Atheists cannot KNOW there are no gods, but theists possibly can KNOW there is a GOD.

@Setanta,

Certainly obsessive, bye.

0 Replies

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

Atheists cannot KNOW there are no gods, but theists possibly can KNOW there is a GOD.

All I can say to that one is: Get in line, GOD! Atoothfairyists can't know there isn't a toothfairy, but toothfairyists can know that there is. Abigfootists can't know Bigfoot doesn't exist, but bigfootists can. Aleprechaunist can't know there are no leprechauns, but leprechaunists can know there are. God is an unremarkable also-ran when it comes to this philosophical chestnut.

Ya know what I'm sayin? Or do you need more examples?

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

I wonder if Christianity is an insurance policy against a vengeful God.

On a random though I don't see anti-theists too often. Where have they gone off to?
They are quite fun to spar with.

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@Frank Apisa,

@Joe Nation,
Quote:
Why would there be one?

Quote:

Beats the hell out of me. Why would there be mosquito or malaria?

Just because it seems strange is not reason to suggest it cannot or should not exist.

Anyway, as I said, theists can possibly KNOW there is a GOD, but atheists cannot KNOW there are no gods.

I have no problem with you blindly guessing there are none.

Frank:
You must have missed what I wrote because you mentioned mosquitos and such.
You asked:

Quote:

Joe Nation, are you actually suggesting that the lack of necessity for something means that it does not exist?

And I answered: As pertains to gods, yes.
Follow me on this:
There has to be a reason, a necessity, for a supernatural being to exist.
The claim of all believers of the existence of gods is that god is the creator of all things from whence we (and the mosquitoes) have sprung.
That's why there is a god, they say.
With a god, we all show up.
With no god, there is nothing.
Except if there is no creation, then there is no need for a creator.

The argument for the existence of an eternal god is exactly the same as that for an eternal universe except, again, in an eternal universe there would be nothing for an eternal god to do.

As soon as you can tell why you think there's a reason for a god to exist in this eternal universe, I'll join you in guessing that there might be some kind of deity out there. Right now, there are no openings for a Creator.

No gods.

Joe(and that's okay.)Nation

2 Replies

@Thomas,

Quote:

All I can say to that one is: Get in line, GOD! Atoothfairyists can't know there isn't a toothfairy, but toothfairyists can know that there is. Abigfootists can't know Bigfoot doesn't exist, but bigfootists can. Aleprechaunist can't know there are no leprechauns, but leprechaunists can know there are. God is an unremarkable also-ran when it comes to this philosophical chestnut.

Ya know what I'm sayin? Or do you need more examples?

Bring whatever you need to bring in order to make yourself feel good, Thomas.

The only themes I've ever heard from atheists are variations on:

The theists cannot produce a god for inspection.

There is no need for a god.

Neither of those is evidence that there are no gods.

Atheists base their atheism on beliefs about the non-existence of gods.

1 Reply

@Joe Nation,

Quote:

As soon as you can tell why you think there's a reason for a god to exist in this eternal universe, I'll join you in guessing that there might be some kind of deity out there. Right now, there are no openings for a Creator.

Joe Nation, as soon as you can tell me why you are using the fact that there is no necessity for a god to establish that gods do not exist...we will be getting somewhere.

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@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

Atheists base their atheism on beliefs about the non-existence of gods.

Sure we do. And by "we", I mean "we atheists", "we atoothfairyist", "we abigfootists", "we nonbelievers that the Giants will win the next superbowl" --- the whole gang of gangs. You've got a problem with that?

1 Reply

@Thomas,

Quote:

Sure we do. And by "we", I mean "we atheists", "we atoothfairyist", "we abigfootists", "we nonbelievers that the Giants will win the next superbowl" --- the whole gang of gangs. You've got a problem with that?

Only with the way you phrased it!

1 Reply

@Joe Nation,

Could I clarify what you mean:

1) If God exists there is no theological necessity for everything that exists.
2) There is not a theological necessity for everything that exists.
3) Therefore, God does not exist.

Agree or Disagree??

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Let me rephrase. "You got a problem with that?"

1 Reply

@Thomas,

Let me rephrase. "You got a problem with that?"

Only with the punctuation. Wink

1 Reply

@Val Killmore,

hmm.
More like:
1) if there was no creation, there is no need of a creator.
2) there is no reason to deny that this existence is eternal.
3) therefore, there is no creator.

Once you get past the idea that this Universe can be as eternal as any concept of any god, you stop worrying about it.

Joe(at least, some people do.)Nation

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Deal. I'm glad we could put the issue of God's existence to rest so quickly. Let's talk about something else. Golf perhaps?

2 Replies

@Thomas,

So have you two golfed together? Inquiring minds want to know.

(I was an extremely minor junior golfer but I've got creds since I was part of Arnie's Army). All at Rancho Park. Still have old time clubs, putters, but I gave away the drivers to an interesting friend at the time. (A guy who won at the supreme court, but that was later).

Does golf exist? Should it?

3 Replies

@Thomas,

Quote:

I'm glad we could put the issue of God's existence to rest so quickly.

Wow, have we done that?

Quote:

Let's talk about something else. Golf perhaps?

Okay. My game sucks. How about yours?

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@ossobuco,

Golf is the reason Frank cannot get it out of his head that there might be a god. If there is, maybe that God will correct his swing and lower his handicap to an 8.

Joe(there is always hope)Nation

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@ossobuco,

Quote:

So have you two golfed together? Inquiring minds want to know.

Nope. I do not even know if Thomas golfs.

Quote:

(I was an extremely minor junior golfer but I've got creds since I was part of Arnie's Army). All at Rancho Park. Still have old time clubs, but I gave away the drivers to an interesting friend at the time. (A guy who won at the supreme court, but that was later).

It is a great game, Ossobuco. I love being on the course.

Quote:

Does golf exist? Should it?

Yes it does...and surely it should!

1 Reply

I get it, he's emulating Tiger.

1 Reply

@ossobuco,

Quote:

I get it, he's emulating Tiger.

I wish!

0 Replies

@ossobuco,

ossobuco wrote:

So have you two golfed together? Inquiring minds want to know.

I've never golfed yet, with anyone. I'm sure I'd hit that ball out of the park, though.

1 Reply

Atheists cannot KNOW there are no gods, but theists possibly can KNOW there is a GOD.

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