Are you an out-of-the-box thinker?

My out of the box thinking consists of the presumption that every problem has a solution, and with that, never giving up looking for one... It is a trait very common to ironworkers who have some succcess, that they find their way beyond every impediment, refused to be stopped, and I have heard it said that the difficult we do every day, and the impossible only takes a little longer... No one is paid for the danger, and the danger limits those who can do the job; but once there performance often demands a rare intelligence...I always told punks, if the boss does not give you the right tools, you have to use your head...

Are you an iron worker? Can you give us an example of how thinking out-of-the-box solved a problem that no one else did? I'd like to learn more about iron workers, whom I think have one of the most dangerous trades.

Is it true or a myth that American Indians are in large numbers in the trade?
BBB

It's my observation that "thinking out of the box" requires that one is knowledgeable of what's in the box before stepping out.

That, my dear sir, is very cool.

Retired Ironworker... Okay... 3/4 high tensil bolts are what is commonly used... Sometimes on larger jobs 7/8 or 1 inch bolts... On an 18 story in detroit we ran into an oddball size (1 3/8) for which no aligning pin or reamer was available, and the holes would swallow the largest (conical) bull pins... So, the wheels started turning, and I trimmed the edge and some of the threads off the end of a bolt... What it did was make the beginning of the bolt smaller so it would start in mis aligned holes, and then I would use the air impact wrench to run the bolt in, and when it would run it, it would align the hole, not perfectly, but run into a bad hole it would bring a better hole around. .. I got called off the job, but my partner had the trick, and his new partner walked up to me a few minute later and said: there are damned few ironworkers who have ever showed me anything, but that is something; and it was....Three weeks later the pins and reamers showed up, but we were three floors past the floors with the odd ball bolts, and on schedual... The best part for me was another friend telling me: That Dick Bernoit is a smart guy! He showed me a trick of cutting off the end of a bolt and running it in with an impact to line up a hole... He told me don't tell anyone about it.... That is the way those guys were, use every advantage and never give another guy an edge... What did I care... It worked, and it helped us all, and if I can't share a few tricks and not beat a guy out of a job anyway then he deserves the job... I had a lot of tricks in my bolt bag, and I showed a lot of people, and I could care less... No one does it alone...

Yes, there are a fair number of Native Americans... Iroquis confederacy, mostly... Robertsons, of the same clan as Robbi Robertson of The Band fame are pretty thick... Courage is still a virtue prized by them, and they are that... Their intelligence varies, but most of them hang in there through any sort of miserable condition and are some of the witiest of people anywhere... I had to ask Mark Miracle once if they didn't just sit around and pick on each other as children... I prefer their company to any others... They are men, still barbarians in many respects, hard working, but most of all brave, which is a quality essential to every endeavor... Loise Goodleaf Montour could walk the only piece of Iron I could not walk... I have worked with a fair number who helped build the World Trade Center.. Diabo for one...But they know they have gotten the short end in this land... One told me of a Native American Calender he once owned... One the date of the Battle of the Big Horn, it gave that fact, and said: Have a nice day!

I had some wild times, endured a lot of pain, mostly self induced, worked hard, and I am sitting on my ass collecting my pension... I made a living at it, but I was never as good as the naturals, never a bridgeman like my father and brother, just a good hand, and often in my thoughts, -never an ironworker at all...My mind was always in a book or trapped between some girl's legs... They are a rare breed... I am one of a kind...

From my experience, the most difficult problems any of us will encounter are in our interpersonal relationships, and too often people fall into habitual modes of behavior that may have once worked but are clearly not working...

It is an insult to call a person plastic, but I am plastic... How bad do I want my relationship, because what is essential to me, myself, my ego is quite little; and if something I am not doing or am doing is the cause of my problems , then that behavior needs to change... As one books said, -some psychology I picked up in High school for a college level course, and the only line I read and never saw the book again: -ALL CHANGE IS AN ATTEMPT AT PROBLEM SOLVING... Intelligence is the ability to change and to adapt behavior that is clearly not aiding in survival or achieving the goal of happiness... Do You Believe you are intelligent??? What can you change short of the destruction of your essential identity??? Plasticity is often a virtue...

FIDO, thank you so much for telling us about iron workers. You were really an out-side-of-the box person and with great integrity. I can tell you had pride in your work.

BBB

Pride I have, and had; but it is a curse... Humility is in order... No one does it alone...I am not religious, but I think the Muslims are in order to give all credit to God... God or fate, or will matters little to me.... What we do is inevitable... Iron is soft, and people are hard...You need to know how to charm it...Consider the association of magic with iron... Think of the many references in primitive lore to iron working, Arthurs sword in the stone and the like...You have to sweet talk it... Give it due respect, devote your life to it, and it will give you the little gold in every piece of iron...Never take it for granted...

I was curious about your statement, "Iron is soft, and people are hard...You need to know how to charm it..."

Would you tell us how you charm it?

BBB

Being an out of the box thinker could well come of total ignorance that a box exists.

First you have to love it, appreciate what it can do to a human body when out of control, learn the tricks of the trade, what we call Indian tricks, how to safely handle it, how to use, and know the limits of your tools; and give it, in the words of the poet: The best of all your days... All the rest is magic, smoke and mirrors, slight of hand, leasure de mains...

Aha, the iron worker Fido is a romantic poet. Wonderful!

BBB

The box is a formal approach to problem solving... Okay, what at least one philosopher has noted: Insight has its place and there is not substitute for it... In life tasks and relationship; consider the impediment and the goal... If you are commited to the goal, no impediment will stop you... This is not to say no impediment exists, but surrendering mentally to the impediment, accepting the difficult as impossible is defeat...

There was one big bruiser I knew called Hacksaw Smitty, who was a terror in his time... Some Business agent told him he wasn't going to man his job once, and Smitty said: If you don't man it I'll put it up with pimps and whores... The job was manned... Nothing is going to stop you...Boxes are for other people, made to confound the weak of mind and spirit... Never give up and never give in... The mind, what ever that is, is the greatest tool or a foot stool...You decide..

It has a lot of romantic notions attached to it, like being a sailor, or a cowboy... It is all non sense... It is a job, and you have to do it if you want it... One man called my father a Good Ironworker... He was a good man and a good ironworker; but when I told my father that complement he said he was good by default... We all know better people who find some way to self destruct, and cannot manage the stress, or are unable do it all over and over again come rain or shine... No one reaches a level of skill on talent alone... Talent is great, and sure comes in handy, but perserverance in the face of adversity gets you to the top...

Fido, I never noticed you until you wrote about Iron Workers. You remind me of one of my favorite philosopher, Eric Hoffer.

http://theamericano.com/2010/07/13/eric-hoffer-working-philosopher/

BBB

I have read some of him, the true believer; and I saw him on part of a television program years ago that I would love to link to.... There was nothing dumb about that guy; and I think he had the same ability as I in some respects... Tell me some thing, anything... I can tell you in a moment if it fits with all I know in a moment, whether it is true according to what I know, or not... My garage is a mess, but my mind is as neat as a pin... If my mind were a mess I would shoot it... I wish the rest, my external existence was so organized... I don't know why that imaginary place is the only place I can keep uncluttered.. I guess it is because the only way I can learn is by relating it to all I know already... Instant filing... That is the advantagee of philosophy, that it so organizes thought and knowledge...

Eric Hoffer, The True Believer:

http://www.warez-files.com/show-Eric-Hoffer-the-true-believer.html


The Longshoreman Philosopher:

http://www.hoover.org/publications/hoover-digest/article/7854

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I'm just a little surprised that you would attach to Eric Hoffer. He certainly was a social conservative applauded by the likes of Ronald Reagan and Thomas Sowell. Ah well, not that much surprises me anymore.