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Afraid of death

 
 
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 07:28 pm
Hello everyone! I'm new to this forum but wanted to get some feedback and insight to a problem I have. I'm 21 years old and I have an obsessive fear of death. I never really obsessed or worried much about dying until after my daughter was born a year ago. Now I worry about death at least 10 times in one day. I believe in God and Jesus and yet I'm still afraid of dying. I don't feel I have done anything so bad in my life that I would have a negative afterlife, so that's not what's making so afraid to die. I worry that if I die my daughter would never know who I am. I worry my husband would remarry someone who wouldn't have our daughter's best interest at heart. I just started counseling a couple of weeks ago for this problem (as well as panic attacks which started around the same time this fear of death did). My counselor is focusing more on other issues so I feel pretty helpless in dealing with this. I'm not sure if this is the right forum to post this in or not, I just really wanted any advice or thoughts that any of you may have on this. I'm not "at risk" for death by any means. I'm in great shape, but I still worry about it constantly.
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Ragman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 07:44 pm
Welcome to A2K. Please feel free to unburden yourself here. This is a fine forum with some very helpful caring people. You can post this type of thread here or in Relationship Category.

The emotions that you outlined are called an obsession or, perhaps, even a phobia. More importantly than the correct label is understanding the emotions. Allow your therapist to help you work that out over time. Be patient with the process. You might need to speak up in your therapist sessions and let them know about this anxiety and fear of death. If it is important (and it definitely IS), you need to redirect the therapist to working on this issue.

Eventually with therapy you'll learn a new way to deal with this anxiety. It's very hard emotionally being a new mother at the age of 21...perhaps being a new bride, also? I'll bet there was something learned about fear and anxiety ..maybe part of your upbringing.

Also, you mentioned issues about not trusting your hubby with your daughter's welfare if you were to pre-decease him? Are you still married and living with him? Perhaps you can tell us why you feel that way? Is it based in reality or just a feeling you have?
0 Replies
 
anorthcutt
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 07:55 pm
Thanks for your reply. I started my counseling for this fear of death a couple of weeks ago. I'm very open with my counselor and have told her everything about the way I'm feeling. She keeps focusing more on my relationship with my husband more then anything though. You mentioned anxiety possibly being caused my being a young mother and that is part of it. I'm also fairly newlywed (our 1st anniversary is on the 18th). You questioned why I worry about my daughter's welfare if I were to pass away. My husband and I are still married and live together. However, here's our current situation. I work full time and he stays home with our daughter. He meets her basic needs but doesn't show her the affection and attention she needs. I've talked with him about this several times and nothing has changed. I guess that's a big factor. I do everything for our family. I support us financially, I clean and cook, and as soon as I get home take care of my daughter. I love my husband hence the reason I'm still with him, but our current situation is really causing a lot of anxiety for me. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
0 Replies
 
Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 07:56 pm
Re: Afraid of death
An obsessive fear of death is very common, to the point whee it could be considered normal, I would not worry about it too much.

I absolutely hate and fear death too!

Death Stinks!

You've got every right to fear / hate / loath / despise death.

Death Sucks Donkey Balls!
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 08:03 pm
anorthcutt wrote:
Thanks for your reply. I started my counseling for this fear of death a couple of weeks ago. I'm very open with my counselor and have told her everything about the way I'm feeling. She keeps focusing more on my relationship with my husband more then anything though. You mentioned anxiety possibly being caused my being a young mother and that is part of it. I'm also fairly newlywed (our 1st anniversary is on the 18th). You questioned why I worry about my daughter's welfare if I were to pass away. My husband and I are still married and live together. However, here's our current situation. I work full time and he stays home with our daughter. He meets her basic needs but doesn't show her the affection and attention she needs. I've talked with him about this several times and nothing has changed. I guess that's a big factor. I do everything for our family. I support us financially, I clean and cook, and as soon as I get home take care of my daughter. I love my husband hence the reason I'm still with him, but our current situation is really causing a lot of anxiety for me. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.




I am wondering what your husband's own parenting was like?


It can be very hard to give what we have not received......


Is HE happy with the quality of care he gives your daughter?


This is, believe it or not, something we can learn, but usually not until we have looked at our own experiences of being parented as a child.


It can help to see someone skilled at helping parents build parenting skills, often working with a video, and also skilled at working with the things that prevent us from being the parents we want to be.


What exactly are you noticing about his care of your daughter that worries you?


Could it be that he is just doing things DIFFERENTLY from you, not worse?
0 Replies
 
Ragman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 08:06 pm
Glad to see your reply. You have my sincere sympathy. Frankly, it sounds like an immense burden. It is a lot to be a new mother AND new wife..AND be sole bread-winner. You need to keep dialogue coming in therapy AND at home. Let your hubby know what you need but do try (if you can) not to accuse or put him on the defensive. This is a delicate balance because you are understandably anxious. Understand that what you are experiencing could be a 'normal" response to an abnormal situation. I could not say for sure, but it sounds that way from your description. Allow your therapist to help you out with specifics there. What we can do here is offer some emotional support.

Even under normal circumstances, you have a lot on your hands while LEARNING about parenting and gaining new parenting skills. Reading what you describe here briefly about your hubby's responses, it sounds like he needs some parenting lessons. Maturity for him comes at a price now. Your anxiety seems to not be totally out of the blue.
0 Replies
 
anorthcutt
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 08:15 pm
Thanks again for your replies. It really helps to just get things out and talk to other people, especially when this topic makes me feel like I'm "crazy". When I do talk to my husband I try my best to let him know how certain things make me feel instead of just coming at him. I don't yell at him or anything like that because then we both get on the defensive. His care for our daughter is a little strange. It is different then mine, and I can accept that, but there have been times he's told me he's left her in her room crying because he was tired and wanted to take a nap. In my opinion that's not acceptable. That being said, on the topic of my husband's childhood he had a very rough one. His mom left him and his sister when he was 2 and she was not in his life at all (no phone calls, cards, nothing) until he was close to 12. His dad and his stepmom raised him and they were very loving towards him and his sister. Once he got back in touch with his mom him and his sister went and lived with her and the entire family situation was different. They were not loving to each other and his mom tried to buy them everything they wanted to make up for never having been there (it's still like that to this day). I wanted to add also, my husband is dealing with the recent death of his father. His father committed suicide in June so I know he's going through alot of depression right now. However, he has antidepressants but he won't take them and he refuses to go to therapy.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 08:59 pm
Damn.


That's tough.



You know, the thing that really helps with not having bad parenting affect our own parenting is the ability to reflect upon it.


Is your husband amenable to quiet discussion about how it feels to be a dad, and what he wants to be like as a dad vs what he got?




It is a bummer he is leaving your daughter to cry......



Is he at least getting plenty of exercise? Does he talk to anyone other than you?



Here's an interesting website for you both, maybe, to look at:



http://www.circleofsecurity.org/
0 Replies
 
Eorl
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 09:41 pm
Re: Afraid of death
anorthcutt wrote:
Hello everyone! I'm new to this forum but wanted to get some feedback and insight to a problem I have. I'm 21 years old and I have an obsessive fear of death. ......
My counselor is focusing more on other issues .....


I think there is probably a good reason for that. Anxiety extremes after having a child are common, as is your assumption that the cause you attribute to the anxiety to actually be the cause, while it probably isn't. I'd recommend trusting the therapist and follow where he/she wants to lead you, at least until you're sure he/she completely failed.
0 Replies
 
Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 12:11 am
Re: Afraid of death
anorthcutt wrote:
Hello everyone! I'm new to this forum but wanted to get some feedback and insight to a problem I have. I'm 21 years old and I have an obsessive fear of death. I never really obsessed or worried much about dying until after my daughter was born a year ago. Now I worry about death at least 10 times in one day. I believe in God and Jesus and yet I'm still afraid of dying. I don't feel I have done anything so bad in my life that I would have a negative afterlife, so that's not what's making so afraid to die. I worry that if I die my daughter would never know who I am. I worry my husband would remarry someone who wouldn't have our daughter's best interest at heart. I just started counseling a couple of weeks ago for this problem (as well as panic attacks which started around the same time this fear of death did). My counselor is focusing more on other issues so I feel pretty helpless in dealing with this. I'm not sure if this is the right forum to post this in or not, I just really wanted any advice or thoughts that any of you may have on this. I'm not "at risk" for death by any means. I'm in great shape, but I still worry about it constantly.
- I agree with him because of hope.
- Regardless of whether hope remains an idealization or whether hope becomes an actualization.
- Survival is linked with hope and for some it will supersede any level of torture.
- In fact all the worlds' religions are built on hope masquerading as faith.
0 Replies
 
Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 12:12 am
Re: Afraid of death
anorthcutt wrote:
Hello everyone! I'm new to this forum but wanted to get some feedback and insight to a problem I have. I'm 21 years old and I have an obsessive fear of death. I never really obsessed or worried much about dying until after my daughter was born a year ago. Now I worry about death at least 10 times in one day. I believe in God and Jesus and yet I'm still afraid of dying. I don't feel I have done anything so bad in my life that I would have a negative afterlife, so that's not what's making so afraid to die. I worry that if I die my daughter would never know who I am. I worry my husband would remarry someone who wouldn't have our daughter's best interest at heart. I just started counseling a couple of weeks ago for this problem (as well as panic attacks which started around the same time this fear of death did). My counselor is focusing more on other issues so I feel pretty helpless in dealing with this. I'm not sure if this is the right forum to post this in or not, I just really wanted any advice or thoughts that any of you may have on this. I'm not "at risk" for death by any means. I'm in great shape, but I still worry about it constantly.
- I agree with him because of hope.
- Regardless of whether hope remains an idealization or whether hope becomes an actualization.
- Survival is linked with hope and for some it will supersede any level of torture.
- In fact religions are built on hope masquerading as faith.
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 10:31 am
Not everyone believes in the bible, of course, but it is interesting to note that the book of revelation promises a time when "death will be no more" (Revelation 21:4)

In fact, if one reflects on the Genesis account, it is evident that if Adam and Eve had not sinned, they and their descendants would still be alive. If that indeed was God's purpose for the earth, do you not think that he will one day fulfil that purpose?

In that there is hope for the living and the dead.

_________________________________
Let us shun any hypothesis that makes man a puppet and God a tyrant crueler than any in history. - Erasmus
0 Replies
 
Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 11:23 am
Anorthcutt--

Welcome to A2K.

Right now your "rational" mind has wandered into a very un-rational place--the Funhouse of Death--and you don't like this one bit.

You're right to be concerned about this. Intrusive thoughts are hell to live with.

You've found a well qualified guide who will lead you out of your un-rational place--if you follow directions.

Before you can see the way out of the Funhouse, you have to see where you are. Your fear of death has you so preoccupied that you can't recognize exit doors and windows with long views and the Funhouse is dark and steamy....

Your therapist is helping you explore the Funhouse. Don't worry. Once you get the layout of the Funhouse clear in your head, you'll be able to find the exit.

Feel free to vent here. You're carrying a lot on your shoulders.
0 Replies
 
Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 12:18 pm
Oh Pooh! I was really tired when I made my posts. My second post # 2937352 was intended for another thread altogether and my first one #
2937165 ended up being foreshortened for reasons of super sleepiness.

Neo if your post was in part or in whole a response to my second post, then some amusement is in order.
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 12:38 pm
Its that old adage:

"I know you think you understand what you believe I said but I am not sure you realize that what I said was not what I meant."

Happens a lot after age 40, Chumly.

Then something else happens, but I forgot what that is.
0 Replies
 
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 12:59 pm
anorthcutt,

Forget "religion" and "therapy" !!!

You experience death every night when "self" seems to depart into the void every time you go to sleep to re-appear the next morning. Why worry about its failure to re-attend ?

I think it was Nietzche or Heideggar who said that "will" is about facing up to the inevitability of death. You can either (1) sit around and mope
(2) invest in a mythological "afterlife" or (3) get on with what you have
to the full.
0 Replies
 
Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 01:15 pm
- There are two differences between nightly sleep and permanent death: for one there are dreams, for two there is the comfort of knowing you'll wake up.

- Also you can just as easily argue all is for naught given all is impermanent http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism


Dust in Wind Lyrics from Kansas (cliché I know)

I close my eyes, only for a moment, and the moment's gone
All my dreams, pass before my eyes, a curiosity
Dust in the wind, all they are is dust in the wind.
Same old song, just a drop of water in an endless sea
All we do, crumbles to the ground, though we refuse to see

Dust in the wind, all we are is dust in the wind

http://www.spynets.com/lyrics/lyrics_details.php?ID=315
0 Replies
 
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 05:29 pm
Chumly,

Dreaming constitutes less than one third of "sleep" and even then who can claim to always recognize or "like" the "self" or other characters within the dream ? Most of the night is spent in complete oblivion equivalent to that state we might have experienced when anaesthetized for a hospital procedure. My experience of this is a total gap in memory.

As for the "comfort of waking" I cannot stress too strongly the dismay expressed by an elderly relative of mine with a terminal illness, whenever she woke to find she was "still here". Its dying thats the problem...not death.
0 Replies
 
Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 07:25 pm
I feel there is a difference between someone pointing a gun at my head as compared to preparing to sleep for the evening, but perhaps it's arguable as a perceptual not actual difference.

I am sorry to hear that your terminally ill elderly relative feels that the negatives outweigh the positives. Understandably enough not all feel that way, albeit I can understand the sentiment, especially in light of the negating effects of time. Entropy will have the final say even if man finds a way to circumvent our present mortality.

In any case the following might be of interest (if you have not already read about it)
Quote:
WELLESLEY, Mass. (AP) -- Ray Kurzweil doesn't tailgate. A man who plans to live forever doesn't take chances with his health on the highway, or anywhere else.
As part of his daily routine, Kurzweil ingests 250 supplements, eight to 10 glasses of alkaline water and 10 cups of green tea. He also periodically tracks 40 to 50 fitness indicators, down to his "tactile sensitivity.'' Adjustments are made as needed.
"I do actually fine-tune my programming,'' he said.
The famed inventor and computer scientist is serious about his health because if it fails him he might not live long enough to see humanity achieve immortality, a seismic development he predicts in his new book is no more than 20 years away.
It's a blink of an eye in history, but long enough for the 56-year-old Kurzweil to pay close heed to his fitness. He urges others to do the same in "Fantastic Voyage: Live Long Enough to Live Forever.''
The book is partly a health guide so people can live to benefit from a coming explosion in technology he predicts will make infinite life spans possible.
Kurzweil writes of millions of blood cell-sized robots, which he calls "nanobots,'' that will keep us forever young by swarming through the body, repairing bones, muscles, arteries and brain cells. Improvements to our genetic coding will be downloaded via the Internet. We won't even need a heart.
The claims are fantastic, but Kurzweil is no crank. He's a recipient of the $500,000 Lemelson-MIT prize, which is billed as a sort of Academy Award for inventors, and he won the 1999 National Medal of Technology Award. He has written on the emergence of intelligent machines in publications ranging from Wired to Time magazine. The Christian Science Monitor has called him a "modern Edison.'' He was inducted into the Inventors Hall of Fame in 2002. Perhaps the MIT graduate's most famous inventions is the first reading machine for the blind that could read any typeface.
During a recent interview in his company offices, Kurzweil sipped green tea and spoke of humanity's coming immortality as if it's as good as done. He sees human intelligence not only conquering its biological limits, including death, but completely mastering the natural world.
"In my view, we are not another animal, subject to nature's whim,'' he said.
Critics say Kurzweil's predictions of immortality are wild fantasies based on unjustifiable leaps from current technology.
"I'm not calling Ray a quack, but I am calling his message about immortality in line with the claims of other quacks that are out there.'' said Thomas Perls, a Boston University aging specialist who studies the genetics of centenarians.
Sherwin Nuland, a bioethics professor at Yale University's School of Medicine, calls Kurzweil a "genius'' but also says he's a product of a narcissistic age when brilliant people are becoming obsessed with their longevity.
"They've forgotten they're acting on the basic biological fear of death and extinction, and it distorts their rational approach to the human condition,'' Nuland said.
Kurzweil says his critics often fail to appreciate the exponential nature of technological advance, with knowledge doubling year by year so that amazing progress eventually occurs in short periods.
His predictions, Kurzweil said, are based on carefully constructed scientific models that have proven accurate. For instance, in his 1990 book, "The Age of Intelligent Machines,'' Kurzweil predicted the development of a worldwide computer network and of a computer that could beat a chess champion.
"It's not just guesses,'' he said. "There's a methodology to this.''
Kurzweil's been thinking big ever since he was little. At age 8, he developed a miniature theater in which a robotic device moved the scenery. By 16, the Queens, N.Y., native built his own computer and programmed it to compose original melodies.
His interest in health developed out of concern about his own future. Kurzweil's grandfather and father suffered from heart disease, his father dying when Kurzweil was 22. Kurzweil was diagnosed with Type 2 diabetes in his mid-30s.
After insulin treatments were ineffective, Kurzweil devised his own solution, including a drastic cut in fat consumption, allowing him to control his diabetes without insulin.
His rigorous health regimen is not excessive, just effective, he says, adding that his worst sickness in the last several years has been mild nasal congestion.
In the past decade, Kurzweil's interests in technology and health sciences have merged as scientists have discovered similarities.
"All the genes we have, the 20,000 to 30,000 genes, are little software programs,'' Kurzweil said.
In his latest book, Kurzweil defines what he calls his three bridges to immortality. The "First Bridge'' is the health regimen he describes with co-author Dr. Terry Grossman to keep people fit enough to cross the "Second Bridge,'' a biotechnological revolution.
Kurzweil writes that humanity is on the verge of controlling how genes express themselves and ultimately changing the genes. With such technology, humanity could block disease-causing genes and introduce new ones that would slow or stop the aging process.
The "Third Bridge'' is the nanotechnology and artificial intelligence revolution, which Kurzweil predicts will deliver the nanobots that work like repaving crews in our bloodstreams and brains. These intelligent machines will destroy disease, rebuild organs and obliterate known limits on human intelligence, he believes.
Immortality would leave little standing in current society, in which the inevitability of death is foundational to everything from religion to retirement planning. The planet's natural resources would be greatly stressed, and the social order shaken.
Kurzweil says he believes new technology will emerge to meet increasing human needs. And he said society will be able to control the advances he predicts as long as it makes decisions openly and democratically, without excessive government interference.
But there are no guarantees, he adds.
Meanwhile, Kurzweil refuses to concede the inevitably of his own death, even if science doesn't advance as quickly as he predicts.
"Death is a tragedy,'' a process of suffering that rids the world of its most tested, experienced members -- people whose contributions to science and the arts could only multiply with agelessness, he said.
Kurzweil said he's no "cheerleader'' for unlimited scientific progress and added he knows science can't answer questions about why eternal lives are worth living. That's left for philosophers and theologians, he said.
But to him there's no question of huge advances in things that make life worth living, such as art, cultural, music and science.
"Biological evolution passed the baton of progress to human cultural and technological development,'' he said.
Lee Silver, a Princeton biologist, said he'd love to believe in the future as Kurzweil sees it, but the problem is, humans are involved.
The instinct to preserve individuality, and to gain advantage for yourself and children, would survive any breakthrough into biological immortality -- which Silver doesn't think is possible. The gap between the haves and have-nots would widen and Kurzweil's vision of a united humanity would become ever more elusive, he said.
"I think it would require a change in human nature,'' Silver said, "and I don't think people want to do that.''


http://www.livescience.com/health/ap_Kurzweil_050213.html
0 Replies
 
hanno
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Nov, 2007 08:11 pm
I've believed the hereafter would be like before I was born since I was four. Got no insight on the altruistic part-not really my thing. But two things make it bearable. Firstoff-the fightin' ethos-I live my life in such a way that I can be reasonably sure that if it happens it won't be a drawn out affair. Second-science-we get stronger for the first 25 years, so it stands to reason that we can find a way to keep that strength.
0 Replies
 
 

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