0
   

European Faith

 
 
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 12:36 pm
The shortage of priests is only one of the problems bedeviling the Catholic Church in Europe. The urgent need to revitalize it is cited as a major reason why the world's cardinals who opened their conclave in Rome on Monday to elect a new pope may choose a European.

During his 26-year papacy, John Paul II used the force of his personality in dozens of trips around the Continent to try to bring back European Catholics who had fallen away.

Only 21 percent of Europeans say that religion is "very important" to them, according to the often-cited European Values Study, conducted in 1999 and 2000 and published two years ago. A similar survey in the United States by the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life put the number at nearly 60 percent.

The trend away from regular participation has been so noticeable that it has even been given a name: European apostasy.

"European Catholics are not against the Catholic Church," said Ulrich Ruh, editor of the Catholic monthly Herder-Korrespondenz, based in Freiburg, Germany. "They go to church at least once or twice a year and bring their children to be baptized and confirmed. Rather, they have made their own personal arrangements with the church and do not want to be disturbed. They do not want to be evangelized. That is why the pope failed to make the church more attractive."

Part of the problem is the church's emphasis on punishment and sin rather than on inclusion and community.(emphasis mine)

There is growth in Christianity on the Continent, but it tends to be among immigrants from Asia, Africa and Latin America, who are often drawn to churches described as evangelical, Pentecostal or charismatic.

The trend toward churches like these frustrates and even angers many traditional Catholic clerics. "We're seeing the super-marketing of religion," said the Rev. Jacques Anelli, director of the National Vocation Service of the French Catholic Church. "People consume, and when they don't find an institution they agree with, then they go somewhere else. Bad variations must not make us abandon what we are. The relationship with God must not be done like petty commerce."

When I read this, and these are my thoughts;

I've heard that Darwinism has gone a long way in Europe, that so many European's have stopped believing in any God.
  • Topic Stats
  • Top Replies
  • Link to this Topic
Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 2,420 • Replies: 24
No top replies

 
Laeknir Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 12:46 pm
I European believe not to believe in conditioned beliefs.
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 12:53 pm
You European talk better most of time.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 01:35 pm
Re: European Faith
ConstitutionalGirl wrote:

I've heard that Darwinism has gone a long way in Europe, that so many European's have stopped believing in any God.


I'm a Catholic myself - but I really have no idea at all, what Darwinism could have to do with my (and all other Catholics) belief in God.

Do you really think that our belief in God and the one of our brothers-in-Christ as there are the Evangelical, Protestant, Anglican, Orthodox etc. Christians proves that we stopped believing in Him? Shocked
0 Replies
 
Laeknir Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 02:01 pm
roger wrote:
You European talk better most of time.


Well, yes, Roger. I was trying hard to lower myself to ConstitutionalGirl's English level.

Do you REALLY want to know what I think about this post?

First of all, I felt a sense of anti-Europeanism in the question.

Then I saw that ConstitutionalGirl wrote:
"I've heard that Darwinism has gone a long way in Europe, that so many European's have stopped believing in any God."

This girl's equation is simple:
Darwinism=Atheism.
Europeans=Darwinists=Atheists.
Americans (Good Ol' God-Fearing-Bible-Belt-Red-Blooded Americans, not Liberal Pinko Queers)=Creationists=Deists.

You can't respond in good English to such ignorance (unless, you are, of course, Walter Hinteler, are touched by the Teutonic sanctity of the new Pope and feel good and merciful towards everybody else).

But I respond to you, since I think I owe you the bad English explanation, dear and respected Roger.

Oh, and yes. I do not believe in conditioned beliefs. There is probably a God, a creator, something. And he/she/it gave me a brain to avoid dogma.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 02:09 pm
Læknir Scrat wrote:
Darwinism=Atheism.
Europeans=Darwinists=Atheists.


Both my grandmother and my grandfather were taught 'Darwinisn' at grammar school: my grandmother at a private Catholic boarding school(run by a nun's order) about 1910, my grandfather at a 'normal' private school at about 1900 ... and of course, 'religion' was a subject at school in those days as it is today in Germany.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 02:11 pm
Does anyone else wonder what CG's first language is?
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 02:21 pm
Constitutional Girl wrote:
I've heard that Darwinism has gone a long way in Europe, that so many European's have stopped believing in any God.

This the second time today I hear an American assert this silly Darwinism=Atheism equation. This morning, in the Wall Street Journal, I read that Joseph Ratzinger aka Benedict XVI is a religious hardliner who "stood up against the tide of evolutionism" or something. It is arguably true that Ratzinger is a hardliner, but Darwinian evolution is not on the lon, long list of things he stood up against. The contention that god-fearing Christians cannot believe in descent with modification is a fallacy, and a US-American one at that.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 02:27 pm
Thomas wrote:
This morning, in the Wall Street Journal, I read that Joseph Ratzinger aka Benedict XVI is a religious hardliner who "stood up against the tide of evolutionism" or something.


Which is even more stupid, since his bibliography can easily be accessed online.
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 02:33 pm
I knew what you were doing, Scrat. I could have tossed in a couple of smileys, but knew you didn't need them.
0 Replies
 
ConstitutionalGirl
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 05:11 pm
Re: European Faith
Walter Hinteler wrote:
ConstitutionalGirl wrote:

I've heard that Darwinism has gone a long way in Europe, that so many European's have stopped believing in any God.


I'm a Catholic myself - but I really have no idea at all, what Darwinism could have to do with my (and all other Catholics) belief in God.

Do you really think that our belief in God and the one of our brothers-in-Christ as there are the Evangelical, Protestant, Anglican, Orthodox etc. Christians proves that we stopped believing in Him? Shocked
I never said Catholic's don't believe in a God. I was just using this story as a ilistration of how most European's could be Atheist.
0 Replies
 
Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 05:15 pm
Please don't take CG's semi-literacy as typical of all Americans. Well, typical of some of us, true, but not all...
0 Replies
 
ConstitutionalGirl
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 05:16 pm
ehBeth wrote:
Does anyone else wonder what CG's first language is?
I think she has the language of a strict Conservative, where Stupid Liberal's would not understand her.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Apr, 2005 05:22 pm
beat of a different drummer (it's a big universe)
0 Replies
 
Gazilion
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Apr, 2005 09:37 am
Læknir Scrat wrote:
First of all, I felt a sense of anti-Europeanism in the question.



I don't know if there was any anti-Europeanism in the question, but 2 things I know: (1) I'm European; (2) I'm Atheist.
So, if anybody call's me European Atheist I guess they're not being prejudicial -- just objective! Cool
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Apr, 2005 09:41 am
Oh My God, Laeknir Scrat, you crack me up . . .

Quote:
This girl's equation is simple:
Darwinism=Atheism.
Europeans=Darwinists=Atheists.
Americans (Good Ol' God-Fearing-Bible-Belt-Red-Blooded Americans, not Liberal Pinko Queers)=Creationists=Deists.


I'm rollin' on the floor . . . i'm peein' in my pants . . .




Uh, 'scuse me, i gotta go change . . .
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Apr, 2005 09:42 am
ConstitutionalGirl wrote:
ehBeth wrote:
Does anyone else wonder what CG's first language is?
I think she has the language of a strict Conservative, where Stupid Liberal's would not understand her.


I'd suggest the smart liberals would have a hard time, as well.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Apr, 2005 09:47 am
ConstitutionalGirl wrote:
ehBeth wrote:
Does anyone else wonder what CG's first language is?

I think she has the language of a strict Conservative, where Stupid Liberal's would not understand her.

I was unaware that strict conservatism requires "stupid liberal" to be capitalized, and its plural to be denoted by an apostrophe before the 's'. But apart from that, ConstitutionalGirl: Do you have any further questions about European faith which the Europeans in this thread can answer for you?
0 Replies
 
Duke of Lancaster
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 04:49 pm
ehBeth wrote:
Does anyone else wonder what CG's first language is?


MEEE PICK ME!!
I truly believe it's pig Latin Smile
0 Replies
 
Duke of Lancaster
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 04:51 pm
ConstitutionalGirl wrote:
ehBeth wrote:
Does anyone else wonder what CG's first language is?
I think she has the language of a strict Conservative, where Stupid Liberal's would not understand her.


ok, I concur with that......Liberals are stupid...I'm sorry, I think they're more than stupid. :wink:
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

THE BRITISH THREAD II - Discussion by jespah
FOLLOWING THE EUROPEAN UNION - Discussion by Mapleleaf
The United Kingdom's bye bye to Europe - Discussion by Walter Hinteler
Sinti and Roma: History repeating - Discussion by Walter Hinteler
[B]THE RED ROSE COUNTY[/B] - Discussion by Mathos
Leaving today for Europe - Discussion by cicerone imposter
So you think you know Europe? - Discussion by nimh
 
  1. Forums
  2. » European Faith
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 04/23/2024 at 02:13:16