabla,
kajabla wrote:
A little further digging shows how badly the reporter lied - oops, I mean "mislead" - in her story.

There are nearly 300,000 concealed weapons permit holders in the state. The 154 permit holders that the 'Memphis Commercial Appeal' supposedly investigated were selected because they had a record. They also included folks with arrest warrants which means anyone with a warrant due to something as simple as unpaid traffic tickets could be in that number.

It is already illegal for a felon to get a permit.
In my opinion, that is unConstitutional.
It is the equivalent of requiring people who r released from prison
to play Russian Roulette.
For many years and decades, thru out the 1800s
and well into the 1900s, we got along well enuf without gun control.
The police handled it.






kajabla wrote:
If ever this happens it is a mistake on the part of the police department.
The rest of us gun owners are not guilty of anything as the morons writing this crap would like you to believe.
WELCOME to the forum, Kajabla!!!!!
I am among the supporters of personal freedom in this forum.

This thread addresses what I call "the SAINTS & ANGELS" interpretation
of the Bill of Rights; i.e. that it was enacted ONLY to protect
the most perfectly immaculate of American citizens; the highest elite
and that it was the purpose of the 2nd Amendment to create,
in effect, an American SAMURAI society, wherein ONLY the elite
of the most perfect citizens had the right of self-defense.

The NRA is fond of calling for "law-abiding citizens" to have the right
to keep and bear arms. I object to that, in that such a class does not exist,
except for children so young as seldom to have left their homes.

Their are multiple invisible webs of laws: federal, state, county, city,
village, hamlet and sewer district that demand adherence.
These laws address many, many different, disparate aspects of human life.
"Ignorance of the law is no excuse."

In some cases, compliance with one law entails violation of OTHER laws.
In retrospect, I know that when I had my own law firm,
we unknowingly violated laws of whose existence we were not aware.
On this point, allow me to cite an incident in my experience:
1OOs of lawyers attended a seminar on Employment Law in NYC.
This was their area of professional concern.
In positions of elevated respect up on the stage
were super-eminent experts, very senior in their profession.
Questions were taken from the assembled lawyers in the audience,
qua how to answer their clients' questions as to their practices.
After the experts discussed one question for about 25 minutes,
considering federal and state statutory law, judicial cases in precedent
and administrative regulations, both federal and state,
thay reached a consensus of what to tell your client.
This was tacitly accepted without objection by the employment lawyers.

About 1O minutes later, as an after-thought,
a young lady behind me asked them whether implementation
of their advice woud violate the NY Executive Law.

Upon deliberation, all of the super-expert legal scholars
agreed (however grudgingly) that it woud indeed violate that statute,
exposing the perpetrators to civil liability.

My point is that the law is so hopelessly complex and vague
that even the most respected legal scholars cannot understand it
when thay consider and analyse it together, collectively.
Citizens who followed their advice woud no longer be abiding by the law;
i.e., the concept of "law abiding citizens" is a myth.

The Bill of Rights applies to EVERY citizen.

Government HAS the authority to ISOLATE and confine
people who have proven by their histories of criminal violence
that thay are intolerably dangerous. Simply handle it as it was in the early 1900s.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Thu 23 Jun, 2011 05:49 am
@BumbleBeeBoogie,
Constitutionally, neither Memphis nor any place else
has any jurisdiction to violate anyone 's Constitutional Rights.





David
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 05:38 am
@BumbleBeeBoogie,
BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:



MEMPHIS A newspaper review of public records has found dozens of handgun permit recipients in Shelby County with histories of arrests or convictions for robbery, assault and other crimes.




This was done in exchange for their promise to vote for democrats?
0 Replies
 
 

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