fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 07:37 am
@Frank Apisa,
I also KNOW that "existence" is a useful concept when applied to situations in which "evidence" is agreed. I KNOW that it is a useless concept in cases where evidence is disputed. Therefore "God exists" for those who agree.

Now of course all of this tends to make "agnostics " look like intellectual fence-sitters. That is why you are doomed to trumpet your denial mantra from the fence like an unwanted referee for games being played quite happily without you on either side of the fence.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 08:08 am
@fresco,
fresco wrote:

I also KNOW that "existence" is a useful concept when applied to situations in which "evidence" is agreed. I KNOW that it is a useless concept in cases where evidence is disputed.


No you don't...although I see the reason you want to insist you do.

But the fact is that whether "existence" is a "useful concept" or not...IF existence actually is existence...it IS...whether or not humans are able to agree on anything about it...or not.

You are stuck in one of the most useless modes I can imagine, Fresco, because you will not differentiate between "existence"...and the human ability to comprehend it.

In any case, "the evidence" (whatever evidence you mean) IS in dispute...but I still consider the concept "existence" to be a useful one.



Quote:
Therefore "God exists" for those who agree.


"God" MAY exist or not exist completely independently of whether or not you or anyone else "agrees" on it. Allow that to penetrate!


Quote:
Now of course all of this tends to make "agnostics " look like intellectual fence-sitters.


Nothing makes my agnosticism look like intellectual fence-sitting, Fresco. That is simply an insult atheists use because most of them do not have the guts to acknowledge they are agnostics...or who want to label themselves "atheists" because they think it makes them look brave.

There is absolutely no way that acknowledging one does not know the answer to questions about the true nature of the REALITY of existence...is fence-sitting.

The notion is laughable.


Quote:
That is why you are doomed to trumpet your denial mantra from the fence like an unwanted referee for games being played quite happily without you on either side of the fence.


I proudly proclaim:

I do not know if there is a GOD or if there are gods;
I do not know if there are no gods;
I see no reason to suspect gods CANNOT EXIST;
I see no reason to suspect that gods MUST EXIST...that they are needed to explain existence;
I do not see enough unambiguous evidence upon which to base a meaningful guess in either direction...

...so I don't.


And I derive a tremendous amount of enjoyment out of watching some atheists try to demean that.

http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/laughing/crying-with-laughter.gif



neologist
 
  2  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 08:19 am
@Setanta,
Even geneii like you and I often comit misteaks in spellnig.
0 Replies
 
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 09:50 am
@Frank Apisa,
Come on Frank. You've been spouting the same "nothing" for 10 years !

I challenge you to state what you would consider to be irrefutable evidence of "the existence of God" ! I suspect you haven't got a clue.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 10:31 am
@fresco,
fresco wrote:

Come on Frank. You've been spouting the same "nothing" for 10 years !


The "nothing" is just your ego trying to make you feel more adequate, Fresco. Your best bet is to ignore it. Investing in it just makes you appear the fool...and I don't want to think of you that way.


Quote:
I challenge you to state what you would consider to be irrefutable evidence of "the existence of God" ! I suspect you haven't got a clue.


I think you have asked me that before (or challenged me that way before)...and I am sure I answered it whether it was asked by you or someone else.

Here is the essential response again:

One…I do not accept question that ask about “God.” If, however, you meant to ask, “I challenge you to state what you would consider to be irrefutable evidence of “the existence of A god”…

…I would consider the question.

I have absolutely no idea of what I would consider “irrefutable” evidence of the existence of a god, but if the god being considered were a god who could be prevailed upon to “prove” reasonably that it existed, I would accept something along the lines of, “At noon Eastern Standard Time in the United States…I want you to make the planet Jupiter disappear from our Solar System…and return it 24 hours later.”

I would not consider that “irrefutable”, but I would consider it reasonable evidence.

What is your point?

I am not saying a GOD exists; I am not saying that there is any way to know if a GOD exists…so why the question about evidence?

I have absolutely no evidence whatsoever if any sentient beings exist on any planet circling the 756th star distant from our Sol…and if asked if there are any, rather than blindly guessing “YES, there are” or “NO, there are not”…I would consider a stance of “I do not know and I have no evidence upon which to base a meaningful guess" to be the most reasonable response.

If challenged to state what I would consider to be irrefutable evidence of "the existence of sentient life on such a planet"…I would so my best not to laugh in the challengers face.

Anything else, Fresco?
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 10:49 am
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
I have absolutely no idea of what I would consider “irrefutable” evidence of the existence of a god

That says it all. Only a fool would claim to be able to classify "evidence" as "ambiguous" (as you did in your last post) without knowing how to recognize "unambiguous evidence". Red herrings about "unreachable planets", and the like, are just vacuous bluster.
You have absolutely nothing to say about religious belief, but no doubt you will continue to say it as long as you live. What are they going to put on the grave stone Frank ? How about "I never knew and now it's too late" ! Wink
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 11:25 am
@fresco,
fresco wrote:

Quote:
I have absolutely no idea of what I would consider “irrefutable” evidence of the existence of a god

That says it all. Only a fool would claim to be able to classify "evidence" as "ambiguous" (as you did in your last post) without knowing how to recognize "unambiguous evidence". Red herrings about "unreachable planets", and the like, are just vacuous bluster.


Why are you changing words around...like "irrefutable" to "unambiguous?"

The only blustering going on here, is coming from you...and bluster seems to be all you know these days.


Quote:

You have absolutely nothing to say about religious belief, but no doubt you will continue to say it as long as you live.


I have plenty to say about "religious beliefs"...and have been saying it for years.

What are you talking about?


Quote:

What are they going to put on the grave stone Frank ? How about "I never knew and now it's too late" ! Wink


That is lame...even for you.

If you cannot control yourself...stay in your room until you can.
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 11:50 am
@Frank Apisa,
Oh dear! You might at least have suggested a gravestone inscription for me. But I suppose creativity from you, rather than the normal turgid denial, might be too much to expect.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 12:28 pm
@fresco,
fresco wrote:

Oh dear! You might at least have suggested a gravestone inscription for me. But I suppose creativity from you, rather than the normal turgid denial, might be too much to expect.


Get over yourself!
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 12:40 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
Get over yourself!


Which one ? Do you mean the one that doesn't suffer fools gladly ? Smile
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 01:10 pm
@fresco,
fresco wrote:

Quote:
Get over yourself!


Which one ? Do you mean the one that doesn't suffer fools gladly ? Smile


I'm not a fool, Fresco.

Get over yourself!
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 01:17 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Oh, you mean the one who who thinks denial without justification is often an indicator of its opposite ?
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 01:24 pm
@fresco,
fresco wrote:

Oh, you mean the one who who thinks denial without justification is often an indicator of its opposite ?


Get over yourseslf, Fresco.

People will think you are a clown.


http://www.smiley-lol.com/smiley/humour-blague/clown-jonglerie/clown.gif
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 01:33 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Remind me to point you to some more creative emoticons.
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 01:35 pm
@fresco,
fresco wrote:
Remind me to point you to some more creative emoticons.
I used to have a good supply but lost the link.
0 Replies
 
Smileyrius
 
  2  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 02:15 pm
@giujohn,
Quote:
Well if there is I havent seen it. I deal in emperical evidence...repeatable, documented, and verifiable. Ya got any like that?


I was merely interested in your prior statement my friend, which had no qualifiers. Your postulation was that there is an absence of "any evidence" that would lead a "logical, rational person" to a belief in a god.
I imagine many logical, rational men have come to a belief in a god both past and present. Evidence is not lacking, it is merely subject to the perception of each and every man according to his own scrutiny.

When you say there is no evidence, if you were to mean that there is no evidence you can think of that would lead you to a belief in a god, I would be inclined to believe you.
0 Replies
 
giujohn
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 02:35 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
I do not know if there is a GOD or if there are gods;
I do not know if there are no gods;
I see no reason to suspect gods CANNOT EXIST;


I know there are no gods.
And there are plenty of reasons why they canot exisit.
And your are such a fence sitter you have a permanant imprint on your butt that says, "AMERICAN FENCE COMPANY INC."
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 02:54 pm
@fresco,
fresco wrote:

Remind me to point you to some more creative emoticons.


I've got it covered, Fresco.


http://www.yudu.com/media/17884/creative.png
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 02:57 pm
@giujohn,
giujohn wrote:

Quote:
I do not know if there is a GOD or if there are gods;
I do not know if there are no gods;
I see no reason to suspect gods CANNOT EXIST;


I know there are no gods.


No you don't.

It takes a fool would pretend to know that.




Quote:
And there are plenty of reasons why they canot exisit.


No there aren't...and it takes a fool would pretend that there are.



Quote:
And your are such a fence sitter you have a permanant imprint on your butt that says, "AMERICAN FENCE COMPANY INC."


No fence-sitting going on here, John. And I don't do what you do...pretend to know stuff I do not know.
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Mar, 2015 03:15 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Tell him he can't prove that, Frank
 

Related Topics

 
  1. Forums
  2. » The Evil of god
  3. » Page 7
Copyright © 2021 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 06/17/2021 at 11:38:54