Fri 2 Oct, 2015 05:36 am
I struggle with depression and I have this philosophical question that I need an answer for. Actually, it might even be a scientific question.
Now I need to know the answer to this very vital question. I am thinking that there is only one way love, joy, happiness, and inspiration can be experienced. That being, through our reward system (our good moods). The more our reward system is functional and healthy, the more of those things we will have in our lives since our good moods would be greater. But like I said before, there is the difference between words and phrases and our mental states.
So by depressed people focusing on words and phrases alone of love, joy, happiness, and inspiration, they are only fooling themselves into thinking they are in love, joyful, happy, and inspired while depressed when they never were since depression as well as anhedonia are what turn off our reward system (our good moods). Even if they focused on the mental state of their thinking while depressed and told themselves that this is a form of love, joy, happiness, and inspiration, then they would be fooling themselves here as well since they are not in the actual mental state of having those things.
So they would be fooling themselves through this whole world of personally creating our own meanings in life and personally defining them for ourselves which would have to be false since there is only one way to experience those said things I've mentioned. There is only one way to experience the mental state of visualizing objects (sight) and perceiving sound (hearing). If you were to become blind and deaf, then your thoughts alone cannot give you that mental state.
If a blind and deaf person thought to his/herself that he/she still has sight and hearing, then that would not give him/her sight and hearing. That would only give him/her nothing more than the labels (words and phrases) of sight and hearing.
So there is only one function that gives us our mental states of visualizing objects and perceiving sound just as how there is also only one way to experience touch, smell, taste, etc. So in that same sense, there is also only one way to have good meaning, love, joy, happiness, and inspiration. There is only one function of our brains that can give us that. There is only one mental state that can give us those things. That being, the mental state of our good moods as I've said before.
If you are going to say something to me such as that we can have good meaning, love, joy, happiness, and inspiration through our way of thinking alone even while depressed and not in a good mood, then you have to prove to me how this is the actual mental state of having those things and not just the words and phrases of those things.
I am thinking that there is only one way love, joy, happiness...
Yes and no. Sometimes our chemistry doesn't give us that opportunity. Sadly neglected is the effect of food, meds, and other chems upon mood
Thanks for tht'n, Moz. It's not everyday...
In case I ever have to live my life depressed, then it is vital I find the answer. I am thinking that having good meaning in one's life is not just simply from knowing things. It is being in the mental state of love, joy, happiness, and inspiration in doing those things. For example, if you were not in any mental state of love, joy, happiness, or inspiration at all and were in a completely blank hopeless state and you just knew to yourself deep down that you have to go and save your family's life since they have good meaning to you, then they would not have any good meaning to you at all. You are telling yourself nothing more than just words and phrases of good meaning. The only way you can actually perceive them as having good meaning to you would be if you were in an inspired, happy, loving, and joyful mental state in saving their lives.
So, in short, since you were not in a good mood while saving their lives, then your family would actually have no good meaning to you in that given moment when you were depressed and in a blank mental state. For you to live your life just through knowing things while depressed and just thinking that has good meaning to you, that is living your life as an utterly inferior dead lifeless biological machine. It is our good moods that make us and our lives something. It is only our good moods that can give good meaning to our lives from our friends, family, and our goals/dreams.
Thanks again Moz. However let's suppose you're a victim of a kind of allergy or sensitivity that prevents you ever from feeling okay
For 10-12 years I suffered a kind of doldrums or adversity, noting however once in a while feeling really upbeat and cheerful. Later it became apparent that these occurrences were on days when I had forgotten to take my BP and chol meds
Things cleared up somewhat when my Better Half put me onto B12 and
Point: Many of us can't even start to feel good
Here is a response from someone and my reply to it that gets the very idea of my topic across in a brief way:
Response: I find it funny that some people prioritize abstractions ( words,concepts such as physicalism) above the empirical (qualia). Qualia being our subjective mental experiences. In other words they hide from immediate reality (feelings/qualia) behind words. Symbols replaced reality! The word "food" does not provide nourishment and nor does the word "water" quench one's thirst. So what Matt is saying here is that words and phrases of good meaning, bad meaning, love, joy, happiness, inspiration, suffering, despair, anguish, sadness, rage, grief, etc. do not give us anything either.
In that sense qualia is related to Matt's theory.
My Reply: Yes, this is correct. I am thinking that even good and bad are qualia as well. They would be our good and bad moods. If we are depressed, then just the words and phrases of good meaning won't give us anything. I think science has yet to discover that good and bad are qualia. Currently, we think they are not. But I am thinking otherwise.
Everybody can boil water, but for water to boil you need water, for this reason one can not produce these things oneself as u meantion of; but it is possible for one to do so oneself OF ones own merits and spiritual practice, but with limitation; it is a one sided thing until then the garden of eden; until one finds an alternate input from some other person to mulitply and fertile it even greater of the sense that you speak of love, happyness and so on.
So there is a local sense of it and a global sense of it; both are valid and work, one just have to have water to boil
Thanks Moz but I was suggesting some doldrums aren't "psychological"
Jeeesus chemistry solves it...I think I told you this already way back. Do it !
No not you. Mozart I think...or someone with a similar talk can't quite decide. Anyway I have the impression I went through this subject with some ppl with chronic depression and they keep grasping at straws wanting to talk their way out of the problem. They lack dopamine and serotonin period. Take some pills and stop bitching. Life is life. Nor better nor worse then it ever was...
Take some pills and stop bitching
Wha, Fil, who, me
....Jus kiddin, a course
But Fil I don't understand Moz, he's gotta be a lot smarter than me, like lotsa ya