10
   

Do you even vape brah?

 
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Sep, 2019 01:30 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Thanks!
Quote:
The Trump administration is weighing a ban on the sale of flavored e-cigarettes amid a spate of vaping-related illnesses.
I'll wager that the Juul lobby isn't going to win over the much, much larger tobacco interests.


Heidi Ho!

Let's see, the vaping deaths and illnesses were caused by black market liquids containing THC with a vitamin related substance to correct the viscosity. YES! Ban flavors. Stable Genius. After all, it's difficult to ban something (THC) which is already illegal, at least at the federal level.

By the way, JUUL is a tobacco interest. It's 30% owned by Altria.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 12 Sep, 2019 02:36 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Thanks!
Quote:
The Trump administration is weighing a ban on the sale of flavored e-cigarettes amid a spate of vaping-related illnesses.
I'll wager that the Juul lobby isn't going to win over the much, much larger tobacco interests.


And you think your beloved progressives don't bend the knee to the tobacco interests? Rolling Eyes
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Sep, 2019 03:39 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
And you think your beloved progressives don't bend the knee to the tobacco interests?
I didn't say that. The comment was about the clout of tobacco interests. But now that you bring up who they donate to...
Quote:
Tobacco companies continue to play a large role in politics, although not as extensively as in the twentieth century.[12] In 1990, the contributions of tobacco lobbies totalled to over $70 million.[12] In 2017, tobacco lobbies paid $21.8 million.[12] Tobacco companies tend to donate more to Republican candidates, contributing over $50 million since 1990 to Republicans, including Vice President Mike Pence.[13]
wikipedia - see "21st Century"

But I may have this wrong. Let me call John Boehner and check with him.
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Sep, 2019 03:41 pm
@roger,
Quote:
By the way, JUUL is a tobacco interest. It's 30% owned by Altria.
Good man! I was wondering about that but didn't bother to check it out.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  0  
Reply Thu 12 Sep, 2019 04:37 pm
@blatham,
Tending to contribute to Republicans doesn't mean they don't contribute to Democrats. In any case, it's not about donations, it's about very welcomed tax revenue.
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Sep, 2019 04:53 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
Tending to contribute to Republicans doesn't mean they don't contribute to Democrats.
True. But ignoring differences doesn't promote understanding.

Quote:
In any case, it's not about donations, it's about very welcomed tax revenue.
Surely it's both. But yeah, tax revenues are a key part of this whole package.

0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 03:36 am
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
In any case, it's not about donations, it's about very welcomed tax revenue.

What's the problem with tax revenue again?
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 02:19 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:

Quote:
In any case, it's not about donations, it's about very welcomed tax revenue.

What's the problem with tax revenue again?


This from the idealist? Ha!

hightor
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 02:54 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
This from the idealist? Ha!

Hardly. Don't know where you got that or why you'd say it, as I've spent a lot of time here criticizing idealists and perfectionism in general.

I didn't get the connection you seemed to be making, or maybe the contrast, between donations and tax revenue and hoped that you might clear it up for me.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 03:05 pm
@hightor,
OK...

If you rightly believe tobacco is a terribly injurious product and you are an elected official you have some choices to make.

If you are a libertarian, you might say "All we can do is make sure the public is warned of the health risks. If they choose to smoke cigarettes, that's up to them."

If you are free-market capitalist, you might say "All we can do is make sure the public is warned of the health risks. If the product kills enough people, consumers will stop buying it."

If you are a progressive who believes the government should step in and ban products that are injurious to the public...like "Assualt Rifles" I would expect you to say "We must ban cigarettes!"

And yet I can't recall any progressive or liberal who has run a campaign that includes the promise of banning cigarettes.

Why might this be?

If you believe blatham then these death-dealing companies "tend to" donate to Republicans. Could it be the progressive candidates are receiving donations too? Nahh! Not them, they would reject them out of hand.

The dirty hardly-a-secret is that tobacco products generate enormous amounts of tax revenue that politicians like to spend...especially progressives.



hightor
 
  2  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 03:56 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Thanks.

Quote:
And yet I can't recall any progressive or liberal who has run a campaign that includes the promise of banning cigarettes.


Maybe your characterization of "progressives" isn't particularly accurate. You seem to want to minimize the extent of libertarian values on the left. Chomsky even describes himself as a "libertarian socialist". There is a sub-set of leftists who appear keen to "ban" assault-style weapons but I think the more realistic progressives simply want to see better control over their sale and tougher standards for firearm ownership. Banning cigarettes is more akin to the Women's Christian Temperance League than to today's progressivism.

Quote:
Could it be the progressive candidates are receiving donations too?


It should be easy to find out. It doesn't bother me if politicians spend the money that they receive from tobacco companies, or Monsanto, or Jeffrey Epstein for that matter. But if it can be shown that their votes are being bought it becomes a problem. And again, it should be relatively easy to detect this behavior.

Quote:
The dirty hardly-a-secret is that tobacco products generate enormous amounts of tax revenue that politicians like to spend...


If politicians weren't so enthusiastic about cutting broad-based taxes government wouldn't be as dependent of tobacco taxes.

Quote:
...especially progressives.


The current administration has increased military expenditures as tax revenue is falling.



chai2
 
  2  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 05:16 pm
100% agreeing with hightor here.

I'm going to look at the posts in this thread more carefully later for links, but I need info on where the people who have become ill or died got this stuff.

If I were to vape, it would have to be product from researched, reputable source with good quality control. Not something sold out of the trunk of a car that was mixed up in a kitchen sink.

Region Philbis
 
  4  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 06:05 pm

https://i.imgur.com/obyUcSf.jpg
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 06:44 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:

Thanks.

Quote:
And yet I can't recall any progressive or liberal who has run a campaign that includes the promise of banning cigarettes.


Maybe your characterization of "progressives" isn't particularly accurate. You seem to want to minimize the extent of libertarian values on the left. Chomsky even describes himself as a "libertarian socialist". There is a sub-set of leftists who appear keen to "ban" assault-style weapons but I think the more realistic progressives simply want to see better control over their sale and tougher standards for firearm ownership. Banning cigarettes is more akin to the Women's Christian Temperance League than to today's progressivism.

You're kidding, right? Have you listened to the 2020 Democrat candidates for POTUS?

Quote:
Could it be the progressive candidates are receiving donations too?


It should be easy to find out. It doesn't bother me if politicians spend the money that they receive from tobacco companies, or Monsanto, or Jeffrey Epstein for that matter. But if it can be shown that their votes are being bought it becomes a problem. And again, it should be relatively easy to detect this behavior.

Take that up with blatham

Quote:
The dirty hardly-a-secret is that tobacco products generate enormous amounts of tax revenue that politicians like to spend...


If politicians weren't so enthusiastic about cutting broad-based taxes government wouldn't be as dependent of tobacco taxes.

Hey, maybe all we need to resolve the national issue of gun violence is to increase taxes on guns and ammo!!

Quote:
...especially progressives.


The current administration has increased military expenditures as tax revenue is falling.

So to offset expenditures on national security we should increase taxes on death-dealing products?

I really can't believe you are making these arguments.





Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 06:45 pm
@chai2,
Quote:
100% agreeing with hightor here.


Which is to say?

He's said a lot.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 06:47 pm
@Region Philbis,
No, not necessarily, but let's say it's true...what do you propose?
chai2
 
  2  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 07:23 pm
@Region Philbis,
Region Philbis wrote:


https://i.imgur.com/obyUcSf.jpg



In large part, yep.

0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Fri 13 Sep, 2019 07:26 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
Have you listened to the 2020 Democrat candidates for POTUS?

No. I've got better things to do. I did hear that O'Rourke wants to buy back assault-style weapons but that's only one of the ten candidates. If you've got other examples I'd be interested.

Quote:
So to offset expenditures on national security we should increase taxes on death-dealing products?

No. We should institute broad-based taxes specifically pegged to the increased cost of our defense spending.

Quote:
I really can't believe you are making these arguments.

I'm not.
Region Philbis
  Selected Answer
 
  3  
Reply Sat 14 Sep, 2019 08:54 am
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
what do you propose?
propose?
i got nothing.

voluntarily putting something other than oxygen into your lungs is the epitome of ignorance...
chai2
 
  2  
Reply Sat 14 Sep, 2019 09:08 am
@Region Philbis,
I know, right?

Even as I little kid I knew that sucking smoke into your lungs wasn't a good thing.

I was a genius I tell ya.

0 Replies
 
 

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