"Great" Sitcoms we can no longer watch aka political correctness

@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

If I understand your point correctly, you have no problem with someone who is offended that you have taken offense by their criticism of your criticism of their criticism of your parody of their art representing your demographic.

Are you trying to give readers vertigo? Shocked

Quote:

I think there is another problem with group think... people block out any ideas or opinions that don't come from their political bubble. This isn't specifically a problem with free speech, but it is a problem with political correctness.

Your record's scratched and skipping. You might want to get a fresh copy on vinyl.

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@tsarstepan,

You said it!

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Quote:

I'm for deleting conspiracy theories, sexist, and racist remarks from a2k.

This is exactly the problem. This enforces an ideological bubble because its not about criticizing, arguing or condemning condemning things you judge to be offensive.

Political correctness wants to delete opposing opinions.

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@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

Quote:
I'm for deleting conspiracy theories, sexist, and racist remarks from a2k.

This is exactly the problem. This enforces an ideological bubble because its not about criticizing, arguing or condemning condemning things you judge to be offensive.

Political correctness wants to delete opposing opinions.

So? You're fine with Russian trolls posting out right lies to influence undereducated individuals? How about paparazzi writing blatant lies against certain targets in order to sell product? Terrorist manifestos calling for some kind of literal (not metaphorical) violent action against group or individuals.

Things that the US Supreme Court have already consider felonies across the US and throughout the 50 states.

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@tsarstepan,

I am very solidly pro-free speech on Able2know and I appreciate the extent that the moderators allow for most forms of expression here (I have disagreed with them on very rare occasions).

- Obviously felonies should be excluded.

- Russian Trolls should have the same rights as any other nationality of Trolls here, this includes posting things that you consider to be lies. I suspect you have post things I believe to be lies, that doesn't mean I can have them deleted.

- Calling for literal violent ... I haven't seen that here. I suppose in this hypothetical I would suggest moderators follow the Supreme Court standard that threats must be specific and present an immediate danger to be banned.

I do think we should all grab torches, poles and and ladders to storm the White House to give the current occupant a wedgie... don't you agree?

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@maxdancona,

An atomic wedgie?
Yes.

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@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

If I understand your point correctly, you have no problem with someone who is offended that you have taken offense by their criticism of your criticism of their criticism of your parody of their art representing your demographic.

I agree with your point Engineer... even though you are setting up an obvious endless loop (which is often considered a problem in my line of work). I have consistently supported free speech on this forum (and elsewhere). Criticism should be allowed and criticized.

Exactly. That endless loop is a debate.

maxdancona wrote:

The problem with political correctness is when it goes beyond speech. When people are fired for expressing and when speakers invited by students are run off campus... there is a line that is crossed.

There is another line out there that is not directly related to free speech. Employers have a right to employees who can do their jobs. If your opinions prevent you from doing your job effectively, that is a problem and your employer has no duty to allow you to perform in a substandard way. If you go around saying minorities are intellectually inferior and lazy and your opinions are producing problems in the workplace, don't expect to keep your job. No one is stopping you from stating your opinions, but if those opinions are preventing you from doing a good job, you need a new job.

Speakers on campus are an interesting case. Students have the free speech right to protest on campus much the same way anti abortion activists have the right to protest at abortion clinics or Westboro Baptist has the right to protest funerals. But none of these people has the right to obstruct others or use violence.

Quote:

I think there is another problem with group think... people block out any ideas or opinions that don't come from their political bubble.

That can certainly be the case, but I think you overuse that. When people disagree with you, you immediately toss this out. It can't be that people have read your opinion and personally disagree based on their experiences and worldview, it must by that they live in an ideological bubble and are not open to your insights. Like calling someone "politically correct", this is a way of dismissing the opinions of others off hand. You have written that no one can tell you what you believe. I would argue that you can't tell whether someone has been indoctrinated by their "bubble" or have come to their beliefs through considered opinion.

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@engineer,

Quote:

That can certainly be the case, but I think you overuse that. When people disagree with you, you immediately toss this out.

No, you aren't correct. There are people with whom I disagree who I don't think are operating in a bubble. Thomas is a good example of this.

I am making a subjective judgement when I say that someone is operating in ideological bubble. But it means that I feel that someone is making a rote argument based on preexisting beliefs rather than considering the facts.

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@engineer,

I thought it was ethically wrong for Google to fire James Damore (we already debated this, but it is a good example of the point). Yes, I concede the point that Google had the legal right to fire him, but I also believe that they should have stood on principle of accepting speech. This example is a little difficult... because I understand the other side. If I were a Google executive and this were my decision, I would not have fired him. Open discussion should be a good thing in a creative organization. If you fire someone, you inevitably hurt free expression. Companies have to draw a line... but it should be a pretty broad line erring on the side of free expression.

Speakers on campus aren't a complicated issue for me. Speakers should unequivocally be allowed to speak on campus based on a standard the applies equally to Nelson Mandela and Richard Spencer. Universities should allow a diverse range of opinions from feminists to White Nationalists... that is the point of education.

Students should be allowed to criticize, protest, condemn anyone they like. They should not be allowed to disrupt or stop the speaker from speaking.

This doesn't seem so complicated to me.

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@Linkat,

I am not sure if sitcom's such as All In The Family, The Jeffersons, and the Little Rascals would be allowed
if they were brand new shows today

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@Real Music,

And that would be a terrible thing.

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@roger,

I grew up watching (All In The Family) and (The Jeffersons).

I also grew up watching reruns of (The Little Rascals).

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@maxdancona,

Certainly, you may feel that way, but you are still telling us what our opinions are instead of listening to what we post and using your assumption of an "ideological bubble" to avoid having to engage our opinions/criticism. That is what charging "political correctness" is about - an excuse to disregard opinions critical of your own.

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@Real Music,

Real Music wrote:

I grew up watching (All In The Family) and (The Jeffersons).

I also grew up watching reruns of (The Little Rascals).

You confused me there a bit... because unlike some goofbuckets… you're actually talking about the OP topic that's been derailed by the usual suspects.

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@Real Music,

Real Music wrote:

I am not sure if sitcom's such as All In The Family, The Jeffersons, and the Little Rascals would be allowed
if they were brand new shows today

That's an interesting thought. I would say that there are more provocative shows coming out today, but not on network TV. Have you seen GLOW in Netflix (highly recommended)? Lots of commentary in there wrapped up in a comedy. Shows like The Handmaiden's Tale would never make it on risk averse network stations, but just like we have far more platforms to express our individual opinions, there are many more platforms to creative shows as well. We no longer need to rely on network management to curate our culture for us.

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@engineer,

Seems like older generations struggling with getting older and the culture passing them by is something that happens with every generation.

Every generation has had a “I wish it was like the good ole days” moment.

I hope I don’t lose the ability to recognize that for what it is when I’m in my later years.

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@tsarstepan,

You think I purposefully mosrepresented her gender as some sort of insult?

I don’t recall a single time where her gender was revealed to me.

We are in a digital forum, she has a non gender specific name, she has no picture/icon representing a gender. Her and I have had very few discussions on this board.

Know what? I don’t know your gender either.

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@engineer,

I make an effort to understand the arguments on both sides of an issue, and I search for the facts supporting each. This is something I consider important... and I like the fact that I can find the weaknesses on both sides of an issue including my own.

I am liberal on most political issues at least as far as social goals.. It is frustrating to me that my own side (liberals) is so willing to ignore twist or mistate facts even when I agree with the conclusion. Of course conservatives do the same, but it doesn't bother me as much. Go figure.

Political correctness pushes a narrative whether the facts support it or not. This is not a good thing in my opinion.

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@maporsche,

maporsche wrote:

You think I purposefully mosrepresented her gender as some sort of insult?

Your post was pretty aggressive and error filled. Not saying it was misogynist but considering the years both of you have been on a2k. That's understandable that you don't know her for whatever reason but you certainly made some assumptions one usually makes for a newbie troll who just showed up to the forum a week ago.

Quote:

I don’t recall a single time where her gender was revealed to me.

Do you mean 80% of her threads where she talks about being a mother to her daughter?

Quote:

I don’t know your gender either.

That never bothers me. But than again, many regulars (not speaking of the ones I've actually met) can seem to figure out my name is Stephen and all that entails. My username isn't too difficult to figure.

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@tsarstepan,

Are those threads in the Political Forum? Because I’d say 99.9% of time/posts are spent there. I just looked at her recent posts; there is not a lot of overlap with mine. I only looked back 5-8 pages; it’s no surprise I didn’t know her gender.

I wasn’t really making too far a leap on assumptions. I specifically commented on the part in reference to friends. The largest and most often complaint made about Friends when looking through the lenses of 2018 is how homophobic that show is/was. Google it; there have been many many many articles referencing this. It’s come up on this site before.

Regardless, it wasn’t intentional and I’ll probably forget her gender next time we interact, which at the current rate will be in about 3 years.

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"Great" Sitcoms we can no longer watch aka political correctness

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