1
   

Most here attack or defend. Are there any that just seek God.

 
 
Greatest I am cv
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 02:21 am
@xexon,
xexon;64156 wrote:
At some point in everyone's spiritual evolution, there comes a time where the practice of a faith or path comes to an end. The reason being it has fullfilled it's purpose.

Religions like Christianity hold you in a state of waiting. There's alot of thumb twiddling in the meantime. Everybody thinks Jesus is coming to take them to his kingdom.

This is a misunderstanding of his message.

Jesus would say get up and walk the path. How will you complete the journey if you stop and worship a sign post that points the way? Jesus doesn't want or need your worship, he just needs for you to keep moving. That's the only thing that is important. Not what you believe. That will change according to the scenary.

Now you want to know how I know. Right?

Maybe I've been down this path before? Maybe I slide back and forth on it every day? It's an interesting commute to work.

I was a seeker from a young age. Around 4 or 5. Knew I saw the world differently than those around me. But I endured the baptist faith as a youngster. I knew something was wrong with what the preacher was talking about, but as a preteen, you don't have much of a voice. Mine didn't come until years later.

Devoured many libraries worth of books in search of answers. Settled into eastern mysticism and never looked back. One day, a few decades ago, it all came to an abrupt end. The searching ceased. Even reading of books stopped.

I've been in a state of unfoldment ever since. I can only describe it as watching the sun come up and illuminating everything around you. It was all there to begin with, but like everyone else, I spent my time huddled around the camfire of belief in the spiritual darkness.

I can't see everything with clarity, but what I do behold is worth all that you own in this world.



x


Glad to know that God did not tap you on the shoulders.

My view stand that says it is to us to find God, not for God to find us.

Before I leave you, I invite you to check on Gnosticism. You may find their search for knowledge and wisdom without strict adherence to a named God refreshing if you find the right group to chat with although even there you will meet some that are no better than some sites. Good luck.

Regards
DL
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 03:40 am
@xexon,
xexon;64142 wrote:
The only thing that blocks the view of "God" is belief.

Belief in your human identity for starts.

Most wake up in this world already dressed for the roles they will play here. The think themselves real.

The metaphysical reality is you are an extention of your "soul". You are the plaything of your higher self, the radiant soul. You are not the soul itself.

When the mind isn't blocking the view of this connection, you recieve input from the higher self. In the form of compassion and love. These are not mental qualities, but come from beyond where the mind itself can go.

The human mind however will filter and select what is to be loved and what is to be despised. The mind, which is the true Satan of religious mythology, is a divider. By it's nature.

The mind is nothing more than a calulating machine. It functions as a scale does. It weighs one thing against another to determine worth. It balances itself according to belief. Belief is a very liquid thing. It changes at the drop of a hat. That's why the mind, "Satan", is a liar. It can't be trusted.

Belief, it would seem, is best avoided.

When you culitivate compassion, you expand your awareness of self far and beyond where the human mind can touch bottom. You don't find many people out this deep. Because they fear what they once held dear is going to slip away from them. Many are called...

As long as you have belief about the way things are "supposed" to be, you will not know God.

To enter the kingdom, you must arrive at the gate naked of all human belief.

It is a personal experience. Words cannot find a foothold to explain it.

You must become as a child. Naked of all belief.

Then the kingdom finds you.


x


This is ridiculous. Whether we want to recognize it or not "beliefs" are a necessity, they are the way we perceive the world around us. Without Beliefs we would just be blind sacks of blood and guts.
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 03:49 am
@Greatest I am cv,
You might find I'm rather well rounded on other beliefs around the world.

I read the Nag Hammadi when it was first published. Dead Sea Scrolls, and all the rest. I read a GREAT deal. Some of it, including my final path, was very a esoteric form of yoga. But for whatever reason, it fit me like a glove.

Ultimately, if you cannot explain what God is to a six year old, you cannot explain it to an adult either. This is the state of the modern world.This is what happens when the blind lead the blind.

All these big, thick holy books, and the priests needed to explain them. That's a sure sign of a wrong direction.

I can write the basics of Jesus' message on a 3x5 card. Give me a few moments with a child, they will understand what God is and how to cultivate awareness so they can see it with their own eyes.

I'm not a cult or a religion. I'm just an older brother. I'm everybody's brother.Telling his younger brothers and sisters of his traveler's tales.

Most will just think I'm pulling their leg and go back to playing.

But your turn will come.


x
0 Replies
 
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 04:05 am
@Fatal Freedoms,
Fatal_Freedoms;64169 wrote:
This is ridiculous. Whether we want to recognize it or not "beliefs" are a necessity, they are the way we perceive the world around us. Without Beliefs we would just be blind sacks of blood and guts.



I beg to differ.

There is a conscious energy behind your human identity. It has no mind to store beliefs in. It perceives directly. It's simply "on"

When you come to this world, part of the human package besides a body and brain, is the mind. The user interface of the mind is the ego. It contains the beliefs about self identity and how you're seen by others.

The ego is the real problem. Since it's input is limited to the 5 senses, it constructs an incomplete picture of reality based on this narrow slit it can see through. It believes it real, because it has nothing to compare it against that says differently.

The symbology of Satan falling from heaven, making this world his own, and ruling over it. "God", representing the totality of creation, is not seen here. This world is a world of division and duality, because this is the way the mind works.

Satan, the mind, tears God in half and declares one half better than the other.

Enlightened people see so such division. It's all God.


x
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 04:41 am
@xexon,
xexon;64174 wrote:
I beg to differ.


When you say "i beg to differ" it, it is you expressing your difference in belief. Any logical person can see the paradox you've encased yourself in. As it is only your "belief" that "beliefs aren't important", quite amusing if you ask me. Very Happy
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 08:03 am
@Fatal Freedoms,
Now you've gone into the realm of circular argument.

Like a dog chasing it's tail, there's alot of activity but very little progress.

Logic belongs to the mind. To thinkers, philosophers. You know... those people that can't get into heaven.

I'm incredibly poor in math. You can get an idea of how important logic is to me then. Like a blind person who has developed a profound sense of hearing, my sense of intuitive knowing has been amplified in compensation. I "feel", where other people think.

People seem to think that holy men are supposed to sit under a tree and entertain others with witty sayings. May be true for some. But at no time is the ego made to go away. Nor is free will compromised. The ego is a needful thing. You cannot engage or interact with the human world without it. But as I said above, it's also the problem. It's the clog in your spiritual plumbing.

I have to interact with you on a human level, therefore the human typing this functions as a go between. The difference between me and most others is the fact is I'm not bound to the ego as my sole identity. But I do have to rely on it to translate what I have to say. The ego will always give it a personal flavor. The strengths and weaknesses I have as a person will affect how I'm seen in that delivery.

Ego is kept on a short leash. Allowed to walk and play in the world, but with restrictions. It is a living thing and has to be cared for like a child or pet. But in my kingdom, it knows it's place and acts as humble servant rather than drunk taskmaster.

When you come to understand the nature of reality, the ego surrenders in face of a superior power. It gladly serves in it's new capacity as co-pilot. Better to serve in heaven...

This all happens as belief and attraction to this world begin to lessen. The ego has no job in the spiritual realms, so it slides out of the driver's seat so that the higher self can finish the journey.

Ego falls away at death as does the rest of human identity, but the conscious energy that powered it continues. No such thing as death. This belongs to the human world only. Reincarnating time and time again.

Eternal life occurs when that cycle has been broken.

Now you're just a radiant soul again. Your true nature. With the whole kingdom stretched out before you.



x
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 09:59 am
@xexon,
xexon;64177 wrote:
Now you've gone into the realm of circular argument.

Like a dog chasing it's tail, there's alot of activity but very little progress.


Your circular argument not mine.



Quote:
I "feel", where other people think.


Feeling is not an adequate substitute for thinking.




The rest of your post does not address my point.
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 11:03 am
@Fatal Freedoms,
I'm not a debator. I share my yogic perspective on the world. People are free to sit around my campfire or keep walking as they please. I have nothing to sell, nor do I convert. I just see things differently that what people believe exists.

You are not your mind. You are not the person reading this screen. You are a plaything of a higher consciousness that you currently don't understand. You are a dolly in a make believe world. You are endowed with the power of creation, just as the one who made you is. Just stepped down. Like a transformer reduces electrical current.

There are ways of traveling up and down this circuit. To be in this world, and to be in the kingdom, is like shifting vision in a pair of bifocals. It is one and the same, but the perspective is up to me.

The ability to translate that is another matter. It is easier that you should travel to that place so you can see for yourself, than take the word of another. The mind, and it's inability to see into the spiritual realms, will forever weigh evidence of a second hand nature.

You must experience. "Feel". Not think. Why do you think they say there are no philosophers in heaven? They couldn't stop splitting hairs long enough to notice the door that would reveal all.

You must make the mind silent. No mental movement. Not remembering the past. No anticipation of the future. You're just... "on". Conscious. Aware.

Only then will you hear the call of the divine.

If you follow that sound, it will lead you to the kingdom.

Most will take a few lifetimes to "think" about it.



x
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 01:25 pm
@xexon,
xexon;64183 wrote:
I'm not a debator. I share my yogic perspective on the world. People are free to sit around my campfire or keep walking as they please. I have nothing to sell, nor do I convert. I just see things differently that what people believe exists.

You are not your mind. You are not the person reading this screen. You are a plaything of a higher consciousness that you currently don't understand. You are a dolly in a make believe world. You are endowed with the power of creation, just as the one who made you is. Just stepped down. Like a transformer reduces electrical current.

There are ways of traveling up and down this circuit. To be in this world, and to be in the kingdom, is like shifting vision in a pair of bifocals. It is one and the same, but the perspective is up to me.

The ability to translate that is another matter. It is easier that you should travel to that place so you can see for yourself, than take the word of another. The mind, and it's inability to see into the spiritual realms, will forever weigh evidence of a second hand nature.

You must experience. "Feel". Not think. Why do you think they say there are no philosophers in heaven? They couldn't stop splitting hairs long enough to notice the door that would reveal all.

You must make the mind silent. No mental movement. Not remembering the past. No anticipation of the future. You're just... "on". Conscious. Aware.

Only then will you hear the call of the divine.

If you follow that sound, it will lead you to the kingdom.

Most will take a few lifetimes to "think" about it.



x


Something you will learn about me is this: I am not concerned with what people believe but rather if they can justify those beliefs.
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Feb, 2009 02:48 pm
@Fatal Freedoms,
Like saying radio waves don't exist because you can't personally pick up any?

Truth at the human level will always be a personal experience. Individual to that person. According to their abilities.

In a metaphysical sense, that's about range of perception.

Some people are AM radios. Some people are shortwaves. The AM radios have a hard time understanding the shortwaves, and their talk of "other" bands.



x
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 01:07 am
@xexon,
xexon;64190 wrote:
Like saying radio waves don't exist because you can't personally pick up any?


Not at all. I am not "picking up" or "looking for" anything, I am asking the people who hear the radio waves to show me they exist. If they can hear the waves and I cannot, and that person can't show me how they hear it and I don't this suggests to me that, that person is being deceived.

truth leaves a trail of breadcrumbs, and if you claim you found the truth you should have a handful of breadcrumbs to show for it.

Quote:
Truth at the human level will always be a personal experience. Individual to that person. According to their abilities.


Truth is not dependent upon our perceptions. If A man says he sees a flying leprechaun, is it true simply because he perceives it? If nobody perceives anything, does truth cease to exist?

Quote:
In a metaphysical sense, that's about range of perception.


"Metaphysics is the finding of bad reasons for what we believe upon instinct; but to find these reasons is no less an instinct." - Francis H. Bradley
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 03:47 am
@Fatal Freedoms,
But you're using the wrong approach. I can't show you God. The best I can do is share my own experiences in hope of jumpstarting your own.

You can't think your way to God. That's not how it works. It's not a matter of intellectual comprehension. It's a matter of inner experience. You have to learn to see with your heart. When you do, it's like Superman's x-ray vision times a thousand. It reveals the how and why of things in intricate detail. Well beyond the mind and it's illusions. You see people as they truly are, under all the attachments in life they have adorned themseleves with. I see a core of gold in all people. My purpose is helping them knock off the earthy mud a little so they can see it for themselves.

It is said that mankind is enclosed in 3 sheaths. Physical, mental, and spiritual. Spiritual being the last to master. We can can sculpt our bodies easily enough. We can train our minds and fill them with knowledge in schools.

Who truly understands how to exercise and master the spiritual better than those who have done it? There are many people like myself, but I'm not going to twist anyone's arm to make you believe it.

I would much rather help you become as I am so "faith" no longer haunts your future. And it will, because the mind will forever ask the question "what is God?"

The mind is a spiritual wasteland. A desert. Even Jesus spent 40 days there thinking on things.

And then he left it behind. Left belief behind. Then poured his cup of soul back into the ocean it came from.

The message of Jesus is you can do the same.

The message of Jesus is also my message.



x
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 04:02 am
@xexon,
xexon;64197 wrote:
But you're using the wrong approach. I can't show you God.


Then how do I know he is real?

Quote:
You can't think your way to God.

I've heard some convincing arguments from deists.


Quote:
That's not how it works. It's not a matter of intellectual comprehension. It's a matter of inner experience.


Experience, especially 'inner' experience is subjective and varies greatly from person to person, so how then can objective reality be the cause of these experiences? The fact that he can only be found within the mind tells me he only exists in the mind.

Quote:

You have to learn to see with your heart.


"To see by faith is to close the eye of reason"
-B.Franklin



Quote:
When you do, it's like Superman's x-ray vision times a thousand. It reveals the how and why of things in intricate detail. Well beyond the mind and it's illusions. You see people as they truly are, under all the attachments in life they have adorned themselves with. I see a core of gold in all people. My purpose is helping them knock off the earthy mud a little so they can see it for themselves.

It is said that mankind is enclosed in 3 sheaths. Physical, mental, and spiritual. Spiritual being the last to master. We can can sculpt our bodies easily enough. We can train our minds and fill them with knowledge in schools.


It can be said, but not demonstrated

Quote:
Who truly understands how to exercise and master the spiritual better than those who have done it? There are many people like myself, but I'm not going to twist anyone's arm to make you believe it.


And a mirage is a trick of the mind, something i will have trouble dismissing when you bring me back a cup of water.

Quote:
I would much rather help you become as I am so "faith" no longer haunts your future. And it will, because the mind will forever ask the question "what is God?"


Q: "what is god"
A: man's answer to questions he doesn't understand
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 04:48 am
@Fatal Freedoms,
But what I say can be proven. Every bit of it.

The rub is you have to do it for yourself. With a few basic instructions. Just as if you were going after a degree. They're not going to hand you one without going to class first. You must grow. Demanding one because you want one gets you nowhere.

The path has always been this simple, before religion got a hold of it.

You are God, but you can only put so much awareness within a human and still let them play as a human. This is a world of children. Spiritual children. Proud of their minds and bodies. Near blind spiritually.

It's immaturity that plagues all that approach the end of their childhood. I wanted a beard when I was a child. I had to wait until I was capable of growing one for myself.

Merging into the godhead is the same thing. Demand all you want, but until you're mature enough to reach the door, it will remain closed.

You have time. Why not work on the self, so as to prove to yourself what I say is true? Remember what I said? You can never satisfy the mind. You need it as a tool on the journey. That's all. You never feed it excessively. Makes it too strong. Then you think too much.

An intellectual monkey on the back is still a monkey on the back.



x
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 05:17 am
@xexon,
xexon;64199 wrote:
But what I say can be proven. Every bit of it.


Good, then prove it.

Quote:
The rub is you have to do it for yourself. With a few basic instructions. Just as if you were going after a degree. They're not going to hand you one without going to class first. You must grow. Demanding one because you want one gets you nowhere.


You can make up all the analogies you want and they will all be pointless unless you show me why it is even the case to begin with.
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 06:19 am
@Fatal Freedoms,
But only you can prove it for yourself. This is critical. Realization comes in no other form.

If you want God, you have to go where the answer is. Inside yourself. You travel this path alone.

Until then, God remains an unrealized concept rather than a reality. You will never find the answers in the outer world. In the realm of the mind. In the world of religion and debate.

There isn't any duality in the answer of what God is.



x
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 07:28 am
@xexon,
xexon;64201 wrote:
But only you can prove it for yourself. This is critical. Realization comes in no other form.


Good i'll prove to myself there is a god when you prove to yourself there is no god.

lol

Your proof that god exists is that i can prove to myself that god exists...:rollinglaugh:

Quote:
If you want God, you have to go where the answer is. Inside yourself. You travel this path alone.

Until then, God remains an unrealized concept rather than a reality. You will never find the answers in the outer world. In the realm of the mind. In the world of religion and debate.

There isn't any duality in the answer of what God is.
x


As I said earlier, the fact that you can only find god in the mind of an individual suggest to me that god is a product of the mind, and not an objective reality.

The fact that i must first believe before I can find evidence negates the very reason i would need evidence. Evidence comes before belief.

It's the Peter pan dilemma, you have to believe in fairies before you are able to fly. It's a product of fantasy, mystical hogwash. If god is real you shouldn't have to believe in him to find evidence of his existence.
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 08:31 am
@Fatal Freedoms,
But there is no "him".

That's what you're missing.

It's all you.


x
Fatal Freedoms
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 08:43 am
@xexon,
xexon;64204 wrote:
But there is no "him".

That's what you're missing.

It's all you.


x


I'm god? Then god is not god. You can redefine god, but that would just make the definition lack any real meaning. I could call my chair god, but that would make the word lose all meaning.
xexon
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Feb, 2009 10:39 am
@Fatal Freedoms,
You identify with the Christian image of what God is supposed to be. A being of some sort. Maybe sitting on a throne.

The God I know is an endless sea of conscious energy. The "kingdom". No form of itself, yet capable of assuming all.

You have created the very world that surrounds you. The ultimate virtual reality. You're role playing and you don't even realize it. Because you woke with with the human mask already on.

Your soul has some interesting abilities. To create and project what it desires. Your whole human identity and the world around it, forms a kind of cocoon around your perception, so that you will experience it as you would an IMAX movie.

It puts you in the picture, to the exclusion of everything else.

You "fall" from heaven. Losing your omnicent vision. Losing sight of "God". Now you only see the human world. And your mind is intoxicated with it.

Takes many lifetimes to break this addiction. Because the mind and the ego it contains, is the real great Satan. Powerful. Seductive. Demanding.

But can be trained.

It's not hard to spot those who have failed, and continue to think. This isn't a race. Each person progresses as they are capable.

It's about the ability to feel. Compassion. Empathy.

Has nothing to do with IQ or education.

A child can know God.

The problem with adults is they believe they can't.




x
 

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