mY fIrSt ToPiC

Forums: Spirituality And Religion
Email this Topic • Print this Page

Hey everyone..
I saw what u guys r talking aboutso I thought maby I can share some of what I know about islam I read a lot of books about islam..
And I have to say im kinda amazed of what I read

Why do so many people commit suicide? Because they never had the
answer to the above question. Some people know. Some. And its man's
best kept secret.

I know what your thinking. "Oh god he's gonna preach us on religion."
Not exactly Wink

It's a WAY OF LIFE, and what if I told u its called Islam? I'm
Christian. But Christianty is a RELIGION not a WAY OF LIFE. 80% of
Americans are "Christians", but sad to say, look at them.
Homosexuality, suicide, drugs, adultery, even among their own
preachers is common. I should know.

The old pastor at my church got kicked out for molesting a child. I'm
not attacking anyone. I'm saying the facts. Besides that, it doesn't
make sense. Neither do the other million "religions" found on this
earth. They all claim to be simple religions, usually claiming belief
in one god.

But they are lacking in on truth, the facts.

So anyway we die. We leave behind everything. EVERYTHING. You think
that the Porsche u spent your whole life trying to get is going with
u? The only things that're going with u are your burial clothes and
coffin, if that even. And there is one other thing, but it's unseen.
Your deeds. ALLLL the things u did in this life, good and bad, go
with you. And so we're in the grave. What happens to you in the grave
is another story but basically your body rots. I mean your "this
life" body. The body that we had for (if we are lucky) 80 years is
gone and with it our doings!

Allah Himself has guaranteed that He would guard the Qur'an from corruption (see Qur'an 15:9). Hence, the real and pure words of Allah are found in the Qur'an, which was revealed in Arabic, the language of Mohammed's people. Since then, not an iota has changed. This is unlike what has happened in the other religions. For example, if you look at the Bible, you find a lot of versions; the name Bible itself is indicative of those changes because Bible means a collection of books from different writers.

God calls the Scripture revealed to Jesus "Injeel" in the Qur'an for which the closest name in the Bible would be the word Gospel. The Bible was written many years after the time of Jesus in a language that was alien to Jesus; it was Latin Vulgate, a language that he never spoke. Isn't this strange? Interestingly, most of what was written in the New Testament was authored by Paul, who, according to James, the brother of Jesus in the Bible, had a polluted mind because he changed and contradicted most of the teachings of Jesus.

Well, I, very deep in my heart, believe that God can never look like his creation nor does he do what they do. What I believe is that God is the perfect one who is very much different from everything we see or touch. In other words, I think the writer can never look like his book.

The Christians of today(( like me )) are following what Paul taught and also tend to follow what the priests tell them to do instead of following what Jesus said.

I'll explain the concept of salvation through the crucifixion of Jesus:
In Christianity, the Doctrine of Original Sin is the reason that there is a need for salvation through Jesus' crucifixion. However, this doctrine was invented by Paul and it is strongly negated in the Old Testament (see Ezekial 18:20, Jeremiah 31:30, Deut. 24:16). This doctrine is an attempt to escape the responsibility of righteousness with the belief that punishment is given to someone else to release us from our burden of sins (see Ephesians 1:7, Romans 4:25, 10:9, Corinthians 15:21) In the Qur'an, every soul is responsible for its own deeds, good or bad (see 74:38,41:46, 3:25, 6:154).

The crucifixion itself:
The Bible says Jesus cried out in a loud voice beseeching God for help on the cross: "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (Matt. 27:46) Does that sound like Jesus to you?

You say: Then what about Jesus' appearance

Jesus didn't die on the cross nor was he resurrected. If he were resurrected, then he would have come to his disciples in a spiritual body. As shown in Luke 24:36-43, he met them with his physical body after the event of his alleged crucifixion. In the Qur'an, it says that Jesus was not crucified, but it was someone else who was made to look like him (see 4:157,158). ce to his disciples after the crucifixion?

Then how did the story of the crucifixion of Jesus get into the Bible then?

Once again, Paul was responsible (see Timothy 2:8 and Romans 5:10).

However, Paul took pagan beliefs and practices from the Romans and mixed them with the teachings of Jesus. Consequently, Paul was mostly responsible for elevating Jesus to the status of Son of God and God (see Acts 9:20).

The first Commandment is, " Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God is One Lord."

That's in Mark 12:29. Moreover, the Qur'an confirms that God is One: "Say He is Allah, the One and Only (God)." (Qur'an 112:1)

The right picture of lslam is conveyed in the Qur'an, which is exemplified by Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him. The reality is that it is not fair to judge a religion by the actions of its followers alone because there are good and bad followers in every religion. The correct thing to do is to judge a religion by its documented revelation from God and the prophet who brought that revelation .. well that's what I think.

I have some facts wich really amazed me.:

1- In the Quran , ALLAH had said that jews will never have peace with muslims till judjment day , jews can prove that the Quran is wrong just by simply stop the war and treat muslims like any other group of people..but till now for like 100 years and more they just didt.does this prove anything..?? This story is mostly like the story of ABU LAHAB when god had said he would die as a kafir ( he wont enter islam), ABU LAHAB had 10 years to prove that the QURAN is not the words of ALLAH but he just didn't.
2- In the QURAN ,ALLAH had said that one of the signs that show the coming of the judgment day is : THE RISING OF THE SUN FROM THE WEST. Scientits these days had said that the sun is slightly moving from its position and it would some day ( wich is not very soon ) would rise from the west.

Im only 14 years oldand what I wrote I what I know.i hope to learn and read and explore more about this world
Not through mediabut through the real thing.please add a comment to what I wrote..and I want to say that I don't
Want to hurt any oneim just saying what I think
If any one has any question they can ask me..that'll help me know more.

This is the first thing i add in here... iknow its not that good Embarrassed

.. but im still looking up to learn more.
[size=7][/size] Exclamation

Topic Stats
Top Replies
Link to this Topic

Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 3,292 • Replies: 40

No top replies

I would say that all religions stem from the same basic principles. I would also say that all the prophets that have apparently been sent to earth had the same ideas, many of which were misunderstood by many followers. I would suggest reading far more religious texts than you have already, including the mystic texts from Christianity, Judaism and Islam. I'll help you out if you are interested.

0 Replies

Thanx for reading..

0 Replies

Hey memyselfandi, wow u are only 14? What made u do so much research on Islam as well as other religions? What interested u especially about Islam?

0 Replies

hey Qkid,
thanx for reading.....
its just that i like to know what is going on.....
i like to know what i believe in.....
is it right or wrong....??
its not just islam ...its everything,
i think all humans should do such a thing.....
i mean i go to school...come back.....do my H.W...have fun....go to sleep Confused

thats so boring....fun is fun...but knowing whats going around is much more important...
i dont think that i know much yet.....im still looking up to learn more...
thanx

0 Replies

o0memyselfandi0o

I must say I'm amazed with the brain you hold.For 14 years old, I'm totally amazed.

Allow me to keep what you have written for my personal use, translate it to Arabic and use it else where.

I liked the "things" you said it amazed you but of course there are much more.

Quote:

In the QURAN ,ALLAH had said that one of the signs that show the coming of the judgment day is : THE RISING OF THE SUN FROM THE WEST. Scientits these days had said that the sun is slightly moving from its position and it would some day ( wich is not very soon ) would rise from the west……….

For your information after that day, all the people would convert to Islam in the earth, but It would not accept from them because it is considered the deadline, it is not just a sign.

Please if you need any information, do not hesitate to contact me.

0 Replies

I am afraid you have too quickly dismissed Christianity on the basis of some very prevalent and misinformed postulations regarding the validitiy of Paul and his relation to the "four gospels", the salvation story, the writing of the Bible (it was written in Greek, not Latin, one of the most common languages of Jesus' time and location), and all kinds of other issues. However, most of these issues I believe (if you set your mind to it, as it seems you desire) you will discover on your own. I highly recommend reading literature written in defense of Christianity for your information on Christianity, just as i would recommend reading lit. written in defense of any topic for information on that topic.

Now, to direct a question to you to ponder. Islam basically teaches that God waves his hand and declares forgiveness upon some and not on others, it is very deterministic meaning that all people are eternally destined for either paradise or hell. However, you state that Islam holds everyone responsible for his or her actions, which is a true statement within Islam thought as well. There is clearly a huge paradox in these two statements. How can a person be held responsible for his or her actions while being eternally determined to be saved or condemned at the same time? You also run into the problem of a God who creates people who are destined for hell, not a very compassionate and loving God (qualities bestowed upon Allah before every sura). These issues plague Christianity as well, but if studied carefully, are answered in Jesus' life, death, and resurrection which I would gladly explain if given the opportunity.

0 Replies

"The Bible says Jesus cried out in a loud voice beseeching God for help on the cross: "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (Matt. 27:46) Does that sound like Jesus to you?"

In case you don't know, Jesus quoted Psalm 22 when he cried that. By taking upon himself the entire multitude of the world's sin upon him, he took the forsakeness we all deserve for our action. Interestingly enough, if one is to believe that God is the giver and sustainer of life, then forsakeness from God must necessarily result in death. Thus, Jesus died completely and utterly forsaken by his Heavenly Father whom he did nothing but serve selflessly and perfectly. Taken upon himself willingly "Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done." Luke 22:42, Jesus serves as the perfect sacrifice, taking upon himself the punishment we as sinners and rebels against God's will, revealing God's capacity to satisfiy the demands of justice and at the same time his love for his creation. Jesus' resurrection (which has been the cause of the most speculation in the history of history, and yet still has MUCH more support for its historicity than for its falseness) thus proves that Jesus, being God, was not defeated by death and thus death itself is defeated and Jesus is the firstborn of God's new creation, in which we can participate if we accept the fact that we cannot earn our salvation and can only recieve God's grace through Jesus. THAT, in a very short synopsis, is the salvation story.

Islam's answer for the problem of sin? God decides who he is going to save and who he isn't without any retribution for sins committed against him by those he decides to save and hell and damnation for those he does not save.

0 Replies

Cavfancier: There are clear distinctions between faiths. They do not all stem from the same thing as many in today's post-modern world would like to believe. Just as an example, the disparate difference between Islam and Christianity's definition of and answer to Sin that I just posted about. To say they are all the same is a cop-out and does not attempt to study them and instead use the generalization "all the religions are the same, they all get at the same point" Let's be honest with ourselves and recognize the real differences between faiths and then decide which proclaims truth.

0 Replies

Glad_to_be_muslim wrote:

Quote:

In the QURAN ,ALLAH had said that one of the signs that show the coming of the judgment day is : THE RISING OF THE SUN FROM THE WEST. Scientits these days had said that the sun is slightly moving from its position and it would some day ( wich is not very soon ) would rise from the west.

I am really quite curious about this since I try to keep up with such things. Can you provide any info on where this comes from? Unless my scientific knowledge is way off, the only way for the sun to "rise" from the west would be for the earth to reverse its rotation. For that to happen, the earth's rotation would have to at some point stop completely in order to begin again in the other direction. The result of that stoppage would create all kinds of survivability questions.

So please back up this quote that supposed scientists say the sun will some day rise in the west. I really want to know if some quack is out there saying this.

0 Replies

hi all....
sorr if i didnt replay fast......kinda bussy Laughing

any wayz...i appreciat all of u passin by Rolling Eyes

dear neccessarygrae ,

Quote:

Islam basically teaches that God waves his hand and declares forgiveness upon some and not on others,

Well sure god does ....there has to be justice....god..well ANY god should not forgive all humans....god will forgive to those who ask for forgivness.
God's hands r always open for those who ask for forgiveness Smile

Quote:

it is very deterministic meaning that all people are eternally destined for either paradise or hell. However, you state that Islam holds everyone responsible for his or her actions,

Quote:

How can a person be held responsible for his or her actions while being eternally determined to be saved or condemned at the same time? You also run into the problem of a God who creates people who are destined for hell, not a very compassionate and loving God

Ok..u look kinda messed up here......
what i think..
If god gave us a special different mind then other creatures.....do think its there cuz its just there .??
well i dont....we have the choice .... destiney doesnt control what we do..we know what right and whats wrong....we choose our own path..
EXAMPLE : if a student says....i wont study.. Cool

.. let destiny take its path !
do u think that kid will pass the tests......well no...but he had the choice.

what i think ...its just that god knows how ppl think ( he created them any way )
he knows that some'll think good...some'll think bad
he's justice....he know who diserve to go to hell and who diserve heaven .

ill do more research......ill bring more !!

THINK ABOUT DEATH CUZ LIFE IS ONLY ( if we're lucky) 80 YEARS !
wich is nearly 80,000 dayz ( very short time....for me it is)

its a very short time to think... to make a desicion.

ill be BACK !

0 Replies

If u need more info then visit this site
http://www.arrahman-arraheem.com, or
http://alhudapk.com

0 Replies

neccessarygrace wrote:

Cavfancier: There are clear distinctions between faiths. They do not all stem from the same thing as many in today's post-modern world would like to believe. Just as an example, the disparate difference between Islam and Christianity's definition of and answer to Sin that I just posted about. To say they are all the same is a cop-out and does not attempt to study them and instead use the generalization "all the religions are the same, they all get at the same point" Let's be honest with ourselves and recognize the real differences between faiths and then decide which proclaims truth.

I never said that all religions stem from the same 'thing'. I specifically said 'principles'. How those principles have been interpreted and used is entirely another issue. Also, how do you know that my conclusion is not based on a rather intense study over the years of most of the world's religions, including their mystic texts?

0 Replies

memyself: You say you believe in free choice yet you want to say you subscribe to Islam. Islam is dogmatically deterministic, nothing happens (including your choices) unless God wills it to be so. Islam also tries to promote that humans are free to choose God's will or not choose it, but these two thoughts together are paradoxical. You can't have free choice while believing that God controls every happening and action (again, including your choices). A orthodox muslim will commonly look at something such as a murder or crime and declare that it was the will of God that that person do such an act, in effect, that God willed (caused) that choice to be made. Is that free will? Is that choice?

0 Replies

cav: you're correct, I have no way of knowing what kind of research you have done. And sorry I misquoted you on 'principles'. The fact is though, religions don't stem from the same principles. Christianity's principles revolve around Sin and Grace and the incarnation of God in Jesus. Judaism is based on principles of Law (the Torah). Islam bases its faith on the belief in the manifestation of God in the Qur'an. Now, these three principles are clearly not the same. This doesn't even address the Buddhist quest for Enlightenment or the Hindu advancement along a class structure. A common argument is that all religions embrace such ideals as "love" "truth" "justice", which again is not fact. And even if Judaism embraces "love", it is not defined the same as Christian "love" or Islamic "love". So my question to you is What exactly are these principles that all religions stem from? I'm interested...

0 Replies

neccessarygrace, while it might be just a semantic point, what I see in your definitions of the major religions here is an illustration (and a good one) of how different tools and methods are used by various religions to achieve the same goal. I see your problem with the "common argument", but, again, I believe that the goals of the prophets were the same, in terms of personal enlightenment, and learning to love all people. That was the original principle. Let's take Judiasm as an example of where later revision, based on politics, took over. The oldest living text discovered from the Old Testament has been translated and published in a book called 'The Book of J', edited by Harold Bloom. In this text, Yaweh is portrayed and defined as a dual god, posessing, in perfect harmony, both the male and female principles. This was a god of love, VERY similar to the Christ. The nature of the Hebrew god to an avenging patriarchal figure was a rewrite by future rabbis. All mentions of the female side of the Jewish god were eradicated, except for remnants preserved by the Kabbalists, who were persecuted for their beliefs, and now, strangely enough, are quite popular in Hollywood. Laughing

Anyway, I'll try to get more in depth later, but I have to scurry and get some work done.

0 Replies

You make a good point in your example of Yahweh, but what you seem to miss in describing God as a god of love is the "male" side of this dualistic God. This would seem to be (and i haven't read the same texts as you, so correct me if i'm wrong) the side that pursues and desires Justice (a continual theme throughout the prophets, especially Amos, Hosea, and Isaiah). If this is correct, then Jesus clearly continues on the tradition of a god of love AND justice and embodies this "original" Yahweh, for he teaches of a God who loves his children as well as desires justice done upon those that disobey God. Now, if this female side of God was eradicated, as you say, then Jesus is a bit of an enigma if he's not the embodiment of the true living God, correct? For unless he had access to writings of this "eradicated female side of God" then he must have had some other access, for he taught it and lived it. He was clearly persecuted for what he taught! Jesus was a Jew, and in many ways continued the tradition of a God of both love AND justice in his teaching. So there seems to be two options here. Either this dualistic God that you speak of was not "eradicated", but instead ignored, disobeyed, and rebelled against (as the prophets speak of) and Jesus brings back this true, original God again (from his knowledge of the scriptures). Or this dualistic God of love and justice was "eradicated", or inked out by the patriarchs in an act of politics. In this case, are you saying that Jesus was a Kabbalist? In either case, Jesus stands out as a possible point of contention for those who claim that a God of love and justice, a male and female God, was inked out by the Jewish patriarchs, for obviously at the time of Jesus, this kind of God was taught about and preached on by Jesus. This is an EXTREMELY interesting topic, perhaps that should be discussed on a different board, but one I would enjoy quite a bit. Thanks for the thoughts and I would love if we could continue this discussion.

0 Replies

cavfancier wrote:

Let's take Judiasm as an example of where later revision, based on politics, took over. The oldest living text discovered from the Old Testament has been translated and published in a book called 'The Book of J', edited by Harold Bloom. In this text, Yaweh is portrayed and defined as a dual god, posessing, in perfect harmony, both the male and female principles. This was a god of love, VERY similar to the Christ. The nature of the Hebrew god to an avenging patriarchal figure was a rewrite by future rabbis. All mentions of the female side of the Jewish god were eradicated, except for remnants preserved by the Kabbalists, who were persecuted for their beliefs

J is not an actual text. It is one piece of a breakup of the torah that scholars use based on similar ideas and styles. There is no such document. The torah is like a quilt that represents many different groups. It's almost like an attempt for unification. Deuteronomy has actually been attributed to a text spoken of in II Chronicles 34:14. To say that it was the rabbis altering texts presumes too much. The Talmud speaks of love as well as justice and does its darndest to get around sentencing people to death or supporting violence. It says a sanhedrin that sentences 1 man to death in 70 years is a bloody court. Most of the rabbis were against Bar Kokhba. Akiba was one of the few that supported him. I'm not saying the rabbis were all good, but your theory seems rather thin unless you can give some more evidence. You're just simplifying the politics and sectarianism of the time.

It is clear that there were indeed many groups. Sadducees, pharisees, essenes, zealots, and the boundaries weren't even always religous. The Cairo Geniza has evidence to that effect. The Damascus Document is a secterian document. And I'm sure you are familiar with the findings at Qumran.

Dauer

0 Replies

neccessarygrace wrote:

You make a good point in your example of Yahweh, but what you seem to miss in describing God as a god of love is the "male" side of this dualistic God. This would seem to be (and i haven't read the same texts as you, so correct me if i'm wrong) the side that pursues and desires Justice (a continual theme throughout the prophets, especially Amos, Hosea, and Isaiah). If this is correct, then Jesus clearly continues on the tradition of a god of love AND justice and embodies this "original" Yahweh, for he teaches of a God who loves his children as well as desires justice done upon those that disobey God. Now, if this female side of God was eradicated, as you say, then Jesus is a bit of an enigma if he's not the embodiment of the true living God, correct? For unless he had access to writings of this "eradicated female side of God" then he must have had some other access, for he taught it and lived it. He was clearly persecuted for what he taught! Jesus was a Jew, and in many ways continued the tradition of a God of both love AND justice in his teaching. So there seems to be two options here. Either this dualistic God that you speak of was not "eradicated", but instead ignored, disobeyed, and rebelled against (as the prophets speak of) and Jesus brings back this true, original God again (from his knowledge of the scriptures). Or this dualistic God of love and justice was "eradicated", or inked out by the patriarchs in an act of politics. In this case, are you saying that Jesus was a Kabbalist? In either case, Jesus stands out as a possible point of contention for those who claim that a God of love and justice, a male and female God, was inked out by the Jewish patriarchs, for obviously at the time of Jesus, this kind of God was taught about and preached on by Jesus. This is an EXTREMELY interesting topic, perhaps that should be discussed on a different board, but one I would enjoy quite a bit. Thanks for the thoughts and I would love if we could continue this discussion.

Sadly, I cannot answer our author's most recent post, but I will address this one, as it is very interesting to me as well. First, for now, we have to separate Jesus as portrayed in the NT from the OT Yaweh figure. Yes, the original concept of the dual Hebrew god would indeed incorporate the masculine philosophy of justice and retribution, tempered by the feminine influence of love and compassion. The base model for Kabbalistic philosophy is the Tree of Life, one side female, one side masculine. From beginning to end, the spots on the tree are defined as: 0. Nothing 1. Crown or summit (god) 2. Wisdom 3. Understanding 4. Mercy 5. Severity 6. Beauty, harmony 7. Victory 8. Splendour 9. Foundation 10. Kingdom 11. Experience. As for whether or not Jesus was a Kabbalist, who knows. We do know however that he was born Jewish, and was privy to these teachings. Perhaps his split with the rabbis was based on how they were twisting the original teachings of Judaism into a patriarchal political bunch of nonsense. It is entirely possible that this was the part of Judaism he wanted to preserve. As for Islam, it also descended from Judaism, starting with the story of Abraham and Hagar. These of course are just the Abrhamic religions, all tied togther to a common mythology and purpose, all sadly used for the wrong reasons through the ages.

0 Replies

mY fIrSt ToPiC

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know