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Defining life

 
 
anastas
 
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 05:43 pm
Just for the sake of discussion, what do you define life as?

As for me, I think that life is no different than, say, a table, aside from the obvious fact that it is more complex. To me, life (or, more accurately, an organism) is simply a complex, chaotic system of atoms. It's a series of (almsot compeltely) self-replenishing and self-sustaining chemical reactions. I say almost because we still seek out food - but given the required intake, life is self-sustaining. I say almost because we still age and die, which shows that there must be some slight chemical imbalance causing the eventual decay of an organism.

What about intelligence? Or, to broaden the subject, conciousness?

Again, to me, conciousness is a complex and chaotic system. I say chaotic because when you look at patterns in animal behavior, you notice general trends that can be preditced, but here are specific parts of anmal behavior that cannot be predicted. To word it differently, given 100 people, you might be able to rpedict what consensus they will reach about a subject, but you cannot predict what each and every individual will decide. So, in my opinion, you are born a specific way (genetics) and generally, people will react exactly the same way at first. But, as we know, not every person is under the same conditiona s everyone else throughout his lifetime. Each conciousness has different input - for example, a different colored bed while an infant - and the chaotic system of conciousness takes that input, processes it somehow, and spits out alterations to itself. This is why people are generally similar but differ in specifics. There are general trends, eg instincts such as self-preservation, but there are specifics that vary from person to person. We notice that, broadening the sample, people who have grown up in a poor neighborhood reason much differently than people who grew up in a rich neighborhood, but eighboring children often reason similarly.

I don't see conciousness as anything special. If you look at a bucket of water being subkected to some kind of outside force, such as stirring, you my notice similairites to how I described conciousness above. You can predict the general pattern of the water (such as currents in the ocean) but you cannot predict where a specific molecule of water will end up. The only difference between a bucket of water and a human mind is complexity.

I was wondering what other people thought, and will think about what I typed above. I'm interested to see howt his discussion will turn out.
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Sanctuary
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 06:47 pm
Life to me is the ability to breath/grow. Be in plants or humans - if it can take in oxygen and grow from it's time at birth, then it is alive to me.
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anastas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 07:01 pm
What about conciousness? What is it? What is intelligence?
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Discreet
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 07:14 pm
Conciousness is what defines human beings. By just plain aknowledging our existence we seperate ourselves from the animals and other organisms on the earth. With consiousness we have the power to question existence and everything on this earth that we know of
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fredjones
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Apr, 2005 03:12 am
I think that life is any amalgamation of molecules that can use energy to grow, providing it also has the necessary apparatus to independently replicate itself or otherwise reproduce. (I'm trying to exclude viruses here.)
Whatever consciousness is, it makes us responsible for our actions. (dangit)
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anastas
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Apr, 2005 01:13 pm
Discreet wrote:
Conciousness is what defines human beings. By just plain aknowledging our existence we seperate ourselves from the animals and other organisms on the earth. With consiousness we have the power to question existence and everything on this earth that we know of


What do you mean, :the animals"? First, humans are animals and second, at least some animals are self-aware. For example, when I curl my fingers (kind of like a talon) in my dog's face, he starts biting me and playing - it's a game I taught him. When I am sitting behind him and do it, sometimes he sees me in the mirror and turns around and bites me - he has learned that the mirror reflects what is going n and, more importantly, that that brown dog-shaped thing in the mirror is him and when the dog in the mirror is being threatened, then that means that he is. I'm 100% sure that dogs are self-aware, and likely other animals too (thought I have no chance to test it).
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fredjones
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Apr, 2005 07:51 pm
Anastas. I'm not sure if dogs are smart enough to have a concept of 'self.' I thought that dogs recognized people and things more by smell than by sight. So it is possible that the dog saw the 'talon' and immediately turned around to find you and bite you. The dog didn't necessarily have to recognize that the talon in the mirror was yours in order for him to turn around and bite you.

I consider my dogs people though. I treat them better than I treat my human friends. Wink
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Discreet
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Apr, 2005 10:48 pm
I hope so i don't want to report you to animal cops. Those people take pets seriously. That show is so dramatic lol. Anyone every watched it?
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anastas
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Apr, 2005 06:12 pm
fredjones wrote:
I consider my dogs people though. I treat them better than I treat my human friends. Wink


Same here. Honestly, I'd have a much easier time shooting a human than a dog.

Discreet wrote:
I hope so i don't want to report you to animal cops. Those people take pets seriously. That show is so dramatic lol. Anyone every watched it?


I can't handle watching that show, it just tears my heart to pieces.
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