Yeah, MA, that's something i've never fathomed--a gobshite is a gobshite, no matter what the accent. I always cringe for the Americans who go running after Brits and Europeans as though there resided true cultural virtue. One need only look at the British and the French press, and watch their television to know that they're no better, nor worse, than us.
Hmmm - I think British news and current affairs greatly superior to American.
I think your quality press is similar.
You've not seen the best of American television news, lil' Bunny . . .
Hmmmmm - what is it? I watched a lot of news stuff when I was there...especially in New York.
I was impressed with Canadian TV news and commentary, too.
since you mention words that drive you nuts...
Mature - shouldn't it sound like future, venture, ligature not matour.
To eleborate on Setanta observations :wink:
Setanta is referring to central Canada, Ontario mostly, the rest of Canada ribs them too, when they're 'aboot to go oot of the hoosse.'
Accents in Canada are regional as well, it's just that our regions are massive not like the typically tiny bits of landscape in the UK.
In the Canada you'll find a the discrepancy is based on who first settled the area, French or English, Irish, Scotish, southern slaves, Ukranians Natives/Aborigianls - Metis ect.
In Newfoundland (pronounced like understand)(Irish background mostly) - you'll commonly find the letter 's' added to verbs. - I drives to work. I loves, I needs him, I gots to have him.
In french maritime communities, as opposed to Quebec, you'll hear english verbs in french sentences - Je run a l'ecole.
B.C. is our laid back version of California, they just s p e a k s l o w e r.
But we all share one trait. We always sound like we're asking a question.
We raise the ending of our sentences and words.
English more than any other language is constantly evolving, a living breathing phenomenon. English no more resembles the language spoken in Shakespeares day than it does the French, Saxon, Norwegian it stole it origins from.
Pick a word, any word and look at the root. Could be Latin, Hindi, Slavic, or Asian. Said word has probably gone through a myriad of meanings and will most likely continue to morph.
The biggest difference in pronunciation is vowel sounds. Some cultures use all variations and some stick to the tried and true. However no one country can ever hold it hostage, but influence heavily, yes.
Ceili
Much popular culture is now internatonal. Formats are sold to any country/tv channel who wants 'em and adapted to local taste.
The Usa took The Millionair show and Weakest Link from the UK. We take chat shows from the USA and run 'em. It's all grist to the cultural mill.
Go to any regular UK town and you find evidence of the USA on the streets and in the home. AS you do of Asian food outlets, cab drivers. Balti Curry was invented in Birmingham England, not Bombay India.
We use American terms, such a "going downtown", we have "shopping malls" now, "leisure parks" and we get "coffee to go" from Starbucks. We get US news progs on BBC & Sky tv
This planet is no longer Sanforized
This planet is goin' ta hell in a hand-basket, an' its about damned time you people did something about it.
dreamworld wrote: As for clutching for a cultural identity, Britain has problems there to, even the early celts were a mixed bunch. I do think there is a greater sense of needing roots and culture in ex colonial countries though, though its also true to say present day Britain, France etc are not exactly brimming with culture. In fact some ancient celtic customs which were continued by immigrants in the colonies have died off in the original countries (such as some pagan cornish festivals that are still performed in Australia).
Hmmh. You may be correct that the Celts were a "combination" of different tribes - exactly an early Indo-European people.
dreamworld wrote:
George Bushes family were prosecuted under the trading with the enemy act in 1942 for funding Hitler and his war machine. Thats right, they made their fortune supporting the third reich, never see that on the news do we !
Depends on, what media you read, listena and watch.
At least, e.g. the (European) newsmagazines had long lasting reports on it.
Dlowan said
Of course language is used as a tool of social status - however, I wonder, England being still, I think, far more class conscious and ridden than either the USA or Australia, (do others agree with this?) if this is not more evident to you than to us?
mmm.. maybe not so much these days. Different accents/colours/creeds are finding it easier to progress, pop stars and footballers are the new 'elite' to be looked up to by the 'masses' - certainly respect for the aristocracy is at an all time low! (to the barricades! a bas les aristos! ...)
America has a strong class system based on money and position, which is equally bad - the fact that once someone loses their money and position (famous actor, politician, whatever) - their 'friends' desert them as they no long belong, is something that the English don't do so much - I am certainly not well off financially, came from what you would call a middle class upbringing - my friends range from very wealthy to downright poor and of all ages and races, 'classes' - which none of us consider - I value them for themselves and not their position or money.
My accent being semi correct english has occasionally helped me. I think people just dislike bad grammar and lack of vocabulary rather than a regional accent though. With moving around i never really got a regional accent.eerrrr ... please don't comment on any of
my bad grammar!
Things are kind of changing. Accent or dialect is now being used as a symbol for social status 'Globally' , IE American English is not only seen as the most desirable form of the language to learn in most non English speaking (especially poorer countries) , but it is also viewed as 'commercial' English , the one used most in commerce, which has obvious economic ramifications.
Im probably wrong about there being more accents in England than the U.S. and Canada, as someone pointed out, there must be present all the original uk accents, plus a few more evolved mutants.
I love being proved wrong.
Depends on, what media you read, listena and watch.
At least, e.g. the (European) newsmagazines had long lasting reports on it.[/quote]
Maybe the media is better in the rest of europe. I never saw it mentioned in the uk , peru or cnn
Re: your last post, dreamworld -- it's an interesting thing about accents. Most people really can't differentiate between the subtleties in dialects. As Setanta pointed out, there is really no such thing as a single American Southern accent. Yet most people in the North of the USA can't hear the differences. To them, the Georgian will sound just the same as the North Carolinian. Likewise, most Americans (North or South), won't be able to hear the differences between a Yorkshire and a Sussex accent. In fact, most Americans can't tell the difference between A British and an Aussie accent. An Australian coming to the States has to identify him- or herself as such or else be taken for a Brit. The round-about reasoning goes something like this: "He doesn't sound like an American and it's not a 'foreign' accent. So he must be English." I suspect that the same is true in the UK as regards the variety of American accents. To the Brit, a Californian sounds the same as a New Yorker.
Yes Andrew, most USA accents sound very similar to our untrained ear. Though of course southern accents, pronounciation do differ and can be heard.
It's true to say, that in the UK, regional accents when spoken in a broad, deep brogue can be hard for a Londoner to follow. If a Geordie (Newcastle) uses local terminology, then confusion sets in as does a glazed look on the face.
I think I read somewhere, that when The Full Monty was shown in America , sub titles were used.
olk
A quick search gave as result: yes, you remember correctly.
(Can I really understand English better than Americans
)
Walter, most probably yes, you can.
Maybe its been mentioned back somewhere in this or one of its progenitor threads, but I'm too lazy to slog through hundreds of posts ... I'll just comment that it has been observed that "The US and Great Britain are two nations divided by a common language".
Generally attributed to G.B. Shaw.
I've this site -
American Pie - marked as one of my favourites.
The foolowing is from there, one part of an abstract from a paper by Josephine Bacon, delivered at the American Translators Association Conference in Los Angeles, California in November, 2001.
Quote:AWARENESS OF THE DIFFERENCE
The British are far more aware of the difference than their American counterparts thanks to the influence of the movies, and the arrival of the GIs during World War II. When the first American talkies were shown in Great Britain, they had to be subtitled because the British had never heard an American accent and could not understand the dialogue!
Americans have problems understanding both accent and vocabulary in British movies, plays and TV soap operas. Special glossaries have been produced for TV soaps, such as Eastenders (Cockney dialect) and Coronation Street (Manchester dialect).
The problem is not confined to dialogue and dialect speech. American software companies soon realized that they would have to create different spell-checkers and grammar checkers for "American" and what they term "international" English, which is basically British spelling and grammar. Advertising agencies and PR agencies understand that there are major cultural differences between American and British English. Very few ads made in the U.S. make it onto British TV because there is a "look and feel" to an ad or brochure that can even be off-putting if it seen as being too "American." The text may contain too many contractions such as "can't" and "won't", or there may be expressions that sound odd to British ears such as "behaviors" (behaviour is never pluralized in British English) or unfamiliar expressions such as "an efficiency" (what we call a studio flat or bedsitter) or "the daily commute" (the daily journey to and from work) may be used (though the British use the term "commuter").
British and American English are lects of the same language. There are other versions of English, of course, it would be surprising if a language that is the mother-tongue of a significant proportion of the world's population from Birmingham, Alabama, USA to Birmingham, West Midlands, USA from Alaska to Zambia and not forgetting the Antipodes, did not have regional differences. This is also true of the United States, where certain regions use dialect words that are not understood elsewhere. It is especially true where there are substantial numbers of inhabitants who do not use English as their mother tongue, such as Louisiana, or where they were independent from the United States at some stage in their history, like Texas and Vermont.
sort of off track but relevant - there was a programme the other night about an American car salesman who owns Motorama or something - they showed the ads he does on American Tv - all shouting and in your face - hard hard sell.
he called himself Chopper because he chops prices - maybe some of you know who i mean?
We English don't go for that! I anyone tries a hard sell on me I am GONE!
Then he came over here to sell here and really thought he'd dazzle the salesmen - who had a much more laid back approach of here are the keys - go and look and if you like the car, come and talk.
he haunted the potential buyers, constantly giving the big sell - most of them disappeared fast - no sales! Meanwhile the English salesmen were doing well and selling fast.
he had to learn to tone it down, not shout at them and talk non stop and leave them time to decide for themselves.
I think this is another difference - tone.
