national anthems, why ?

The American National Anthem is almost impossible to sing. It has embarrassed more professional singers in our nation's history than any other piece of music.

I've spoken to many people who wish America the Beautiful were our anthem. I'd like that, despite the references to god.

Everyone has an opinion - People are so adamant, there are no gray areas at all. People are either for, for, for, or against, against, against.

Setanta
Setanta, I agree. I'm curious about the last two lines: "Till nobler men keep once again Thy whiter jubilee!" I assume "whiter" refers to "alabaster cities", not a racial reference.
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America the Beautiful
Words by Katharine Lee Bates,
Melody by Samuel Ward

O beautiful for spacious skies,
For amber waves of grain,
For purple mountain majesties
Above the fruited plain!
America! America!
God shed his grace on thee
And crown thy good with brotherhood
From sea to shining sea!

O beautiful for pilgrim feet
Whose stern impassioned stress
A thoroughfare of freedom beat
Across the wilderness!
America! America!
God mend thine every flaw,
Confirm thy soul in self-control,
Thy liberty in law!

O beautiful for heroes proved
In liberating strife.
Who more than self their country loved
And mercy more than life!
America! America!
May God thy gold refine
Till all success be nobleness
And every gain divine!

O beautiful for patriot dream
That sees beyond the years
Thine alabaster cities gleam
Undimmed by human tears!
America! America!
God shed his grace on thee
And crown thy good with brotherhood
From sea to shining sea!

O beautiful for halcyon skies,
For amber waves of grain,
For purple mountain majesties
Above the enameled plain!
America! America!
God shed his grace on thee
Till souls wax fair as earth and air
And music-hearted sea!

O beautiful for pilgrims feet,
Whose stem impassioned stress
A thoroughfare for freedom beat
Across the wilderness!
America! America!
God shed his grace on thee
Till paths be wrought through
wilds of thought
By pilgrim foot and knee!

O beautiful for glory-tale
Of liberating strife
When once and twice,
for man's avail
Men lavished precious life!
America! America!
God shed his grace on thee
Till selfish gain no longer stain
The banner of the free!

O beautiful for patriot dream
That sees beyond the years
Thine alabaster cities gleam
Undimmed by human tears!
America! America!
God shed his grace on thee
Till nobler men keep once again
Thy whiter jubilee!

Mixed feelings towards them.

They came from war. Often their lyrics are filled with blood. They are often used as nationalistic opium.

At the same time, they are unifying symbols of a nation: a group of people that faces the future together, as a community.

I agree... people still sing 'To arms, to arms, ye brave!/Th'avenging sword unsheathe!/March on, march on, all hearts resolved/On liberty or death.'
'Deutschland über alles' and bloodier, more jingoistic songs. I'm not one for overt patriotism, as I don't see why being born in one country can give one a sense of superiority over someone born in another.

I like the American anthem the way it is now. I dislike America the beautiful; it makes me puke. The American anthem now is great- patriotic without making other people think 'God, people ought to assasinate whoever wrote that. Oh, they're dead already? Good.'

Oh say can you see, by the dawns early light, what so proudly we hailed at the twilights last gleaming, whose broad stripes and brights stars, through the perilous night, o'er the ramparts we watched, were so galantly streaming. And the rockets red flare, and bombs bursting in air, gave proof through the night, that our flag was still there, oh say does that star spangled banner yet wave, o'er the land of the free, and the home of the brave.

Now, that's an anthem... and I don't find it hard to sing...

Can you hear me now???? "Oh Canada"

lol.. it's the battle of the national anthems! If you couldn't count your own, which anthem would you consider the best? I think 'La Marseillaise.' 'Le jour de gloire est arrivé!'

Although I dislike jingoism, a sense of solidarity every now and again is no bad thing...

When Oz decided we were sick of asking god to save this bloody British queen (and her awful family), there was a referendum to select the most suitable national anthem.

The one selected, Advance Australia Fair, is a bit of a dirge, with archaic references ("our land is girt by sea"). We dropped the bit about "when gallant Cook from Albion sailed" , and "true British courage...".

As anthems go, it's....just OK. But we have it. I have to admit, it wasn't until I reached high school that I realised that it wasn't the national anthem. In primary school, I was taught by Irish nuns, and they sure weren't having any of that "queen" nonsense. AAF was what we sang at assemblies, etc.

The other serious candidate for national anthem, however, was Waltzing Matilda. Seems suitable - a story about a sheep stealer, who suicided rather than be arrested By far the most popular Oz song. Although it was blitzed by those bloody Brits', "Swing Low, Sweet Chariot" at the rugby grand final!

We're not really a nation of singers (too many sound just like me ). But another lesson learned. We'll sing better next time! We made a better go of it at the Davis Cup final! (and were more succesful!)

When I was in grade school, I was told that in a world contest of national anthems, La Marseillaise won first place for music, but the Mexican national anthem won first place for lyrics.

Years later, I found out that at least three other anthems (Italy, Colombia and Argentina) were also first place in lyrics, according to their grade school teachers.

Ah yes, Aussies may not be singers but by god can they dance! I always thought Waltzing Matilda was the OZ national anthem or the 'And the Band Played Waltzing Matida'.

We've had debates up here - a politician was skewered for saying O Canada was unsingable and saying she prefered the Americans. We had to change a couple of stanzas to make it more PC but I kinda like it.

When it comes right down to it though, national identies are kind of unatural. To quote a newfie friend of mine "I still gets tears in me eyes when ever I hears the strains of the old patriotic song"
Cheers

Strange as I may be, but I was actually cheering Australia on in the final... in our family history, we have lots of people going over to Australia; some went on some horrible quest to do with religion and aborigines. Australia deserved some support after the whole 'mind games' rubbish played by the England team. I don't think AAF is that bad an anthem; I must have heard it about fifty times at the Commonwealth games, and it was quite catchy, unlike God Save the Queen. Do you think Australia will have a referendum for/against a Republic in the near future? Hhh, damn that prop of the class system.

*Recovers from his Republican moment*

As for Swing Low.. well, Australia made their own anthem; England stole an old spiritual, and gave it that special inebriated effect.

In England, people confer all sorts of lewd meanings on Waltzing Matilda. Still, passion without sounding foolish is what an anthem's all about. I remember having an argument against some Kiwi guy at the Manchester Games. He said that Rolf Harris' 'Two Little Boys' should be adopted as Australian national anthem.

That's grade school (Junior and Infants' school?) teachers for you! To be fair, I still remember the Mexican national anthem from some years ago, when Sra. Comer, my first Spanish teacher, who would always speak to me in Spanish rather than English, started saying, 'Andrés, voy a cantarte el himno nacional mexicano.' It went something like 'Mas si osare un extraño enemigo, profanar con su planta tu suelo, piensa ¡oh nación querida! que el cielo, un soldado en cada hijo te dio.' Quite war-ish, as are most anthems. At the end of the year, she gave me this little statue of a pointy thing with a purple cap, a crook, and a white cloak, saying that it was something to do with Holy Week. I've always wondered what it really is.

Yes, ceili, that's very true... look at Belgium and Netherlands. Brits and others set their borders for them! Then one looks at Africa, and there's where things get completely manic. (Unrelated, but) If there were to be one Western, developed country that will fall in the next 50 years, which one do you think it would be?

I love 'And the band played Waltzing Matilda.' Well, as much as one can love a song so grimly describing the terrors of war. The first time I heard it was in Dublin- Shane McGowan was singing it- and PC, this big butch bloke, rather Laclosesque in character, started blubbering and saying, 'that isn't fair.' I think O Canada's quite good, but they could have thought of a better name, to avoid ridicule. Whatever they may say, I feel that Canada rocks.

I with you on both accounts, "O" is silly but... what's a nation to do?
I kinda think we rock too. :wink:
First time I heard " And the band played.....
was by the pogues too. It is one of the saddest songs I know, I choke up every time I hear it.

The 'O' always makes me laugh, the rest is nice.. the O reminds me of when Philipa was discussing the Millere's Tale (Chaucer). Somehow, the dialogue between her and I stopped when I had to grab her 'haunchebones'- her being Alison, I being Nicholas. She calls words like O filler words, and started shouting 'Hark.' Still, she's not as bad as the Polish Piano teacher I once had, who- when I was in the middle of a great rendition of something (I think it was Nightswimming by REM)- started telling me his life story for three hours. He's a correspondant on Polish international radio, and claims that the French services checked him out. He then started singing 'Radio Polonia' at the top of his voice and talked about radio filler music.

McGowan really gets the desperation of it across; it's a sad song for me too. The kind of song that equates to the atmosphere of overcoming sadness.

On a lighter note... what could replace 'O Canada' anyway?

I think the best rendition of God Save The Queen was by the rock band Queen, with Freddie Murcury wearing a large ornate crown & ermine

So, Freddie was singin' 'bout himself, then, eh?

We have a lot of really good regional type songs,
Farewell to Nova Scotia
Alberta Bound
Four Strong Winds
I'd have to think about this more, I'd never really thought of replacing the anthem. Where's Cav when you need him???

Well, that's a little bit wrong-focused, I think.
(Continental Euroepan countries have always changed their borders ... or got them changed.) (Sometimes without Brits :wink: )

How 'bout Runnin' Back to Saskatoon -- by Guess Who . . . ya think them folks in Sasquatich-Juan will adopt it?