The 'Holy Ghost'; He, She...or "It"?

@Setanta,

Setanta wrote:

Well, there is the pronoun "it," which, conveniently, rhymes with bullsh*t.

Well, yes. Why would a unique entity have gender in the first place? What would it do with it?

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@roger,

Presumably what single men have been doing with it for millennia.

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@MadJW,

MadJW wrote:

The Hebrew and Greek words used mean "breath" or "wind"; unseen forces.

You're saying the Holy Spirit is some sort of divine fart. That must be why people say "Jesus!" when they get a whiff of a particularly pungent air biscuit.

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@MadJW,

MadJW wrote:

His spirit was in Job's nose!

Jesus!

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@vikorr,

"@MadJW,
I'm guessing then, that as you believe him to be a spirit / power, that he is everywhere / in everything. That raises a question - how can one be 'in his presence', is it just a significant concentration of his power?

As an aside, in relation to your use of the pronoun 'He', I would be careful of anything written many years after the fact (ie. the bible) - particularly in a patriarchal society. Anyone being moved by the spirit of God, in such a society, is likely to interpret God as male, no matter what the reality. And if 'He' is a spirit/power, then 'He' is almost certainly gender neutral (having no need of organs of either sex)."

No need to assume- and gender is a metaphor, too; no such thing as a woman dominated society- except legend about 'Amazons'....

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@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

I'm guessing then, that as you believe him to be a spirit / power, that he is everywhere / in everything. That raises a question - how can one be 'in his presence', is it just a significant concentration of his power?

As an aside, in relation to your use of the pronoun 'He', I would be careful of anything written many years after the fact (ie. the bible) - particularly in a patriarchal society. Anyone being moved by the spirit of God, in such a society, is likely to interpret God as male, no matter what the reality. And if 'He' is a spirit/power, then 'He' is almost certainly gender neutral (having no need of organs of either sex).

No need to assume- and the gender, too, is likely a metaphor: no such thing as a woman- dominated society- except in myths about Amazons...

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

MadJW wrote:

His spirit was in Job's nose!

Jesus!

JESUS was in Job's nose?

1 Reply

@MadJW,

You do know that Jesus wasn't just someone who went round doing massive farts. He did other stuff too, some of his burps were pretty spectacular.

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@izzythepush,

Those who imagine that " holy spirit" is some kind of a ghost with objective reality and super power is suffering from spiritual materialism or else is a five-year-old.

That would be like imagining "school spirit" as a ghost who hangs out in the girls locker room, a sort of perverted, ghostly voyeur.

Spirit is always a subjective experience, whether divine or otherwise, and I see no reason to project it and assign it its own objective reality.

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@coluber2001,

But you're not a nutter like some on this thread.

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@izzythepush,

That's what I want on my tombstone, "He wasn't a nutter".

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@coluber2001,

Spike Milligan wanted. "I told them I was ill" put on his but the council wouldn't allow it.

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@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

I'm guessing then, that as you believe him to be a spirit / power, that he is everywhere / in everything. That raises a question - how can one be 'in his presence', is it just a significant concentration of his power?

As an aside, in relation to your use of the pronoun 'He', I would be careful of anything written many years after the fact (ie. the bible) - particularly in a patriarchal society. Anyone being moved by the spirit of God, in such a society, is likely to interpret God as male, no matter what the reality. And if 'He' is a spirit/power, then 'He' is almost certainly gender neutral (having no need of organs of either sex).

Of course!

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@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

The Holy Spirit got a woman pregnant.

That is masculine in the biological sense of the word.

The "POWER" of the "Most High" did- as Gabriel explained it to Mary.
God- or ONE of 'Them'- didn't have sex with her.

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@Setanta,

The bible was written for believers. If you don't believe then it is nonsense by definition. The choice is up to you.

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You are talking about figures of speech. The figure of speech we are discussing is "condescensio", where a higher being "condescends" to be described in terms that apply to a lower being. Our God is not he, she or it, but we have no other words, so our God "condescends" to be described in human terms. Another example is when we say a man "gets up on his hind legs". A man does not have hind legs, so he condescends to be described in words that refer to an animal.

Here is a free download written by E. W. Bullinger, an Anglican minister about 1908. It describes about 900 kinds of figures and gives references to their use in the bible. It is almost the only work in the subject for the last two thousand years:
archive.org/details/figuresofspeechu00bull

You can get a hard copy at any bible book store or amazon.com

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'Holy'- set apart for something
'Spirit'- breath, wind (metaphor for power)
Jesus where he referred to "it" as "he:, really means "it" in the Greek.

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@TruthMatters,

I am pretty sure Jesus had a penis. I think God has a penis too, the word "father" is pretty specific.

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Spiritual materialism.

That's like asking if the spirit of the high school football team lives in the locker room.

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@MadJW,

It is a term for objects.

You shouldn't refer to any being that way. No person, and part of God.

The Holt Ghost is a They. (Or We) This is a collective being.

The Bible mentions the Body of Christ. This is the image you need, in order to understand things.

2 Replies

The 'Holy Ghost'; He, She...or "It"?

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