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Wed 15 Dec, 2004 09:02 am
I believe we are our own Gods.When/if we pray we are praying o ourselves and hopefully positive vibes will float out and make good things happen, like if you smile at someone they are more likely to smile back at you.
I believe there was someone who had such an influence that they inspired people to write the Bible.Was it the definately the person we know as Jesus?
Ive heard that Jesus means the son of God.Was this name already around or was it thought up when he was born?Bit of luck if it was already thought up.
Your post raises a lot of ideas.
You suggest:
Quote:I believe we are our own Gods.When/if we pray we are praying o ourselves and hopefully positive vibes will float out and make good things happen, like if you smile at someone they are more likely to smile back at you.
I think over the ages many good people have had very positive thoughts--and the fury of the Norsemen has not been one whit abated by those positive thoughts.
When innocence is bliss....perhaps being wise is a better idea.
Re: Thoughts please
material girl wrote:I believe we are our own Gods.When/if we pray we are praying o ourselves and hopefully positive vibes will float out and make good things happen, like if you smile at someone they are more likely to smile back at you.
Praying to ourselves? That sounds pretty much like a contradiction to me. Why would "positive vibes" float out and make good things happen if we pray to ourselves? Of course we can spread joy and peace around us, but it is never our own joy and peace, but God's. Through prayer to God we open up our hearts to God, and then he can fill us with his graces such as joy, peace and love, and it is then up to us to make good use of these graces and really live them fully by sharing them with others.
Quote:Ive heard that Jesus means the son of God.Was this name already around or was it thought up when he was born?Bit of luck if it was already thought up.
Jesus is from "Yeshua" (Hebrew) which means "God saves".
Sharing good graces with others-Exactly, YOU are spreading the goodness.
How can God give you good feelings?Maybe its just reasoning with yourself by praying,offloading your problems that makes you feel better.
material girl wrote:haring good graces with others-Exactly, YOU are spreading the goodness.
How can God give you good feelings?Maybe its just reasoning with yourself by praying,offloading your problems that makes you feel better.
How God does this is of course beyond human comprehension, but 'how' doesn't really matter, the important thing is that it does indeed come from God, which countless of people can testify to you that it does. This certitude which so many people have felt is one of God's mysteries in itself.
One thing is for sure, though. No true happiness or joy can come from oneself. We weren't made to live for ourselves, but for God and for our neighbour.
Live good, be an inspiration to others, and give all thanks to God, not to yourself. Nothing that is good comes from man.
God didnt invent money.If somebody won the lottery and gave it all away to a charity to buy hospital equipment or toys for special needs kids, who is responsible for the happiness it brings?
BTW Im not trying to say there is no God.
Why would God want all the credit?
material girl wrote:God didnt invent money.If somebody won the lottery and gave it all away to a charity to buy hospital equipment or toys for special needs kids, who is responsible for the happiness it brings?
BTW Im not trying to say there is no God.
Why would God want all the credit?
Because God deserves all credit. No person can do anything whatsoever without God. If a person wins on the lottery and donates all money to charity he/she does not do so from his/her own goodness, but from God's. It is true that the person has a choice not to donate money, but instead may use the money for whatever he/she pleases, however, that does not mean that by choosing good the good belongs to ourself. God has given us free will so that we may choose between good and evil. Choosing good means choosing God and our neighbour, choosing evil means choosing oneself and the world (material pleasures etc).
Who/what is responsible for some children being born handicapped?
I don't know. I'm not omniscient. I don't know why everything is at it is.
Although, I know this:
God is love itself and goodness itself, and nothing of evil can come from him. His love for each one of his children is infinite, utterly and completely beyond human comprehension.
We cannot be gods or goddesses - well we could be I suppose but the responsibility would be so overwhelming. But on the other hand we would not be able to play the blame game with all the power within us. I like that idea - each human taking responsibility for the condition of the world what do you think about that?
It sounds like a reasonable idea. If people are inherently good and have an innate sense of morality, the act of praying emphasizes this. It is similar to the question, "Why pray to an omnipotent God when I can't change His mind?" By praying for someone, you change the way you will act around them and emphasize to yourself just how important they are. Praying, in any sense, can bring out the "inherently good" ego that we possess and help to overcome the immoral facade that we wear around others. God, then, is the Moral Human Ideal within us that must be discovered and brought out. Just an idea...
Thalion,
Are people inherently good and, if so, how do you define good?
People are inherently good to the extent that acting morally will give them a happier life. Becoming "addicted" in a way to material things will inevitably make one's life less happy. Doing something immoral will plague our conscience. In this way all people are inherently the same. Most people have a sense of what is moral and are affected similarly by "immoral" actions. What is "Good" is what is most Human- what will make us happiest because it is Truth. God, as we conceive of Him, exists only through ourselves, and therefore must originate from something innate in our being (Yes, I'm assuming that God is not a separate being that instills knowledge of Himself in us because of all the problems with suggesting a physical God). God then, could be the innateness of our Being- the Ideal of Human-ness. Perhaps this is why gods are found in all cultures. This, however, creates the problem that Morality does not exist for those who are not affected by Immoral actions. The mass murderer, if he does not feel remorse, is not affected by his bad actions, and is therefore not sinning. This can solved though by Civil Law, which will put him to death in the physical sense.
ve got a couple points.
Think about this, Derevon said all good comes from god. In that case, if we cannot create good, it is certain that we can neither create evil. In that case humans are nothing but shells, with strings being pulled.
That is for certain not what i think though.
Most people would consider democracy good, and that is why we should have it, because it is good. And if all goodness comes from god, democracy surely came from god, right derevon?
Instead, consider this, up until 11, 000 years ago we were hunter-gatherers. For a million years we were hunter gatherers. When hunting, everybody wanted a share in the hunt.
Since those, who did not get part of the hunt, did not eat, and eventually died . . . our brain was overtime wired to want part of the hunt, so that we would survive. Do we want democracy because we are good, or because of our biological survival techniques.
Etruscia wrote:ve got a couple points.
Think about this, Derevon said all good comes from god. In that case, if we cannot create good, it is certain that we can neither create evil. In that case humans are nothing but shells, with strings being pulled.
That is for certain not what i think though.
Ultimately everything comes down to making choices using our free will. From our own limited perspectives it may seem as if we "create" evil or good, but I suspect it's only an appearance. All we do is to choose, everything else is cause and effect.
Quote:Most people would consider democracy good, and that is why we should have it, because it is good. And if all goodness comes from god, democracy surely came from god, right derevon?
Democracy is neither good nor evil, only sentient beings of free will are.
Quote:Instead, consider this, up until 11, 000 years ago we were hunter-gatherers. For a million years we were hunter gatherers. When hunting, everybody wanted a share in the hunt.
Since those, who did not get part of the hunt, did not eat, and eventually died . . . our brain was overtime wired to want part of the hunt, so that we would survive. Do we want democracy because we are good, or because of our biological survival techniques.
Personally I think people's desire for democracy has very little to do with genetics, but is rather a result of primarily social environment. If people grew up in a village where a benevolent and wise despot ruled single-handedly, and to the satisfaction of the people, I'm pretty sure most wouldn't have had any problem with that.
After reading the book Ishmael by Daniel Quinn, i have changed my stance somewhat. I suggest you read it, it is a quick 250 page read is extremely useful. I cannot explain it too easily on a forum as it would create an excessive post. Read it and then reconsider your thought, i know i have.
Derevon wrote:How God does this is of course beyond human comprehension, but 'how' doesn't really matter, the important thing is that it does indeed come from God, which countless of people can testify to you that it does. This certitude which so many people have felt is one of God's mysteries in itself.
One thing is for sure, though. No true happiness or joy can come from oneself. We weren't made to live for ourselves, but for God and for our neighbour.
Live good, be an inspiration to others, and give all thanks to God, not to yourself. Nothing that is good comes from man
Derevon wrote:No person can do anything whatsoever without God
what a loada shite you cant honestly believe that I do everything for god
and cant do anything without him
i mean believing in him is one thing but trying to say that people do everything for him is another
and just outta interest if i was doing everything for god without me thinking about it surely that contradicts the idea of free will not to mention making any god that is making me do things for him a selfish bastard who wants us to run around after him
now tell me why i would want to do things for him if it was as such ???
What I'm saying is that we cannot do anything whatsoever unless God permits it. That does not mean that we do not have free will, though. Since God is a respecter of free will, he permits evil acts to be committed (they may even play a part in divine providence), but that doesn't mean these acts are desirable in any way.
As for the concept of God being selfish, it's just absurd. One simply cannot compare God to an ordinary being like you or me. Put every sentient being in the entire universe together, and they would still be nothing compared to God, because God is infinite, and there is no ratio between the finite and the infinite. To say that God is selfish would be like saying that the wholeness of ultimate reality in itself is selfish. Such a statement is simply devoid of all meaning, as there is nothing outside of it to be selfish in relation to.
God created us to live for Him, not for ourselves. In ourselves we have no purpose, because we are parts of a whole. We are limbs in a body, and fulfil important functions for the body no doubt, but just as a hand is useless without a body, so are we useless without God. By doing God's will we fulfil the purpose for which we were made and contribute to the greater good of the entire body. And contrariwise, if we commit sins and live for ourselves instead of living for God and the neighbour, we hurt the entire body, and inevitably also ourselves.
If you're going to define God Realistically, you must believe that God consists of everything that we do do. If you're going to define God Idealistically, you must believe that we ought to do everything we do according to the defined Ideal. It is not correct to say that God exists a priori and then say that everything we do is according to God's will. In order to make such a claim, you must define God as a synthesis of the Real and the Ideal. You must believe that God exists as the Real living incarnation of the Ideal in us as we enact it. If God exists a priori, then our actions relate to Him only if He exists a priori in relation to us. This logic seems sound. Am I wrong?
Just some thoughts-
Isnt it selfish to be happy,if God is love and love usually implies happiness?
God made Jesus,representing himself in human form,to be a simple carpenter.How is a carpenter better than everything?
If we do everything for God, what is his goal?If we are to serve him isnt he being selfish, why do we serve him and to what end?
If God is better than all of us and expects to not comprehend him, isnt that a bit pointless and unfair?
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