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Alternative to Prison

 
 
gollum
 
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 12:49 pm
Could a municipality, State, or the Federal government (U.S.) impose as punishment for conviction to a particular crime, that the person leave that municipality, State, or country and agree never to return to it?

This would be far less costly that a prson term.
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Type: Question • Score: 2 • Views: 1,121 • Replies: 7
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jespah
 
  2  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 01:06 pm
@gollum,
I'm not sure about the feds but at the state level this would be unconstitutional because of the interstate commerce clause, I believe.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 01:43 pm
@jespah,
You mean, exporting crooks would have to be regulated?
jespah
 
  2  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 01:44 pm
@roger,
Heh, more that we allow interstate travel without regulations and a part of that is the interstate commerce of, say, someone from New Mexico buying a sandwich in Arizona.
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najmelliw
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2018 08:45 am
@gollum,
On the federal level this might be difficult as well, seeing as how basically only someone with a dual nationality could feasibly give one up to live somewhere else. Otherwise, they'd have to emigrate, which might be hard if they have a criminal record. Also, other countries might not be too keen on accepting these criminals (you might opt for Mexico though: according to Herr Donald, they send all their murderers and rapists to the US anyways. It seems only fair you get to return the favor, right?)

OR you could just do as the Brits did at one time in history: just annex another continent and send all your criminals there. Australia is taken, but perhaps the North Pole?

0 Replies
 
gollum
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2018 06:00 pm
@jespah,
jespah-

Today The New York Times published an article stating that Virginia just barred a man from Virginia.

See below:

Christopher Cantwell, White Nationalist in Vice Video, Is Barred From Virginia

Christopher Cantwell pleaded guilty on Friday to assault and battery charges arising from his use of pepper spray against protesters in Charlottesville, Va., last August.

By Mihir Zaveri

July 21, 2018

Christopher Cantwell, a self-described white nationalist who pepper-sprayed protesters during the demonstrations in Charlottesville, Va., last August, pleaded guilty to assault and battery on Friday and has been barred from Virginia for five years, prosecutors said.

Mr. Cantwell, 37, rose as a high-profile activist for the alt-right after being featured in a Vice News documentary about the demonstrations in Charlottesville. Some mocked him as the “crying Nazi” after he posted a video online in which he fights back tears while describing the aftermath of the demonstrations.

Now, he has been thrown out of Virginia after pleading guilty to two counts of assault and battery, and to violating the terms of his bond by referring to victims on social media and in a radio broadcast, prosecutors said in a statement. As part of the plea, Mr. Cantwell must not return to Virginia for five years.

Mr. Cantwell, who faced 12 months in jail for the crimes, had already served 107 days. The rest of his sentence was suspended. Mr. Cantwell was ordered to leave Virginia within eight hours of the delivery of his sentence on Friday, and not to make contact with the victims of his assault and battery crimes.

“This outcome brings a measure of finality to the defendant’s dispersal of pepper spray nearly a year ago,” Robert Tracci, the Albemarle County commonwealth’s attorney, said in a statement on Friday.

Reached by phone on Saturday, Mr. Cantwell said that he was not happy about the plea deal and that he had confessed to crimes he did not commit instead of facing prosecution. He said he had returned to his home in New Hampshire and planned to travel around the country to meet with listeners of his podcast as well as network with other members of the alt-right.

“With the ultimate goal of having an ethno-state,” Mr. Cantwell said.

Mr. Cantwell said he planned to use the media attention he has received, including the Vice documentary and being targeted as the “crying Nazi,” as a pulpit.

“I’ve got to leverage whatever I can to get what I want,” he said.

On Saturday morning, a new episode of another podcast posted on Mr. Cantwell’s website declared: “Cantwell is free! Give yourself a huge pat on the back if you contributed in any way to his defense as I’m sure he wouldn’t have made it out of the Democratic People’s Republic of Virginia without you.”

Charlottesville continues to grapple with the deadly white nationalist rally last August. Mr. Cantwell’s charges stemmed from a march on the University of Virginia campus the night of Aug. 11. That march preceded the larger demonstrations the next day, when fights broke out between white nationalists and counterprotesters and a man drove through a crowd, killing a 32-year-old woman.

Nearly every city official who held power at the time has resigned or retired, but Charlottesville’s Confederate statues, whose planned removal by the city spawned the white nationalist protest, still remain, as do the local organizers who planned the rally.

For some, Mr. Cantwell’s guilty plea brings a form of closure.

“I’m relieved that he has admitted to what happened, to his assaults, and I think that his admission is probably showing a degree of accountability that has been missing for the last 11 months,” said Emily Gorcenski, an activist for transgender rights who said she was pepper-sprayed by Mr. Cantwell on Aug. 11.

Ms. Gorcenski said she was relieved that Mr. Cantwell can “no longer bring violence to the Charlottesville community,” where her wife and in-laws live.

Mr. Cantwell has sued Ms. Gorcenski for “malicious prosecution” based on complaints she and another protester filed with the authorities after the episode in August. The lawsuit has been stayed pending the criminal case, and is expected to resume in the coming days.

Upon receiving a phone call from a reporter, Elmer Woodard, Mr. Cantwell’s lawyer, laughed and said he did not talk to “fake news” before hanging up.

Mr. Cantwell turned himself in to the authorities last August and was charged then with two felony counts of illegal use of tear gas and one felony count of malicious bodily injury by means of a caustic substance.

Prosecutors said that as part of Mr. Cantwell’s plea deal, they had amended the original charges to the assault and battery charges to which he ultimately pleaded guilty. The deal ensured Mr. Cantwell that no additional charges would be brought against him arising from his “deployment of pepper spray, tear gas, phosgene, or other gas” on Aug. 11.

In a previous interview with The New York Times, Mr. Cantwell had said that he did not cry because he was scared about going to prison, but that the “country has descended to a point where your political opinions get you charged with felonies.”
jespah
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Jul, 2018 06:34 pm
@gollum,
Thank you. How weird. I'm still not convinced it would stand constitutional scrutiny. Neo-nazis are vile but we really don't warehouse people in the US who aren't in some sort of an institution. And banning someone from one state I would argue effectively warehouses them in the other 49.
gollum
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Jul, 2018 04:20 am
@jespah,
jespah-

Thank you.

In many cases I think it is more cost effective than prison. England used to deport some people to Australia.

I think for non-recidivists a financial penalty and/or community service is best.
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