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This PC stuff is going to make me to shoot myself

 
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 07:57 am
yes, and? what is the problem? we all said we enjoy the holiday. there isn't one prescribed way HOW to enjoy it, is there?
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 07:59 am
dlowan wrote:
How is any of that condemning christmas?


We are saying it has different meanings for us, that is all.

We just aren't all christians, Intrepid. And so christmas as a religious festival doesn't cut it.

That is how it is.

And I find the hyper retail stuff wearisome too.


Perhaps I am being somewhat sensitive and misreading some things. If that is the case, my apologies.
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Slappy Doo Hoo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 07:59 am
You think there's a single kid out there that even thinks Halloween is linked to a religion?

If it's against your beliefs, that's fine. Keeping your kid home is fine. Nothing wrong with that.

But it pisses me off that a few parents with sticks in their asses have to ruin it for 99% of the students.

I wish in this society, the pricipal could just look at one of those complaining whiney parents and say "shuddup you whiney little bitch. You don't like it keep your kid home."

Newton is such a typical town where something like this would happen. Dad's the VP of an engineering firm, was picked on as a kid, never got laid until he met his pig of a wife, who thinks she's better than everyone because her job consists soley of driving back and forth to pick up their dork kids from school.
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Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:00 am
That doesn't seem like condemning Christmas to me.

Frankly, Intrepid, I'm just as peeved that we aren't "supposed" to call any public celebration in mid-December Christmas so as to suit some warped idea of what makes for "freedom" and political correctness. One year somebody comes up with "Winter Festival" another year... "Holiday Celebration".

So much foolishness all in one little world.
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Slappy Doo Hoo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:00 am
Edit: you think there's a single kid who CARES how it's linked to their religon?
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Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:02 am
Slappy Doo Hoo wrote:
You think there's a single kid out there that even thinks Halloween is linked to a religion?

If it's against your beliefs, that's fine. Keeping your kid home is fine. Nothing wrong with that.

But it pisses me off that a few parents with sticks in their asses have to ruin it for 99% of the students.

I wish in this society, the pricipal could just look at one of those complaining whiney parents and say "shuddup you whiney little bitch. You don't like it keep your kid home."

Newton is such a typical town where something like this would happen. Dad's the VP of an engineering firm, was picked on as a kid, never got laid until he met his pig of a wife, who thinks she's better than everyone because her job consists soley of driving back and forth to pick up their dork kids from school.


I agree with you. However, I think the principal could use more diplomatic language than that which you are suggesting.

Laughing
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:03 am
The name "Christmass" is directly related to the birth of Christ. Yes. But only in English. Vianoce (Slovak), Weinachten (German), Noel (French) - they all have nothing to do with christianity in their name. The roots go to way before christianity was around. And those traditions stuck around here, incorporating christian elements - for some more, for some less. for me and my family, less. but the holiday itself is no less significant an event to me then to my catholic or lutheran friends, i assure you.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:08 am
Intrepid wrote:
dlowan wrote:
How is any of that condemning christmas?


We are saying it has different meanings for us, that is all.

We just aren't all christians, Intrepid. And so christmas as a religious festival doesn't cut it.

That is how it is.

And I find the hyper retail stuff wearisome too.


Perhaps I am being somewhat sensitive and misreading some things. If that is the case, my apologies.


No worries, Intrepid.

Just likely been a mite sensitive meself on another thread.

Actually, I am annoyed by Halloween as well.

It has never been a tradition in Oz to celebrate it, but it is creeping in as American culture dominates more and more, and the retail sector is, of course, pushing it for all it is worth. So, I am a bit grumpy about it.

Still, if folks enjoy it, where's the harm?
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:11 am
My bad, actually. Weinachten means 'Happy holly night" or something to that effect, so does Noel.
Had to go check on it. Now only to find more about the traditions themselves and where those come from... or i won't be able to sleep. OCD reflex...


Our modern term Christmas comes to us from the late Olde English cristes masse, or "Christ's mass". Christian is, of course, derived from the name of Jesus the Christ. A surprisingly recent word out of the 16th Century, the Latin term Christianus later replaced the existing English adjective christen (only to become our noun form Christendom and our infinitive to christen). The name "Christ" itself was borrowed into Olde English from the Latin Christus, as in "Christus natus est" (Christ is born). Yet this Latin term sprang directly from the Greek Khristós, which literally meant "anointed one", coming from the verb form khríen (to anoint). But this, in turn, was a direct translation of the Hebrew mashiah. Then, in due time, it was to become the source of our modern English term messiah signifying a "deliverer", in keeping with Judaic faith.

Another term referring to this holiest of seasons is Noël, as in modern French's Joyeux Noël (Merry Christmas) or Nowell out of 17th Century Coventry, England, through Wales. This term shares a common ancestry with our English Nativity, along with present-day Italian's Buon Natale (Good Birth) and the Spanish nacimiento ("birth", manger scene, pesebre in Spanish or crêche in French) or Feliz Navidad (Happy Nativity). Modern German's Fröhliche Weinachten (literally "Happy Holy Night"), however, is related to the Germanic night and nocturnal, not to the Latin nativity.

The words Nativity and native are among a large family of brother and sister terms stemming from the Latin verb nasci. Meaning "to be born", it was a descendant of the Indo-European base gen- or gn- signifying "to produce". This prefix was to generate our modern English words gene, genetics, genome, generate, generative, degenerate, generic, generation, degeneration, general, generalize, generalization, progeny, progenitors, primogeniture, generous, Genesis, genius, genre, gender, biogenesis, and exogenous. From its past participle stem nat- was formed the adjectival nativus meaning "from birth", applied from the earliest of times in specific reference to the birth of Christ. Other English terms to have derived historically from this Indo-European prefix gen- or gn- , then the past participial nat- are: cognate (co-natus, born together), innate, natal, nation, nature, nascent, native, natural and Noël. To say "birth of a nation" is, lingüistically speaking, redundant. Vía the Old French, our and their term naïve, which is etymologically the equivalent of "born yesterday", ultimately derived from the Latin nativus. Also, from an Old French descendant of vulgar Latin's natalis or "of birth", have been handed down to us our present terms Renaissance (rebirth), pregnant (literally "pre-natal") and puny, implying the diminutive "nature" or size of the baby child at birth.

http://www.linguatics.com/origins_of_christmas.htm
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:11 am
Slappy Doo Hoo wrote:
But it pisses me off that a few parents with sticks in their asses have to ruin it for 99% of the students.

Hey, Slappy's a supporter of school prayer!
0 Replies
 
Slappy Doo Hoo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:15 am
dlowan wrote:
It has never been a tradition in Oz to celebrate it, but it is creeping in as American culture dominates more and more, and the retail sector is, of course, pushing it for all it is worth. So, I am a bit grumpy about it.


That's because America kicks ass. We have a bunch of ninjas here. And the New England Patriots have won three out of four Super Bowls. You should take a step back and say, "holy sh!t! Tom Brady is American! I'm going to go buy me a Camaro, drink Bud, and dress up for Halloween!"

That makes sense, right?
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:19 am
A couple of years ago my book club read "Skipping Christmas" and then "The Da Vinci Code" in successive months, and I did a bunch of research on the Pagan origins of Christmas. (That is, I brought it up from memory for "Skipping Christmas", several people were aghast and unbelieving, and the "Pagan origins of ____" theme carried over to the next meeting, but this time I had scads of documentation.)

Basically, and I'd have to research this again, there was a midwinter festival around December 25th-28th (winter solstice? I forget) that was co-opted by Christians as a sort of "here, if you adopt Christianity, you still get to keep your favorite festival" kind of thing. Evergreens, candles, redistribution of wealth, feasting, and timing (Christ wasn't actually born December 25th -- less sure of this, but pretty sure) are all holdovers.
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dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:19 am
actually, there's all about the origins of christmas trees and wreaths and mistletoe on that website, too. tree seems to be related to winter solistice and comes from multiple cultures and civilizations, each adding something.

there are also regional traditions, which for me complete christmas to be what christmas is supposed to be (in my imagination): we put a chain around the table, throw walnuts into all four corners, feed domestic animals (our dog) the same food we have on the table, cut an apple to see the star in the middle, put some honey with garlic on unwed girl's foreheads (that would be me)... and a lot more. those are christmas (or Vianoce), to me...
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:22 am
Oh and mistletoe and holly and Yule logs and mummers (carolers):

ttp://de.essortment.com/christmaspagan_rece.htm
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sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:23 am
Cool traditions, Dag! Never heard of any of those.
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Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:24 am
A chain around the table???
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dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:30 am
chain around the table- so that the family stays together. cut an apple to see the star - health (cross means death, bad news - you gotta know how to cut...). honey with garlic - fertility, beauty, health - for the girl to wed in the coming year.. walnuts into four corners- so that luck follows us wherever we go. scale from a carp (carp is the main course on dinner table - old tradition that is either jewish or hungarian, or a combination thereof, we adopted it - all the way up to poland people eat carps) put in your wallet for financial fortune, as well as coins put under the tablecloth....
and that's us folks in the city... people in the villages have way more going on, and for many days.
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dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:33 am
carp? people EAT carp? OMG.
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dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:39 am
yes. me and my mom cheat. we have duck. i'll have some fish fingers, just to be able to say i had some fish, but i ain't doing the carp thing. some people are good at it. i wouldn't mind, if it weren't for the bones. each year a few people choke on them...
0 Replies
 
Gargamel
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Oct, 2005 08:39 am
I love the gayass terms that arise out of P.C. conflicts.

People of color (how is this different from saying colored people, which is offensive?)

And now..

Celebration of fall.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!
0 Replies
 
 

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