Subjective grading and unresponsive teacher

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My daughter is a freshman in high school. So far this school year she has received As or high Bs in all her classes. She has hard academic subjects taking two math classes at once (Geometry and Algebra) so she can get ahead in math and has two honors classes - English and Spanish.

She has just missed getting As in English by either 1 or 2 points. This term she had a low A until 2 days before the end of the term when the teacher posted 5 grades. She now has a C. How do you go from an A up until 2 days before the end of the term to a C?

She had a project which she worked her butt of on. I know as I am at home seeing her work on this. This project was a presentation on part of a difficult reading. Any way - she thought she aced it. She went above what other students did already and when she completed the presentation her teacher just smiled at her and said nothing. During the presentation my daughter had an interactive fun "quiz" where they teacher and students seemed very engaged. Other students' presentations, she corrected on things they did wrong and mentioned whether they should have added something or so forth - nothing was said to my daughter. Her classmates even said she did well and thought it was one of the best.

We see the grade a 64%. I told my daughter go talk to her - give her the facts of why you think you deserve higher. Also, she could have made an error on the grading....Nope her teacher said it was confusing and not creative.

I have emailed her and left her a phone message. I have heard nothing.

What are my next steps? I plan on asking her specifically what made it confusing? What was not creative of it? Why did this other student get an 88% when it appears his presentation that came afterwards had very similar material used as hers? What did this student do differently?

But I cannot do this if I do not hear from her.

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Oh and the Parent Teacher conference I attended previously - the teacher said oh I am not worried about K-- as she is doing great.

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@Linkat,

Make a few more attempts at contacting the teacher. If there is no response by Monday afternoon/Tuesday morning, try to contact the department head and then if necessary, the principal.

Explain it as you have here, how the grades were fine throughout and without warning there was a sudden unexplained drop. The teacher at the very least should have indicated that your daughter was suddenly not performing as well as it was known that she could and that she was in danger of having a lower final grade.

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@Sturgis,

Thanks - the issue is Monday is the last day of classes and then finals.

But I called the school and asked if I could leave a voicemail - the office said that the best way to hear is to email which I said I did not get a response. So they left her a message asking her to call me.

At the end of the day - she did send a quick email saying she spoke with my daughter and gave me what sounded like a more detailed reason for the grade than what my daughter relayed. Which of course conflicted with my daughter's opinion of her presentation.

Realizing there are two points of view, I responded: Thank you so much for providing details on her project. I do know that she worked hard on this as I was home while she was working on a great portion of it. I also understand she had the 4 weeks and we made sure she started working on it from the beginning to help her plan and be successful.

I will reach out to her and tell her why she received this grade. I understand that my daughter's viewpoint may be different than yours and I want her to understand fully why she may have fallen short. After speaking with her, if we have further questions do you think we could meet with you on Monday?
Thank you for your help and understanding.

She then responded:

I spoke with your daughter today and felt she understood what I was saying. I will give her the rubric to the project on Monday. She was suppose to pick it up after school, but didn't drop by.
Thank you,

So apparently she doesn't want to speak with us.

I left a message with the Principal. More that we were completely shut out and I let him know that she is unwilling to meet with us.

My daughter of course disagrees, but I want her to give me the entire project if she only did 2 slides then yes I could agree with the teacher.

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@Linkat,

Well, it's good that there has finally been a response. I wish you and your daughter the best in all of this.

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@Sturgis,

I just remember being in high school and having (and it happened to be English) a teacher I really could not personally stand. He was sexist and racist - he actually told a kid in my grade that he was our token negro. He like girls that would kiss his butt and act all girlish and helpless.

A girl I sat next too was great at it and she was getting good grades. I got Cs in his class probably the first time. Anything that I wrote that was subjective I got a poor grade; anything that was not subjective meaning there was just a right or wrong answer I got As--- thus the overall C.

I never stood up and complained and neither did my parents - we didn't think we could, I just toughed it out.

I don't think this is quite the same thing - I honestly just think this teacher is lazy and doesn't care. Although it is no excuse she is retiring after this year so I think she is just not caring.

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Sshe got a 64% - of what?

Sounds like there was a list of requirements for the project, and daughter didn’t do or submit what was needed to meet the basic for the grade.

So no matter how “creative” it was, it didn’t score on the requirements. The “project rubric” would list these requirements.

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@PUNKEY,

Yes my daughter has the rubic which was given at the beginning of the assignment- but the teacher said her project was confusing and not creative enough - she did not say she didn't meet the requirements - but she sent me more specifics than what she told my daughter so I need to see the actual project to see if that is true.

My issue is now the teacher unwilling to discuss if I find what she said is untrue. I can not comment on what she said in the class as that is subjective - but I can comment if I see the support of her project and it isn't what the teacher mentioned. If that is the case then I would want to meet with her. That was what I was proposing and she kind of shut me down.

64% of a hundred. Percentages are also of 100%.

She currently has all As in other classes (and she had an A in this class until the teacher gave her a 64% on this project) and a high B in one other class so this is not a student who is a slacker.

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@Linkat,

Linkat wrote:

Other students' presentations, she corrected on things they did wrong and mentioned whether they should have added something or so forth - nothing was said to my daughter. Her classmates even said she did well and thought it was one of the best.

The lesson here is she's not a team player. And the class knows it so they don't engage with her. The teacher TOLD her and YOU that the assignment was CONFUSING and NOT CREATIVE. Quit being a helicopter mom and allow your daughter to accept the grade. If she wants a Participation trophy, she can play soccer.

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@neptuneblue,

Actually, her daughter is a team sports player and is beyond participation trophies.

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A score of 64% has been issued. That is objective scoring, based on the requirements.

Being “confusing and non- creative” could affect the score IF these two criteria were on the requirement list.

Yes. “Creativity” is subjective; being “ clear and concise” could be up to interpretation.

I suggest that you not listen to your daughter’s peers on whether or not the criteria was met. Instead, your daughter should have asked how the presention could have been more clear and get the teacher’s input on how it lacked creativity.

Your daughter may not have a talent for presentation, OR the teacher may be a vindictive bitch. In any case, this won’t be the worse thing your daughter hears in her school experience.

She needs to find out how to make a better presentation. You can’t or should not do that for her. Make her find out how to do better - just like when she asks her coach how to improve her basketball skills.

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@Linkat,

From a parent/teacher, the best thing for your daughter to do is make an appointment with the teacher and the rubric.

She should approach the meeting from a sincere perspective of trying to learn how to follow a rubric with more precision. There is a chance Daughter is wrong.

In the case that Teacher is cleaning her shoe on Daughter, having to take 45 minutes after school having to come up with fake reasons why she selected what she did on the rubric, while Daughter patiently asks her why this component she carefully added to meet that particular rubric category does.not.suffice....

One of them will either learn something (Daughter) or get a deserved comeuppance (teacher).

Daughter needs to take her presentation, too.

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@jespah,

I am completely shocked at the amount of disrespect and disdain shown to this teacher. It's now the 4th quarter of the school year and the student has maintained a B average throughout the year. On this particular assignment, the student did not follow the rubic and the grade reflected that. The teacher knows who and how this student preforms and again, this assignment was not her best work.

Teachers have an upwards of 50-100-200 students (depending on the size of the district) at at time and sometimes it is not feasible to return phone calls when an email would be just as effective. To call the principal to complain that the teacher "completely shut her out" is not accurate since the teacher talked to the student and explained the grade.

Comparing her child to another student's grade is unfair and not being a team player. Since OP does not live with the other student, she cannot verify how the student prepared their work, nor was she there during the actual presentation. Hence, she should leave other student's performance alone and concentrate on her own child.

The quip about the teacher being lazy and not caring is just wrong. You're talking about a person who dedicated their life to the teaching profession and deserves much respect for their tenure. To see a teacher being slandered is unconscionable.

Again, teachers are busy at the end of a school year. There's absolutely no reason to have a face to face conference about ONE bad grade in approximately 192 school days. This is high school, not grade school and students need to learn how to deal with stressful situations like this.

I have an over achiever who is in the National Honor Society who would think getting ONE bad grade is the end of the world. It's not. It is a learning experience, not something a principal needs to be involved in.

1 Reply

Neptune,

In my experience, one grade doesn’t crash a student down that far, especially at the very end of term when so many grades are being averaged.

Something doesn’t seem right.

The student is owed an explanation in this case.

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@Lash,

It could be a 79, a point away from a B, we don't know. And she was given an explanation, although she doesn't agree, doesn't make it wrong.

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@neptuneblue,

Quote:

I have an over achiever who is in the National Honor Society who would think getting ONE bad grade is the end of the world. It's not. It is a learning experience, not something a principal needs to be involved in.

So, you would just tell the child to "suck it up. Deal with it.". Well aren't you the good parent or guardian Rolling Eyes

. No! If a final grade is that far removed from earlier marking periods, something is amiss. The teacher and if necessary the principal definitely need to be involved. If the student was headed in this direction, the teacher had the responsibility to contact the parent or guardian. Contact them directly, not just through a note sent home with the student.

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@Sturgis,

Even as a teacher who does value my time, I suggest to all students—including my own children—to follow up with teachers on cases like this.

This is how students learn to advocate in the world for themselves, but also may learn more precisely how to do better work.

And truthfully, I’ve changed a grade a couple of times in situations like this. Teachers are inundated with grading at certain periods and, as human beings, may be stricken with Muddled Grade Head, a temporary but diabolically effective thinking disorder. This teacher may not be open to admitting a mistake.

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@Sturgis,

Sturgis wrote:

So, you would just tell the child to "suck it up. Deal with it.". Well aren't you the good parent or guardian . No! If a final grade is that far removed from earlier marking periods, something is amiss. The teacher and if necessary the principal definitely need to be involved. If the student was headed in this direction, the teacher had the responsibility to contact the parent or guardian. Contact them directly, not just through a note sent home with the student.

I never said, suck it up and deal with it. I said it's nothing to contact a principal about. It's something I work on with my child. I certainly understand the pressure of the all Honors (weighted) course my kid takes. It's hectic and time consuming. And,, one bad grade isn't something to melt down over.

And, it's not the teacher's responsibility to contact a parent. Geez, this is high school, act accordingly. There could be a curve to a final grading period, again we don't know that. I think if you got a bad performance review at work, your mom isn't going to contact your boss to complain how unfair it is. Again, work with your child to understand and accept that sometimes, you don't get everything right.

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@neptuneblue,

neptuneblue wrote:

Linkat wrote:

Other students' presentations, she corrected on things they did wrong and mentioned whether they should have added something or so forth - nothing was said to my daughter. Her classmates even said she did well and thought it was one of the best.

The lesson here is she's not a team player. And the class knows it so they don't engage with her. The teacher TOLD her and YOU that the assignment was CONFUSING and NOT CREATIVE. Quit being a helicopter mom and allow your daughter to accept the grade. If she wants a Participation trophy, she can play soccer.

She doesn't play soccer.

Seriously though what has this to do with being a team player???? This was an individual assignment that each student was to present a chapter to the class (basically the teacher said she didn't want to teach any more so she was going to have the students teach it).

It is normal to meet with teachers if your child is having an issue so you can work it out with the teacher. I even told the teacher that I wanted to meet with her so my daughter could learn why she did not meet exceptions...confusing how? Show and demonstrate what is confusing so she knows going forward.

All other teachers I have dealt with did the same - recently she had a poor grade on Geometry test after having all As in the class and my daughter thought she had done well. The teacher met with her - took the test out and showed her how she went astray. The next test - my daughter aced as a result. I was in contact with this teacher as well via email - but she was responsive and worked with my daughter right away to get her back on track.

It is important to be involved as a parent - it shows you care and shows you think this important. I do have them reach out to the teachers themselves first (and usually I follow with an email it is seems something out of character to make sure there is not something else going on).

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@jespah,

jespah wrote:

Actually, her daughter is a team sports player and is beyond participation trophies.

Why thank you jespah - in both sports and in school we emphasize that you are to earn your starting spot or you need to earn your grade.

My issue here is that doesn't seem to be the case. I do have an update though and will right it all up

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