Do Christians have to obey the Old Testament Laws?

Why? What practical consequences result from ignoring these "laws"?

I see a flood a comin'.

Funny how on one hand Catholics are supposed to be bad but on the other we're supposed to accept the version of the Bible put together by the Catholic Church.

When it was pointed out that Luke got things wrong, that there are proven historical inaccuracies in his Gospel his response was that those men are liars because Luke was inspired by no less a person than God himself.

He can't have been much of a God if he couldn't get his facts straight, less a divine being more of a pundit on Fox News.

The possibly of not being able to enter the presence of a perfect God because I'm imperfect because I didn't keep the "laws" perfectly?

Imperfection not being able to enter into the presence of Perfection.

However, my understanding is that the Christian scripture also state that it is impossible to keep the "laws" perfectly.

So it would appear that I've had it.

As far as I can tell,according to Christian scriptures,belief or non belief in a God is irrelevant at the end of the day because even if it were possible to know God exists you still wouldn’t be able to enter his presence because he is perfect and you are imperfect because it’s impossible to keep his laws perfectly.Why ask you to do something when it is impossible to do it? I have therefore come to the conclusion that the sole purpose of the laws,and the reason they were given, is to teach you that you have had it.

So here we all are debating and wanting definitive proof of the existence or non existence of a God and yet even if we got definitive proof it would be of no use to us anyway because we are all imperfect according to the laws and not perfect.

Matthew 5:17 of the Christian scriptures is an amazing claim therefore.

My understanding of what the Christian scriptures are saying is that we need to keep the laws perfectly.We clearly cannot and so that would mean we have all had it basically as far as I can tell.

These scriptures claim that a man called Jesus was a scapegoat.

They also claim that he was a gateway in John 10:1 and that some will try to enter other than in the right way.

Enter what?

The whole reason a new covenant was brought by Jesus was because imperfect mortals could not live up to the law perfectly.

Luke got nothing wrong izzy old mate, but then you atheists are not renown for checking your facts, are you,

So what you are claiming then is that the new covenant is a doorway and this doorway is the way to enter into something and this something should not be entered into by any other way.Correct?

I get the impossibility of keeping the Christian laws perfectly whilst there is still the possibility that they do need to be kept perfectly.

So if I need to be perfect but I am imperfect,how can I become perfect if I am imperfect?

C'mon!

The "whole reason" a "new covenant" was brought by the people who were writing the New Testament, was because the god of the Old Testament was an abomination...and the writers felt this was a good time to update that abomination to something a bit closer to a moral, just god.

If "imperfect mortals" lived according to the Old Testament, we would be little more than savages...wantonly annihilating vanquished enemies; killing unruly children; killing homosexuals; and perverting morality and justice with silly vengeance.

The best guess that can be made about the change to a "new covenant" is that it was the result of human intervention...a desire to invent a new, more reasonable god. The god Christians worship IS NOT the same god Jesus worshiped...nothing like that god...and one has to be purposefully blind to suppose the two gods are the same god.

Checking your facts?

Not only are you wrong, like so many backward idiots you make assumptions.

I have never said what I believe, yet ignoramuses like you always assume. I've been called atheist, christian, buddhist, muslim and pagan by whatever idiot I'm dealing with at the time.

It's because stupid people are incapable of dealing with facts so they resort to hysteria and make stuff up.

Instead of lying about Luke's monumental fuckups you you be more concerned about why you, spend all your time judging, sorting people into sheep and goats, instead of obeying what Jesus said about loving your labour.

The fact that you appear to derive some perverse sexual satisfaction from all of this is even more disgusting.

**** knows what St Peter will make of it all.

It was Paul, needing a new group to impose his religion on, not enough Jewish people were interested so he needed to scrap dietry requirements and circumcision in order to make it appeal.

Jesus was made into whatever Paul wanted/needed it to be for his own purposes and veneration.

So much so thayt many early, gnostic Christians see it as an abomination.

So as nobody can keep the laws of God perfectly and yet the possibility is that they do need to be kept perfectly then it would appear to me that we all would need someone to keep them perfectly on our behalf and that person is the GATE through which we need to pass through.

Presumably that gate is Jesus Christ of the bible according to Christian scriptures.

Jesus Christ being the new covenant according to the the Christian scriptures it would appear.

I do get that as a possibility because I ain’t gonna listen to a God who doesn’t practice what he preaches.

Yes one must go through Jesus( by learning and obeying all he teaches) to get to the Father. No one gets to the Father without doing that.

There may be no father to get to. You really have to deal with that.

When I first left religion behind, I was very, very hard on Paul. It appeared to me that he distorted lots of what Jesus taught.

I've come to appreciate him more as I got older. He was one hell of a salesman...and he had enough control of his ego that he did not attempt to insinuate himself into the position of the...messiah. And it seemed he understood something that escaped Jesus...namely that the god of the Old Testament was an abomination.

Paul understood that in order for the new religion (the revised Jewish religion) to flourish...some of that brutal early stuff had to go.

It wasnt brutal. It was righteous. God doesn't accept sin, God owns every iota of creation. He handed all for free( priceless) life on a silver platter, out of his great love. He asks for you not to practice sin until his kingdom comes and makes everything back to perfection. Mortals asked for this sick system of things in their rebellion in Eden. So God let them have it. Its almost done.

izzythepush wrote..... Funny how on one hand Catholics are supposed to be bad but on the other we're supposed to accept the version of the Bible put together by the Catholic Church.

When it was pointed out that Luke got things wrong, that there are proven historical inaccuracies in his Gospel his response was that those men are liars because Luke was inspired by no less a person than God himself.

He can't have been much of a God if he couldn't get his facts straight, less a divine being more of a pundit on Fox News.

The Anointed Responds........ There's nothing I love more, than to show up an ignorant Biblical lying atheist for the ignoramus that it is. So if you would care to point out where you erroneously believe that Luke got things wrong, we can set things straight,

Philosophically, it does make sense that belief or non belief in a God are secondary if it is possible to accept or reject a God.

What is humankind’s justification for blaming a God for all atrocious throughout history if humankind has already accepted full responsibility for those atrocities if a God doesn’t exist?

A God would need to exist in order for humankind to blame that God and that would certainly defeat the object of the atheist.

So we either have humankind accepting full responsibility for all atrocities carried out throughout history or we have humankind having to acknowledge that a God exists in order to blame him.

So on one side of the fence we have a God that doesn’t exist and if we jump over to the other side of the fence, there we are trying to take on a God that exists.

Uummmmm

So ignorant you can't even use the quote function.