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FOLLOWING THE EUROPEAN UNION

 
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Wed 14 Dec, 2005 04:04 pm
The budget proposed by the Brits have been handily rejected by Germany, France, and Italy. What now?
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Wed 14 Dec, 2005 04:22 pm
By France, Italy, the Netherlands, Germany, Poland, Spain, the EU commission ...

Well, talks will go on. I suppose, at happens in other states, countries, communities etc sometimes as well that a proposed budject is rejected.
0 Replies
 
Lord Ellpus
 
  1  
Thu 15 Dec, 2005 02:03 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
By France, Italy, the Netherlands, Germany, Poland, Spain, the EU commission ...

Well, talks will go on. I suppose, at happens in other states, countries, communities etc sometimes as well that a proposed budject is rejected.


The way I see it, Blair was foolish to sign up to the most recent budget, which drags the whole CAP thing on for years to come. It is right that the other EU countries should want to stick to that arrangement.

Then again, why is it one rule for this, and another rule for the so called "rebate"?

Didn't the EU sign up to THAT agreement? So shouldn't THAT also be set in stone? Why then, the pressure to get THAT changed, when the usual CAP suspects won't budge an inch, or even give a hint that they will budge an inch, on Blairs proposal?

Blair is making it quite clear that the UK budget "rebate" is possibly up for re-negotiation, which I think is the fair thing to do, seeing how the economic situation has changed over the years.
His proposal isn't by any means perfect, but surely people can see that the door has opened, possibly leading to a wholesale modernising of the total EU budget and funding system, and scrapping the need for this "rebate" that causes so much anger.

I tell you now, France won't budge an inch on the CAP fiasco, and never will.

At least Blair is trying to do something about resolving the whole mess.

What are the other leaders doing?

Double standards, IMO.
If it was Chiracs "rebate", there would have probably been no discussion about it in the first place.
VERY clever politician, that man.
0 Replies
 
Lord Ellpus
 
  1  
Thu 15 Dec, 2005 02:43 am
Just to illustrate how valuable the CAP is to some countries, and how the rebate affects things, here's a graph taken from 2004.

Even WITH the rebate taken into consideration, the UK contributes (net) almost twice as much as the net contribution made by France, a country that has roughly the same population, and is ranked higher in the "economic success" leagues than the UK at present.

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b358/lordellpus/rebate.jpg


"However, the UK's net contribution would have been bigger even than Germany's, had it not been for the rebate.
Although France and Italy made a larger gross contribution, the EU also spent a lot more money in those countries than it did in the UK.


If France had not paid 1.5bn euros towards the UK rebate, its net contribution would have been just 1.6bn euros, while without the rebate the UK would have made a net contribution of 9.9bn euros."......


Taken from....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4721307.stm
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Thu 15 Dec, 2005 08:18 am
Yes, yes. Some nice "ifs" there.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 01:29 am
UK Prime Minister Tony Blair says the EU budget talks will be tough, but that all of the leaders meeting in Brussels know it is imperative a deal is struck. (BBC report)


On the other hand, it seems as if the UK's conservatives might turn away from Europe even more than already before:

Quote:
Merkel in 'isolation' warning to Cameron

By Andrew Grice and Stephen Castle
Published: 16 December 2005

David Cameron has been warned by Angela Merkel, the German Chancellor, that the Conservative Party faces isolation if he presses ahead with his plan to leave Europe's main centre-right grouping.

In a letter to the Tory leader, Ms Merkel suggested his party would walk into Europe's political wilderness if it quits the European People's Party (EPP-ED), the biggest single group in the European Parliament.

She urged him to think again about the move, which he promised during his campaign to win the Tory leadership on the grounds that the EPP-ED is too supportive of EU integration.

Ms Merkel said: "I look forward to good and intensive co-operation with you, and in particular within the framework of the EPP-ED."

Yesterday, Mr Cameron kept his distance from centre-right leaders by staying away from their traditional meeting before the summit of EU countries in Brussels. Instead, he visited Belfast, which went down badly at the Brussels meeting.

Last night, he made clear he would stick to his plan. His spokesman said: "David Cameron... believes the best thing is to leave the EPP-ED and create a new group that shows the way forward for the EU."

Source
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 01:32 am
And on Turkey, the Independent reports:

Quote:
Turkey's human rights in spotlight as author goes on trial for insulting nation

By Elizabeth Davies
Published: 16 December 2005

Turkey's most celebrated and internationally renown-ed writer goes on trial today in Istanbul on charges of insulting his country's national identity in a case widely seen as a crucial test of the Turkish commitment to freedom of speech.

Orhan Pamuk, author of such critically acclaimed novels as My Name is Red and Snow, faces up to three years' imprisonment if found guilty of making comments believed to undermine "Turkishness", under Article 301 of the country's new penal code.

The trial, which relates to comments Mr Pamuk made in February accusing Turks of refusing to talk about the massacre of a million Armenians during the First World War, is not only creating discord at home but threatening to sour the country's membership talks with the European Union.

Ollie Rehn, the EU enlargement commissioner, said the Pamuk case was a "litmus test" of Turkey's determination to act on recent reforms it has made under EU pressure, such as guaranteeing its citizens freedom of expression. "The trial of a novelist who expressed a non-violent opinion casts a shadow over the accession negotiations between Turkey and the EU," he said. "It is not Orhan Pamuk who will stand trial tomorrow, but Turkey."

The 25-nation union officially started entry negotiations with Ankara in October and insists Turkey meet EU standards on human rights before it can join. Despite having revised the penal code this year among reforms made under pressure from Brussels, Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan's government has maintained the status of Article 301, which makes a criminal offence of denigrating national character and insulting the founder of the modern Turkish state, Kemal Ataturk.

Mr Pamuk hit upon a particularly raw nerve in Turkish society when he told a Swiss newspaper in February that "30,000 Kurds and a million Armenians were killed in these lands and nobody but me dares to talk about it".

The comments provoked protest in Turkey's most traditional and conservative circles. Prosecutors opened a case against the writer. Mr Pamuk, in an article this week in the New Yorker magazine, said: "I cannot say I was surprised to be put on trial. I believe that the case against me is thin; I do not think I will end up in jail."

A delegation from the European Parliament will attend the trial. Mr Rehn said: "The Commission expects the Turkish government will make it clear to the prosecutors and judges that ... the new penal code should be interpreted fully in line with the European Convention of Human Rights."

Mr Pamuk, 53, has long been a thorn in Turkey's side. His books, in more than 20 languages, paint an often unsettling picture of a Turkey split between Western and Oriental cultures, between conservative and modern, Islamic and secular ways of thinking. He has often spoken out against Turkey's treatment of its minorities, accusing the government of encouraging "crazy" nationalism and violating human rights.

Of this latest case, which has thrust the issue of Turkish freedom of speech into the international spotlight, Mr Pamuk said it was difficult to reconcile the modern, Western-leaning Turkey which Prime Minister Erdogan tries to promote with the hardline, conservative movement prosecuting him for speaking his mind. "The hardest thing was to explain why a country officially committed to entry in the European Union would wish to imprison an author whose books were well-known in Europe," Pamuk wrote.

Dozens of other far less famous writers and academics are also facing charges under the revised penal code.

Turkey's most celebrated and internationally renown-ed writer goes on trial today in Istanbul on charges of insulting his country's national identity in a case widely seen as a crucial test of the Turkish commitment to freedom of speech.

Orhan Pamuk, author of such critically acclaimed novels as My Name is Red and Snow, faces up to three years' imprisonment if found guilty of making comments believed to undermine "Turkishness", under Article 301 of the country's new penal code.
0 Replies
 
Lord Ellpus
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 02:01 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Yes, yes. Some nice "ifs" there.


But BBC "ifs" are usually very well informed, and quite relevant.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 02:06 am
Certainly.


However, Blair offered this as menu yesterday:

Quote:
THE MENU


Starter

Cullen Skink

Main Course Northern Irish rack of lamb

Dessert Drinks Scottish shortbread Welsh Tintern Parva white wine & Devon vineyard's Sharphan Beenleigh red wine, English mineral water
0 Replies
 
Lord Ellpus
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 02:18 am
Sorry about that Walter, that's all we could afford.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 12:57 pm
Cuts from a larger London (and national) evening paper:

http://img476.imageshack.us/img476/1795/clipboard15fo.jpg



Related article in the online version:
Quote:
This is
LONDON

16/12/05 - News section

Blair 'to compromise' on EU budget

Tony Blair appeared set to surrender more of Britain's European Union rebate in a bid to resolve the budget crisis.

The Prime Minister is expected to increase his offer of foregoing £5.5 billion over seven years in return for a review of EU spending - including farm subsidies - in 2008.

Mr Blair decided to go for a deal that will salvage the UK's European presidency after private talks with French President Jacques Chirac. New German Chancellor Angela Merkel joined the two men for crucial negotiations as the PM pressed for an agreement.

French opposition to agricultural subsidy cuts and the UK's attachment to the annual £2.7 billion rebate, won by Margaret Thatcher in 1984, torpedoed previous talks.

The PM has come under intense pressure to surrender more of the payback from almost every other EU leader at the Brussels summit. He did not want to make another offer unless there was an opportunity for agreement.

Officials feared that any proposed rebate cut would become the starting point of future negotiations if the summit failed. However, Mr Blair appeared to be on the brink of a securing a fundamental review of EU spending in 2008 in return for a further cut.

British officials have been adamant that the review must allow for a cut in agricultural subsidies in the 2007-13 period under negotiation. That has been fiercely opposed by President Chirac, who insists Common Agricultural Policy payments have been fixed until 2014.

However, speaking after the meeting with his French and German counterparts, Mr Blair's official spokesman said there had been "some progress". President Chirac knows that the review will not reduce his sacred farm subsidies at least until 2014 and only then by unanimous agreement of all EU leaders.

After lunch with all 25 heads of government, the PM continued with one-on-one meetings. He still faces anger from some of the 10 new members over suggestions that they should accept lower levels of development aid in return for a quick deal.

However, Mr Blair is keen to reduce the overall level of spending from the 871 billion euros proposed by Luxembourg, the former holder of the EU Presidency. Offering up more of the rebate will be unpopular back in Britain but failure to secure an agreement would be a personal blow for the PM.
Source
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 01:25 pm
Poor Blair. I suspect he will learn that attempting to please the French is a futile task.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 01:43 pm
georgeob1 wrote:
Poor Blair. I suspect he will learn that attempting to please the French is a futile task.


I don't think, you can only blame the French for it: Poland, Italy and especially the EU-commission have/had even stronger words.

French.bashing is more simple, I agree, though.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 01:46 pm
That is a separate issue driven by the collective unwillingness of the established members to continue 'equalization' programs at their previous levels. Your graphs vividly demonstrated France's status as the least of the rich donor nations in the EU.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 01:52 pm
I wouldn't suppose Poland being an established member. Never mind, as the (London) Times wrote:
Quote:
0 Replies
 
JustWonders
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 03:29 pm
georgeob1 wrote:
Poor Blair. I suspect he will learn that attempting to please the French is a futile task.


You are such a gentleman, georgeob1. The WSJ wasn't nearly so kind in their analysis.

Quote:
An astonishing 99% of Frenchmen don't want Jacques Chirac to run for a third term, a new opinion poll shows. So how can such a discredited politician still be calling the shots on the EU budget? Apparently, even the British haven't learned that appeasement never works -- whether it's with Nazis, terrorists or French presidents hooked on agro-subsidies. Tony Blair's offer to forgo part of the British rebate without touching the Common Agricultural Policy, which still eats up 40% of the EU budget, produced a rather predictable reaction from the main beneficiaries of the CAP. Sensing vulnerability on the prime minister's part, Mr. Chirac immediately declared the offer unsatisfactory and demanded more. ...Sir Charles Crawford, the British ambassador to Warsaw, wrote an "internal" email that somehow found its way to the press. The CAP is "the most stupid, immoral state-subsidized policy in human history, give or take communism," he wrote. "It's a program which uses inefficient transfers of taxpayers' money to bloat rich French landowners and so pump up food prices in Europe, thereby creating poverty in Africa, which we then fail to solve through inefficient but expensive aid programs." ...At the EU summit starting Thursday, Mr. Blair could return to his original agenda and propose serious CAP reform in exchange for cuts in the rebate. Not that such a budget would have the slightest chance of being passed. But at least he'd go down fighting for the right principles.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB113442344915720457.html?mod=opinion&ojcontent=otep
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 03:44 pm
Poland and France said some minutes ago that the member states are moving slowly towards a compromise. And Tony said the talks had been "extraordinarily complicated" although the spirit so far had been "constructive"; he was confident EU leaders would see his final offer as "fair and reasonable".
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 03:46 pm
Quote:
An astonishing 99% of Frenchmen don't want Jacques Chirac to run for a third term ...


I fully agree: it's time that France changes from conservative to socialist again!
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Fri 16 Dec, 2005 04:17 pm
Quote:
16 December 2005 21:57:32 GMT
Blair delivering final EU budget proposals

British prime minister Tony Blair has announced that Britain is prepared to start paying more into the European Union's coffers.


Speaking to reporters about the UK's revised budget proposals, the prime minister claimed that his decisions were "fair and reasonable". He declared that UK was prepared to "pay our fair share of the costs of economic development in these new member states of the EU but preserves absolutely the rebate in respect of the rest of expenditure".

Mr Blair explained that the talks had been "extraordinarily complicated" and warned that a final decision on the revised proposals could take time, the BBC reports. Britain currently holds the EU presidency and the prime minister is keen that its six month term of office should be a success.

Mr Blair held private talks today with German chancellor Angela Merkel, who is attending her first EU summit as leader, and French president Jacques Chirac, in a bid to reach a consensus on the budget proposals.

Following talks with EU leaders at a summit in Brussels, Mr Blair may give up an additional £2 billion (three billion euros) of the UK's EU rebate over seven years in order to ensure the proposals are accepted by EU leaders, according to reports. Last week, the prime minister offered to surrender eight billion euros (£5.4 billion) of the rebate over the next seven years.

The annual EU rebate of £2.7 billion a year, won by then prime minister Margaret Thatcher in 1984, has been an increasingly contentious issue since the European Union expanded from 15 to 25 states in 2004. However, many Britons support the EU rebate and are likely to oppose the prime minister's decision.

The ten EU member states admitted in 2004 are expected to continue costing richer countries money as they bring their economies in line with the rest of the union.

The final revised budget proposals are now being put before all 25 EU member states and are believed to include changes to the current EU farm subsidies system, another contentious issue.
© Adfero Ltd
Source
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Sat 17 Dec, 2005 12:13 am
The result after this night's talks:

Britain's contribution will grow by nearly two thirds to £42 billion to help fund the EU's expansion and develop the economies of some of the poorest newcomers.

French contributions will rise by 116 per cent.

Polish Prime Minister Kazimierz Marcinkiewicz and several other leaders paid tribute to new German Chancellor Angela Merkel for having helped broker the deal and offering extra cash at the last minute to meet the new member states' demands.

"Merkel at the last minute gave 100 million euros extra for Poland which was the most beautiful and wonderful gesture of solidarity," Marcinkiewicz told a news conference.


EU commission president Jose Barroso said: "Europe is out of paralysis, Europe is on the move."
0 Replies
 
 

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