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Vatican Reprimands a Group of U.S. Nuns

 
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 08:13 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Quote:
The sisters were also reprimanded for making public statements that “disagree with or challenge the bishops, who are the church’s authentic teachers of faith and morals.” During the debate over the health care overhaul in 2010, American bishops came out in opposition to the health plan, but dozens of sisters, many of whom belong to the Leadership Conference, signed a statement supporting it — support that provided crucial cover for the Obama administration in the battle over health care.

Interesting.
Does anyone recall on what grounds these American bishops opposed the health care initiatives?
What on earth did buying into this debate have to do with their role as "leaders" of the Catholic church in the US? Confused
How very Christian of them! Are they all closet Republicans or something?

And now some American Bishop's brief is to set these wayward nuns straight.
Oh I'd love to be a fly on the wall & see that!

Go, wayward nuns! Smile
MontereyJack
 
  2  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 08:33 pm
We'll know what she means, David, even if you don't.
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 08:35 pm
One good pope in my lifetime. It's all been downhill since John XXIII.
Lustig Andrei
 
  2  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 08:35 pm
@msolga,
I believe, msolga -- but I only believe; I'm not positive -- that the Bishops' opposition to the health care legislation had something to do with the fact that the language of the bill would allow contraceptives to be included in the coverage and might even pay for -- heavens forfend! -- certain abortions.
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 08:41 pm
@MontereyJack,
Ditto. Though I don't know about John Paul I.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 08:44 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Quote:
Careful, David. JTT will come after you.


Both you and Om are off topic, Merry. Note that you haven't tripped all over yourself to point that out.

I think that I'll leave correcting Om to you or dlowan.

He has as much chance of having his ditsy ideas on the grammar of English accepted as he does changing English spelling.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 08:49 pm
@msolga,
Are abortions paid for under the Australian health care system, MsO? I wonder about Canada, New Zealand, the UK, France, ... .

If these are paid under other health care systems, how come the bishops in those countries haven't been excommunicated for failing to be the "authentic teachers of faith and morals"?
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 08:52 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Ah! Idea
The penny drops!
Why didn't that occur to me? Wink

So that was more important at the time than extending access to health cover to poor people? (I realize that what eventuated was less than perfect.)

These Bishops are living in the dark ages.
Sounds like they are completely out of touch & should spend more time amongst real people .... like these wayward nuns! Wink
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 09:11 pm
@JTT,
My understanding is that abortions are paid for under the healthcare system in Oz, JTT. I believe Medicare pays something like 2/3 of the cost.
Though I'm hardly an expert on the subject.
Anyone in Oz who knows more about the subject is most welcome to correct me if I've I've gotten the cost details wrong.

Quote:
If these are paid under other health care systems, how come the bishops in those countries haven't been excommunicated for failing to be the "authentic teachers of faith and morals"?

I guess it's because, not being members of the federal parliament, they have no power to directly influence such government decisions, JTT. Wink
Though, of course, they can pontificate from their pulpits.
But, to the best of my knowledge, there has not exactly been too much of that variety of pontification here recently.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 09:21 pm
Quote:
The sisters were also reprimanded for making public statements that “disagree with or challenge the bishops, who are the church’s authentic teachers of faith and morals.”


How come the church's "authentic teachers of faith and morals" were so silent when priests, and likely bishops and up, were boinking kids?
0 Replies
 
Ceili
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2012 10:13 pm
@JTT,
Abortions are covered under the Canadian health care plan. The churches and various politicians flare up the battle every once in a while. But as Chretien (a devout Catholic) said when finalizing the bill, he wasn't the leader of a church but a country - or words to that effect. Bishops have other hot button issues here to fill thier time.
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 01:33 am
@Ceili,
Interesting. I would have thought that the Catholic Church would have even more influence on legislation in Canada than in the USA. Provinces like Quebec and Newfoundland are overwhelmingly Catholic. I remember -- although this is quite a number of years ago -- staying at the Sheraton Hotel on the Canadian side of Niagara Falls, having driven in from Windsor, Ontario. It happened to be Good Friday. I couldn't get a drink in the hotel's cocktail loung to save my soul. Good Friday no liquor could be served. I ended up leaving the country, i.e. driving over the bridge back to the US side and getting a couple of martinis on that side in a suburb of Buffalo, NY, then driving back into Ontario to sleep it off at the Sheraton. Again, this was probably more than 30 years ago but it was typical of my Canadian experiences at that time. And that's Ontario which isn't nearly as Catholic as some of the other provinces, particularly Quebec.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 01:42 am
@Lustig Andrei,
Interestingly, Good Friday is more a Protestant/Evangelical holiday here in Germany than a Catholic: I remember that Catholics were working in their gardens on Good Friday to annoy their neighbours - which was done by the Evangelicals/Protestants vice versa on Feast of Corpus Christi.

0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 02:32 am
@dlowan,
Yes, Miss Wabbit . . . how could they ? ! ? ! ?
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 02:47 am
@Lustig Andrei,
Actually, Ontario has a hefty Catholic population. Back in the 1830s, Canada West (Ontario) struck a deal with Canada East (Québec) that they (the former) would provide Catholic schools if they (the latter) provided secular schools for their English-speaking population. Whether or not that circumstance attracts immigrants, Ontario now has a very large Italian population, a very large Portuguese population, and although not that many from any one nation, a very large Latin American population. The substantial expense of the Catholic district schools in Ontario is a continuing source of irritation for a lot of Ontarians.
0 Replies
 
Miller
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 08:15 am
@Fido,
Fido Quote:

Quote:
He is a Nazi... And His oath to Hitler is older than any oath to the church.


Is that why he wears expensive perfume and fancy little dance shoes?
Miller
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 08:29 am
@msolga,
msolga wrote:

My understanding is that abortions are paid for under the healthcare system ... I believe Medicare pays something like 2/3 of the cost.


Medicare in general will pay for abortions only for individuals who are on Medicare disability. Thus, the disabled under 65 years of age do qualify for financial abortion aid from Medicare. Individuals on regular Medicare are usually 65+ years of age and never need an abortion.

On the other hand, medicaid ( health insurance for the poor) does cover abortion services. I don't know if the latter is dependent on the State of residence, however.
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 10:29 am
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

Yes, but the powers that be in the church are going to be down on them like a ton of bricks, because that will be seen as a direct challenge to hierarchical authority in the church. This should be interesting.


Sorry to be intrusive in this thread; however, it is a statement such as the above that, in my opinion, give credence to my comment about laity hubris in that other thread. You see, even the non-religious follow the goings-on of the Catholic Church, whether they are for or against. It is human nature to root or boo a "contender."
0 Replies
 
Lustig Andrei
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 10:33 am
@Miller,
I believe MsOlga was speaking of Australian Medicare, not the US version. The words may be the same; the concepts are quite different.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2012 10:36 am
@Ceili,
Thanks, Ceili, for that info. That begs the question. Why is there this Vatican-US kerfuffle over this issue when it has been going on in at least two other countries [Australia and Canada] for as long as they have had public health care?

Are only US bishops guardians of what's kosher with the almighty?
 

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