How Did You Learn The Bible?

Right. you were asking about dogma.

Before I'd submit to dogma - I'd much prefer to set my own standards. I'd rather continue doing as I please.
A lot of folks are like that. I suspect most people.
Some give in. Some don't Some will search for and submit to God's sovereignty, others rebel.
But it's the same choice given Adam. That's pretty much what the knowledge of good and bad is all about.

Hope that helps.

I showed you that you can fall from grace by holding on to the old testament. But your the first person I ever met that would prefer weak promises over better promises.

Heb 8:6-7
6 But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, inasmuch as He is also Mediator of a better covenant, which was established on better promises.
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second.
(NKJ)

What makes you believe I do not revere the New Covenant? Without it, humans would continue in the hopeless condition we were in before his sacrifice. Indeed, we still are in anticipation because this covenant has yet to be fulfilled:It is no coincidence that Jehovah uttered these words after Abraham prepared to offer Isaac in sacrifice. This, no doubt, was to instruct us in the pain God must have endured when he allowed Jesus' sacrifice in reality.

Well its the way you defend the old testament. And the way you take the new covenant so lightly.

John 10:8-9
8 "All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them.
9 "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.
(NKJ)

I wasn't asking about dogma. I was making the point that you, JW's, fit your translation of the Bible to conform to your dogma.

You, neologist, chose to submit to it hook, line and sinker.

Adam didn't have that choice.

Most denominations do that. They take preconceived ideas and fit them into the bible. But all denominations only teach the milk understanding of the Word. And every Christian has to start somewhere. And they must go through the milk to get to the meat..

No need to be so dogmatic, Blue.
You should try explaining your well considered beliefs

Like what do you mean by this?

The way I took that was Adam didn't have any preconceived ideas of right and wrong. He did have no history to look back on. He didn't have no comparisons from the past. He didn't have no dogma.

Adam had a perfect conscience. No way could he steal or commit any crime. The knowledge of good and bad puts the burden of moral decisions on our personal discretion.

We have not done well under that arrangement.

By 'perfect conscience' it sounds like you are using the same defense for Adam used in insanity pleas - 'He was incapable of knowing right from wrong'. Even if that were the case, to advocate that as a more desirable arrangement than what we have now leaves me cold.

A conclusion not warranted by the text. God declared his work to be "good". Therefore, Adam had instinctive understanding of moral imperatives with no need to ruminate over moral choices or develop his own standards.

How am I being dogmatic?


Adam didn't have the choice of submitting to the Jehovah's Witnesses religion, or accepting the NWT, for that matter, or rejecting them.

Your application of John 10:8,9 does concern me Squeaky. I understand that your spirit gives you scriptures free of context, but does that not ring any alarm bells for you?

Your spirit is changing the meaning of Jesus words by using them in this context, is that not deceptive? perhaps that is unfair of me to suggest as I understand it is not your intention, but it does concern me nonetheless.

I can help with context for those that haven't the time to read, Jesus had been approached by the Pharisees after he had opened the eyes of a blind man, He spoke of those who are spiritually blind in relation to who the son of man was, the Pharisees, who for all intended purposes had not recognised Jesus as the Messiah, asked him if he referred to them also, which prompted him to tell them that he is the only doorway to salvation

The Jews had been awaiting a messiah or "the son of man" (John 9:35) Until Jesus arrived, several had laid claim to or were attributed the title therefore taking the place of "the shepherd"(Hebrews 13:20) and approaching the sheep with view to leading them after themselves. claiming they could lead them to "pasture". (Matthew 7:15, 24:24)

Jesus was making it clear that there is no other messiah, and no way other than through him. Anyone who claimed another way to salvation were thieves and robbers - trying to steal his sheep away.

He was in NO WAY referring to the prophets appointed by his father, or the early bible writers. Rather the prophets of old LED the nation of Israel to Jesus. The 300+ prophecies regarding Jesus allowed them to clearly identify him in order that they weren't led astray by pretenders therefore the sheep would not hear their voice. The Hebrew Scriptures are not promoting a different route to salvation, it is the foundation upon which Jesus new covenant was built and is part of the same path leading to the promised seed, the Greater David.

Some extra light reading for thought, If you want to see how the Bible characters of old were viewed in the new testament, try Pauls Letter to Hebrews throughout chapter 11, ask yourself, are these words written regarding thieves and robbers?

So true. He had only one choice: whether or not to submit to Jehovah's sovereigntyExcellent grasp of historical sequence!Them?

Squeaky is out trying to bag a buck.
I hope he fares well

aaah, we all need hobbies

It's so obvious that you had difficulty grasping it yourself, apparently.

Them, both the Jehovah's Witnesses and the NWT.

lolol To say the least.

Once one has purged their mind of carnality, so that no carnal logic can slip in, their open to any context the Holy Spirit or Jesus wished to use the verses. Again it is the hidden language of the Spirit.

lol I didn't get one.