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Are humans a rational species?

 
 
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 07:08 pm
Hi all.
I came to know that humans are fully rational, and consistently act with an objective to accomplish.

We are fully in control over our behavior,
We always do what we want and we don't need to do anything.

I'm inviting you to voice your thoughts on this.

Thank you.
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Type: Question • Score: 2 • Views: 2,071 • Replies: 66

 
roger
 
  2  
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 07:15 pm
sure. That's why the call Man the rationalizing animal.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 07:21 pm
@think rethink,
No, rationality is an illusion. Humans are not in control over their behavior, just look at how they behave.

Humans do things they know are mistakes. Humans run after things that they know won't make them happy. They cling to beliefs that aren't logical. They make purchasing decisions on everything from cars to beer on images of women in bikinis. They deny their own mortality. They waste way to much time on the internet when they could do far more productive things.

If you think humans are rational, you haven't met many humans.
TomTomBinks
 
  1  
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 09:09 pm
@think rethink,
Humans have the potential for rationality. We achieve it sometimes. Not nearly often enough!
0 Replies
 
Joe Sixpack
 
  2  
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 11:17 pm
@think rethink,
Don't know any bureaucrats, right?
rosborne979
 
  2  
Reply Mon 24 Jul, 2017 04:57 am
@think rethink,
I think the inmates running the asylum are unaware of the asylum.
Leadfoot
 
  2  
Reply Mon 24 Jul, 2017 05:53 am
Yeah, but they are in denial.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  2  
Reply Mon 24 Jul, 2017 11:51 am
I have had rashes in my time, but none recently.
0 Replies
 
think rethink
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Jul, 2017 08:46 pm
@maxdancona,
Thank you Max.

Mac wrote,
No, rationality is an illusion. Humans are not in control over their behavior, just look at how they behave

In my opinion, humans are not in control over who they are (meaning, their identities), but the behavior of the given identity that's dominant at that moment, is fully consistent with its agenda.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Jul, 2017 08:48 pm
@think rethink,
Is anyone else here watching Westworld? It is a relevant (if not depressing) view of human existence.
think rethink
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Jul, 2017 08:53 pm
@rosborne979,
You are correct,
however in this case, the inmates running the asylum are non existent, and are simply the true effect of a false belief,
The naive believer, seeking the above effect with such sincere intent, projects a visual duplicate of himself, which in effect poses as the inmate staring into the mirror.
0 Replies
 
think rethink
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Jul, 2017 08:58 pm
@maxdancona,
Hi Max,
My brother has been urging me to watch it but I haven't had the chance.
Thank you for the motivation.

When you describe it as depressing, it might be an indication of a blessing.
Because to truly evolve ones knowledge quality, disappointment and confusion are often an inevitable precondition to enable the transition.
think rethink
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Jul, 2017 09:09 pm
@Joe Sixpack,
Thank you Joe.

Rationality is an internal state, no one needs to have their cognitive patterns and rules of logic approved by an external person to make it rational.

Rationality is a reference to consistency between intention and execution.

Self sabotage is an example of irationality.

My view is that self sabotage within humans does not exist,
but rather, the original intent of the specific self that's responsible for the behavior, is destruction and dysfunction.

To this particular ego,
drama, suffering, and trauma, is an important accomplishment
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Jul, 2017 09:37 pm
@think rethink,
I am in the middle of WestWorld. Hopefully I will not give too many spoilers (look away if you don't want to know anything).

They programmed human-like Androids that are programmed to meet the needs of humans (and whose memories are supposed to be wiped everytime they are abused... which turns out to be quite often). However, they are now blurring the line between the human mind and programming of the Androids. It is becoming difficult to tell which is which.

This type of fatalism seems a little sad to me, I think that is the intent of the show runners. (I am still enjoying the show).
think rethink
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Jul, 2017 05:10 am
@maxdancona,
Thank you Max.

If I understand the show correctly it isn't just a show, but the agonizing reality of the Western civilized programming (mind) at this point in its evolution.

The Android is the mind itself which was initially developed to serve a naked and non identified energy field (the so called individual existing experience that humanity is), but the disguise of the mind as the actual human which is a required condition in achieving mind functionality, has become so realistic and has been taken so literal and serious,

That in result, these Androids develop needs and an agenda that serves no actual being but the Android itself.

When existence is created, survival becomes necessary.

When we donate our energy to bring ideas into existence, they also become obsessed with survival (these ideas demand our constant attention and consideration to extend their lifespan).

The cultivation in this culture of the impression that not only is the survival of the Droid preceding human existence, but it's also a higher priority than human survival, explains dysfunctional behavior as Functional.
Not to the human, but to the Droid that's in command at that moment.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Jul, 2017 05:40 am
@think rethink,
I don't see it as a critique on Western Civilization (although it is set in the world of Western Civilization, and we don't come out looking too good).

I think it is more a discussion on what it means to be human. They are setting up two competing ideas from the designers of the robots... I see it as a discussion on the value of human existence (and by default the value of android existence).


think rethink
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Jul, 2017 07:54 am
@maxdancona,
Thank you Max.
I've already begun watching it, hopefully I'll have a better understanding soon.

I refer to Western Civilization because that's what I know.

And I find it to be over emphasizing survival over existence to the degree that survival becomes an entertainment that is more fascinating and interesting than our essence (existence).
0 Replies
 
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Jul, 2017 08:46 am
@think rethink,
Not most of the time.
Susmariosep
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 29 Jul, 2017 03:10 pm
@Fil Albuquerque,
Dear readers here, this morning - it is in my place as I write this post at this point in time, Sunday, July 30, 2017, 04:42 AM, eight hours in advance of Greenwich.

Now, at this stage of my sojourn in a2k, it is my routine to look up the page of Forums >> Popular, to pick up a post to contribute my thought on the topic of the thread, by reacting to the last post there.

And the post I have chosen this morning to contribute my thinking on the thread housing the post, it is the following from Fil Alb:
Quote:
3 Are humans a rational species?
Forums:
Question by think rethink
Posted 07/23/17 7:08 PM
Replies: 17
Views: 225
Last Post by Fil Albuquerque
on 07/26/17 8:46 AM NEW

See next post for my thought on the post the last one to date from Fil Albuquerque, in the thread: Are humans a rational species?

But you know what, I have exchanged thoughts with Fil Alb, and I can't recall now what kind of a poster Fil is, atheist or not atheist.

If he is atheist, then I know that he is as with all internet atheists, into nothing but inanity, vacuity, stupidity, insanity, i.e. into unremitting evasiveness, in their cult of what I call Acquired Intelligence Deficiency Syndrome.

You can't have any connected dialogue with them at all.
edgarblythe
 
  3  
Reply Sat 29 Jul, 2017 03:42 pm
@Susmariosep,
Yeah. People have to agree with you before they are worth it to "dialog" with.
0 Replies
 
 

 
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