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Hillary Was My Candidate Of Choice

 
 
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 12:54 pm
but this is not necessary....let's just get on with it.... lots to do

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/11/12/politics/horserace/entry4596620.shtml?source=search_story
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Type: Discussion • Score: 4 • Views: 1,324 • Replies: 13
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Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 12:57 pm
We are all fortunate that your hopes were disappointed.
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  2  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 12:59 pm
@Setanta,
we'll never know will we?
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 01:19 pm
From the article:
Quote:
As voters left the polls on Election Day, many were asked how they would have voted if the election match-up were between Hillary Clinton and John McCain rather than Barack Obama and McCain. 52 percent said they would have backed the former Democratic candidate; 41 percent would have voted for McCain, wider than Obama’s 7-point margin over McCain.


52 plus 41 is 93. Where's the other 7 percent? As of now, according to CNN, Obama beat McCain 53% to 46% -- 53 being that number that is one greater than 52. This isn't to argue with you, Bear, since I get your point and know you're not defending the sentiment, but I saw a lot of comments at the bottom of the article that don't seem to get how meaningless those exit polls numbers are in determining how well Clinton might have done compared to Obama.
High Seas
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 01:24 pm
@FreeDuck,
Agree with Free Duck - those ex post exit polls are meaningless, esp. since lots of Republicans just plain stayed at home, not being too enthusiastic on McCain; but they would have gone to vote, imo, AGAINST Hillary IF she had been the Democratic candidate.
cjhsa
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 01:47 pm
Who cares? We're all screwed now.
High Seas
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 01:51 pm
@cjhsa,
Be positive, CJ. Think of the Russian army at Borodino - retreat, retreat, and wait for winter!
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 02:32 pm
@FreeDuck,
Quote:
From the article:
Quote:
As voters left the polls on Election Day, many were asked how they would have voted if the election match-up were between Hillary Clinton and John McCain rather than Barack Obama and McCain. 52 percent said they would have backed the former Democratic candidate; 41 percent would have voted for McCain, wider than Obama’s 7-point margin over McCain.



Quote:
52 plus 41 is 93. Where's the other 7 percent?


The other 7 percent did not know how they would have voted. It stands to reason that Hillary would have gotten at least some of those votes, certainly more than an additional 1%.

This poll indicates that Hillary would have done better than Obama.

As far as additional Republicans coming out to vote against Hillary-possibly. But the Republicans have been talking for years about how Hillary was universally hated, and that turned out not to be the case. So their assessment of how much their own rank and file members really hate her is open to question.
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 02:40 pm
@Blickers,
the rational 7% voted Kucinich.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 02:54 pm
@High Seas,
High Seas wrote:

Agree with Free Duck - those ex post exit polls are meaningless, esp. since lots of Republicans just plain stayed at home, not being too enthusiastic on McCain; but they would have gone to vote, imo, AGAINST Hillary IF she had been the Democratic candidate.


I don't think so. I think most conservatives were pretty universally opposed to Hillary when she seemed to be a lock as the Democratic choice. But the more Barack Obama's star rose, and the more they found out about him, the better Hillary looked. And, I think at the end, when it was obvious that a Democrat would likely prevail in the General election, I think most were really pulling for Hillary to be the Democratic nominee.
High Seas
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Nov, 2008 03:02 pm
@Foxfyre,
Foxfyre - as per Carl Rove, yes, lots of us wanted her to be the Dem nominee, but that was only because we thought she could be beaten, not because we liked her any more than Obama. Actually there was an interesting scene at the Abyssynian Church in Harlem couple of days ago, when the Clintons were announced: congregation rose politely and clapped, but kind of tip-of-fingers clapping.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Nov, 2008 11:55 am
@Blickers,
Blickers wrote:

The other 7 percent did not know how they would have voted.

... or would not have voted.

Quote:

This poll indicates that Hillary would have done better than Obama.

Maybe if Obama was the one to campaign until Nov. 4 only to be suddenly replaced by Clinton on the ballot. It's a hypothetical asking people to decide whether they would have voted for someone who didn't run vs. who they actually voted for given that they did run. Impossible to know if she really would have done better.

Quote:
But the Republicans have been talking for years about how Hillary was universally hated, and that turned out not to be the case. So their assessment of how much their own rank and file members really hate her is open to question.

Turned out not to be the case in NY, you mean? While I agree that she is not as universally hated as some would have us believe, I do think she is hated by conservatives, and most certainly would have been after enduring a national campaign against John McCain. I believe it would have been difficult for any Democrat to lose this year and Hillary most definitely would have won had she been the candidate, but I find it hard to believe that she would have gotten the turnout that Obama got, or that the campaign would have been as mild as at was, or that McCain would have chosen Palin, or, or, or.... any number of things.
Blickers
 
  1  
Reply Sun 16 Nov, 2008 11:51 pm
@FreeDuck,
Quote:
Turned out not to be the case in NY, you mean?


Turned out not to be the case for Democrats as well. Republican and conservative spokesmen have been characterizing Hillary for many years as some kind of radical feminist, out of touch with the realities of everyday people. Yet throughout the primaries it was Hillary who was popular with the older and blue collar workers, as opposed to Obama who was popular with those in and just out of college. True, we are talking about just Democrats here, but the truth of where Hillary's support was really from in the Democratic party was so completely at odds with the image put forth of her all these years that you have to wonder how much the image holds true even for Republicans and those who lean that way.

I don't expect many Republicans to actually like her, but at this point I doubt if they dislike her much more than they dislike any other major figure of the Democratic party. The idea of additional battalions of Republicans miraculously arising out of sickbeds just to vote against Hillary is part of a stereotype the Democratic primaries proved to be fallacious.

As far as the poll being hypothetical, I would point out that in the last days the polls varied quite a bit from each other. If I had my choice for accuracy, I would bet on the accuracy of the answers given for people who have already showed up to vote over those who claim they will, or the answers they give about choices not on the ballot.

0 Replies
 
High Seas
 
  1  
Reply Sat 22 Nov, 2008 03:09 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta - you would know the answer to this: what is the order of succession? My vague recollection is that it goes President>VP>Speaker of the House>Pres. pro tem of Senate>Secretaries of State>Defense>Treasury>Justice

If that's correct, then only 4 lives stand between Mrs Clinton and the Presidency. If I were underwriting life insurance policies for any of those 4 I would discontinue them on January 20th - assuming she's confirmed by the Senate, that is.
0 Replies
 
 

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