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Mon 11 Jun, 2007 07:52 pm
1)Who is the father of Joseph?
MAT 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
LUK 3:23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli.
2)Which first--beasts or man?
GEN 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
GEN 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
GEN 2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
GEN 2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
3)How many stalls and horsemen?
KI1 4:26 And Solomon had forty thousand stalls of horses for his chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen.
CH2 9:25 And Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen; whom he bestowed in the chariot cities, and with the king at Jerusalem.
4)Human vs. ghostly impregnation
ACT 2:30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;
MAT 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.
5)The sins of the father
ISA 14:21 Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.
DEU 24:16 The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.
6)The shape of the earth
ISA 40:22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:
MAT 4:8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;
Astromical bodies are spherical, and you cannot see the entire exterior surface from anyplace. The kingdoms of Egypt, China, Greece, Crete, sections of Asia Minor, India, Maya (in Mexico), Carthage (North Africa), Rome (Italy), Korea, and other settlements from these kingdoms of the world were widely distributed.
7)Jesus' last words
Matt.27:46,50: "And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, "Eli, eli, lama sabachthani?" that is to say, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" ...Jesus, when he cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost."
Luke23:46: "And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, "Father, unto thy hands I commend my spirit:" and having said thus, he gave up the ghost."
John19:30: "When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, "It is finished:" and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost."
8)Judas died how?
"And he cast down the pieces of silver into the temple and departed, and went out and hanged himself." (Matt. 27:5)
"And falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all of his bowels gushed out." (Acts 1:18)
Only eight? More like 800, heh?
Here are some examples:
Genesis
God creates light and separates light from darkness, and day from night, on the first day. Yet he didn't make the light producing objects (the sun and the stars) until the fourth day (1:14-19). 1:3-5
God spends one-sixth of his entire creative effort (the second day) working on a solid firmament. This strange structure, which God calls heaven, is intended to separate the higher waters from the lower waters. 1:6-8
Plants are made on the third day before there was a sun to drive their photosynthetic processes (1:14-19). 1:11
In an apparent endorsement of astrology, God places the sun, moon, and stars in the firmament so that they can be used "for signs". This, of course, is exactly what astrologers do: read "the signs" in the Zodiac in an effort to predict what will happen on Earth. 1:14
"He made the stars also." God spends a day making light (before making the stars) and separating light from darkness; then, at the end of a hard day's work, and almost as an afterthought, he makes the trillions of stars. 1:16
"And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth." 1:17
God commands us to "be fruitful and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over ... every living thing that moveth upon the earth." 1:28
"I have given you every herb ... and every tree ... for meat." 1:29
God makes the animals and parades them before Adam to see if any would strike his fancy. But none seem to have what it takes to please him. (Although he was tempted to go for the sheep.) After making the animals, God has Adam name them all. The naming of several million species must have kept Adam busy for a while. 2:18-20
God's clever, talking serpent. 3:1
God walks and talks (to himself?) in the garden, and plays a little hide and seek with Adam and Eve. 3:8-11
God curses the serpent. From now on the serpent will crawl on his belly and eat dust. One wonders how he got around before -- by hopping on his tail, perhaps? But snakes don't eat dust, do they? 3:14
God curses the ground and causes thorns and thistles to grow. 3:17-18
God kills some animals and makes some skin coats for Adam and Eve. 3:21
God expels Adam and Eve from the garden before they get a chance to eat from that other tree -- the tree of life. God knows that if they do that, they well become "like one of us" and live forever. 3:22-24
Cain is worried after killing Abel and says, "Every one who finds me shall slay me." This is a strange concern since there were only two other humans alive at the time -- his parents! 4:14
"And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD." 4:16
"And Cain knew his wife." That's nice, but where the hell did she come from? 4:17
Lamech kills a man and claims that since Cain's murderer would be punished sevenfold, whoever murders him will be punished seventy-seven fold. That sounds fair. 4:23-24
"And to Seth ... was born a son." Where'd he find his wife? 4:26
God created a man and a woman, and he "called their name Adam." So the woman's name was Adam, too! 5:2
The first men had incredibly long life spans. 5:5, 5:8, 5:11, 5:14, 5:17, 5:20, 5:23, 5:27, 5:31, 9:29
Enoch doesn't die he just ascends into heaven. 5:21-24
When Noah was 500 years old, he had three sons.
[Three sons in one year? Was that with one (nameless) wife or several?] 5:32
The "sons of God" copulated with the "daughters of men," and had sons who became "the mighty men of old, men of renown." 6:2-4
"There were giants in the earth in those days." 6:4
God decides to kill all living things because the human imagination is evil. Later (8:21), after he kills everything, he promises never to do it again because the human imagination is evil. Go figure. 6:5
God repents. 6:6-7
Noah is called a "just man and perfect," but he didn't seem so perfect when he was drunk and naked in front of his sons (9:20-21). 6:9, 7:1
God was angry because "the earth was filled with violence." So he killed every living thing to make the world less violent. 6:11-13
Noah is told to make an ark that is 450 feet long. 6:14-15
God tells Noah to make one small window (18 inches square) in the 450 foot ark for ventilation. 6:16
"And take thou unto thee of all food that is eaten ... for thee, and for them." 6:21
Whether by twos or by sevens, Noah takes male and female representatives from each species of "every thing that creepeth upon the earth." 7:8
God opens the "windows of heaven." He does this every time it rains. 7:11
All of the animals boarded the ark "in the selfsame day." 7:13-14
"The windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained." This happens whenever it stops raining. 8:2
Noah sends a dove out to see if there was any dry land. But the dove returns without finding any. Then, just seven days later, the dove goes out again and returns with an olive leaf. But how could an olive tree survive the flood? And if any seeds happened to survive, they certainly wouldn't germinate and grow leaves within a seven day period. 8:8-11
Noah kills the "clean beasts" and burns their dead bodies for God. According to 7:8 this would have caused the extinction of all "clean" animals since only two of each were taken onto the ark. "And the Lord smelled a sweet savor." After this God "said in his heart" that he'd never do it again because "man's heart is evil from his youth." So God killed all living things (6:5) because humans are evil, and then promises not to do it again (8:21) because humans are evil. The mind of God is a frightening thing. 8:20-21
According to this verse, all animals fear humans. Although it is true that many do, it is also true that some do not. Sharks and grizzly bears, for example, are generally much less afraid of us than we are of them. 9:2
"Into your hand are they (the animals) delivered." God gave the animals to humans, and they can do whatever they please with them. This verse has been used by bible believers to justify all kinds of cruelty to animals and environmental destruction. 9:2
God is rightly filled with remorse for having killed his creatures. He makes a deal with the animals, promising never to drown them all again. He even puts the rainbow in the sky so that whenever he sees it, it will remind him of his promise so that he won't be tempted to do it again. (Every time God sees the rainbow he says to himself: "Oh, yeah.... That's right. I promised not to drown the animals again. I guess I'll have to find something else to do."). 9:9-13
The contemporary writers of comic books today don't have any more creativity than 2,000 years ago.
Be careful stacking up those straw men. Keep 'em away from the flame.
Do you mean the flame of hell?
No such thing as a burning hell.
Don't you learn anything from me?
neo, Isn't that a two-way street? LOL
In LUKE 16:23 & 24 the Bible says; "AND IN HELL HE LIFT UP HIS EYES, ... One day I too was traveling down the road that fed to a BURNING HELL. ...
neologist wrote:Be careful stacking up those straw men. Keep 'em away from the flame.
Quoting the bible as has been done above does not meet the criteria for setting up a straw man argument.
If you want to make the case that it does, please demonstrate how the quotes are being misrepresented, and by what criteria you are using to demonstrate the author's intent.
Perceived inconsistencies are in the mind of the careless reader. I have pointed out many. But, since my friend, CI has brought up the parable of the rich man and Lazarus, I might as well review that one:
1] First of all, the punishment for sin was clearly stated in Genesis as death. (Genesis 2:17) And restated in Romans 5:12
2] Solomon related to us the condition of the dead as unconscious in Ecclesiastes 9: 5,6
Now to the parable which relates a conversation between a rich man in hell (Greek hades) and Abraham. Why do I assert it to be written as a parable. Well, because:
1 and 2 above and:
3] The Greek word hades means only the grave.
4] The assertion that a single drop of water could provide relief to one in the traditional state of hell is ridiculous.
5] As is the belief that a conversation (or any communication) could exist between the two diverse concepts.
6] There is a condition known as spiritual death. (Luke 9:60)
So, when you're dead, you're dead, in spite of what the pope says. He just wants to scare you into a bigger contribution anyway.
All religions are out to make money and build fancy buildings - even in the poorest of countries. The Pope lives like royalty; not like the poorest of the poor that give to their church.
Sorry, I didn't mean to single out the pope.
It's a matter of if the sandal fits . . .
neologist wrote:Perceived inconsistencies are in the mind of the careless reader. I have pointed out many.
I don't see you disputing any of the quotes in the thread-originator's first post.
kickycan wrote:neologist wrote:Perceived inconsistencies are in the mind of the careless reader. I have pointed out many.
I don't see you disputing any of the quotes in the thread-originator's first post.
It gets a bit tedious when I cover the same things over and over, but here goes: I hope you don't mind if I just take the first two as examples.
1] The genealogy of Jesus has been well explained on this board many times before. Matthew's Gospel traces Jesus lineage to his (earthly) father, Joseph. Luke traces Jesus' lineage to Jesus' mother, the daughter of Heli. As it was the custom for the Jews to refer to their sons in law as sons, Joseph is so mentioned.
2] Anyone who took the time to actually read the first two chapters of Genesis instead of cutting and pasting from strawmen.Com, would realize that Chapter 2 begins with a summary or restatement of chapter 1.
You have identified another flaw in the bible; why does it require restatement if god is the author? Mistakes? Errors? Omissions? Clarity? Some humans have better skills at authoring a book.
cicerone imposter wrote:You have identified another flaw in the bible; why does it require restatement if god is the author? Mistakes? Errors? Omissions? Clarity? Some humans have better skills at authoring a book.
A question clearly asked and worthy of an answer.
Don't go away.
There is an answer.
The "fact" that the Bible contradicts itself and is probably not the word of God does not in itself make it "rubbish". There is a lot of edifying stuff in there.
So does comic books, and they don't scare the bejezuz out of anyone. It's entertainment.
neologist wrote:cicerone imposter wrote:You have identified another flaw in the bible; why does it require restatement if god is the author? Mistakes? Errors? Omissions? Clarity? Some humans have better skills at authoring a book.
A question clearly asked and worthy of an answer.
Don't go away.
There is an answer.
The answer = god is not the author.
Pretty simple, actually.
A friend of mine used to use the expression "and that's the Gospel truth!" until I pointed out that the Gospel is bullshit.
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