Cobb!

He was a lousy human being.

"He was the strangest of all our national sports idols. But not even his disagreeable character could destroy the image of his greatness as a ballplayer. Ty Cobb was the best. That seemed to be all he wanted."
- Jimmy Cannon

Jim Thorpe.

Best football player of his time ... even played kicker, I think. Also played professional baseball for many years. Plus, he competed in Track and Field, and won the Olympic decathlon and pentathlon.

Versatile, yes, and there's something to be admired in a renaissance man, but I'd say Cobb simply excelled him - I mean, you couldn't call Thorpe the greatest at any particular thing, nor did his myriad of achievements translate well outside of sports.

Whereas Cobb was a man of steel resolve, fanaticism, and cunning, beyond being a titan on the field Thorpe was more of a curiosity or human-interest story.

As he most likely was considered as the best player of the dead-ball era...wonder what he would have done in live-ball era.

After his second year of seeing major-league hitting (Detroit Tigers), he hit for a .316 avg. and then never hit below that again. He was credited with setting 90 Major League Baseball records during his career. He still holds several records as of 2007, including the highest career batting average (.366) and most career batting titles with 12 (or 11, depending on source). He retained many other records for almost a half-century or more, including most career hits until 1985.

However, as a person he was not a hall-of-famer. He had an uncontrollable temper and was a vicious racist. He was criminally involved
in at least one reported incident: "Cobb once slapped a black elevator operator for being "uppity." When a black night watchman intervened, Cobb pulled out a knife and stabbed him (The matter was later settled out of court). *Hill, John Paul (November 18, 2002). Ty Cobb (1886-1961). New Georgia Encyclopedia.

"Sure, I fought," said an unrepentant Cobb in a revealing quote. "I had to fight all my life just to survive. They were all against me. Tried every dirty trick to cut me down, but I beat the bastards and left them in the ditch."

It's pretty hard to pinpoint one guy as the best athlete ever, comparing one vs. another in a different sport.

And yet I've managed! I mean, nobody to my knowledge has ever taken it as far as he did, personally and philosophically, and had the results to show for it, in the dominant sport of the century in which he/she lived.

I mean, now you've got certain anatomies for certain sports, little jockeys, tall basketball players, and the draw on the population is such that they can make whole teams of differentially suited individuals. In Cobb's case it stands to reason that his success could have been in any of several fields/sports - his body was more than adequate but existed as a tool of his mighty will...

I agree with you. Let's not forget how fast he was. I believe he was clocked running the bases in a 1900's wool uniform and spikes in 12.3 seconds. Think about this....12.3 seconds....that's 120 yeards with 3 turns in it. And if you ever read the book Cobb by Al Stump (I recommend it, but it's not the authoritative version. Stump would have you believe he lived with Cobb for months, but did not. Stump and Cobb only would meet in person to discuss final matters of publishing at intervals. Otherwise, their correspondence was nothing more than Cobb's recorded voice mailed to Stump.) Cobb also tried his hand at football during practices. Touched the ball twice and scored two touchdowns.

I would also like to say this much, the legend left by anybody (be it an athlete or politician) is written by the media. If Ty Cobb had played in New York, he would be the greatest player ever without conversation. The fact is that he played in a small market for the day and was so good that people jumped all over anything he did wrong. If you think that's false, look at the New York sports media today? It is out of control. Ty Cobb, who plays in this up and coming city called Detroit, is the best. That did not sell as many papers as "Ty Cobb, hated by millions, who viciously stalks and kills and calls it sport" sold more.

The truth of the matter is that people will believe what they want to believe. You cannot look at Ty Cobb's numbers, without prejudice, and not call him the greatest. His hitting, base-running, fielding, and arm were all exceptional. He was mentally ahead of the field. He was the manager of the Tigers and the Tigers set the record, which still stands today, for the highest team batting average. This means that he could make other players better, something that really separates good from great. But like I said, if you argue against this, it is because you don't really want to know the truth and you don't want your fragile hallucination of reality to be questioned. Because once one thing is proven false in your life, the whole house of cards might come tumbling down. Well whatever, that's your problem.

As for being a racist....maybe he was...I don't know that for sure and neither do you. I do know this. He was born in the backwoods of Georgia in 1886 during reconstruction. I don't think any Georgian born in that time looked too kindly upon Former Slaves and/or Yankees. There were a lot of rifts in the South at that time. But once again, let's not look at the facts. Let's only hold on to your frail opinions because they're easier to deal with.