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God (Part 3): As Self-evolution of Consciousness

 
 
Reply Sat 14 Feb, 2009 04:07 pm
[SIZE="4"]I've saved the best part of this contemplation of the God concept for last; however, it also is often the hardest to explain. In case you are worried about the length of this section, it is mostly due to a long list of supportive quotes and not the main body of my closing points. I offer the quotes in a second post right after this one in this thread.

But first, let me dutifully say, this is Part 3 of a three part series. I don't think this thread will make much sense unless you first read Parts 1 & 2, "Anti-God Reasoning Blunders" and "God Epistemology" found here:
http://www.philosophyforum.com/forum/philosophy-forums/branches-philosophy/philosophy-religion/3631-god-part-1-anti-god-reasoning-blunders.html
http://www.philosophyforum.com/forum/philosophy-forums/branches-philosophy/philosophy-religion/3632-god-part-2-god-epistemology.html

Imagine a modern human trying to explain to a Neanderthal neighbor what intellectual ability is like. Neanderthals seem to have learned mostly by trial and error, but modern humans were able to calculate. Every tip the modern human gives Neanderthal for using his brain to calculate, he starts up with trial and error to test it. Yet what really is called for is a new set of skills altogether, not trying to achieve calculation through old skills.

Similarly, union is not a skill of intellect and senses, but rather (hold on all you intellectuals, don't freak) it is a skill of feeling. Stick with me a little bit longer so I can explain how this sort of feeling is not emotions or anything that would diminish or is in conflict with one's intellectual ability.

Emotions obviously do involve feeling, but the feeling element of emotion is typically intensified or altered by hormones and a particular state of mind (romantic love or panic, as examples). I am talking about feeling unaffected by body chemistry or mind status. In other words, I'm using the term "feel" as a synonym for sensitivity. The potentials of sensitivity are significant because except for how consciousness is foundationally structured, sensitivity is more basic to conscious experience than any other single factor. I call this most fundamental aspect base sensitivity.

Not everyone would agree that any sensitivity is so basic. A possible reason for that opinion can be had by imagining that feeling is to consciousness what reflectivity is to a mirror. A mirror can display any sort of image, but reflectivity is involved in every bit of it. If humans were mirrors, we might become so mesmerized by all the interesting images, we'd never recognize how basic reflecting is. Similarly, we are so busy using consciousness for the activities of life most of us don't take the time, or necessarily think it's worthwhile, to examine the base conditions underlying our personal conscious existence. Consequently, we know consciousness mostly by what we do with it and not for what it is.

One of the potentials of working with one's base sensitivity is that of increasing overall conscious sensitivity. A situation that demonstrates this potential is a man on a rainy day who wants to know how frequently his leaky roof drips. Since it's leaking right over where water is boiling in a pan on the stove, he decides to watch the pan for drips. Is there any way to make it more likely he will observe the leak? Since churning water will obscure any less-subtle transmission, stopping the water from boiling will allow it to settle into a still surface and display the arrival of the tiniest wisp of water. Consciousness is similarly more sensitive when still.

But how does one still the mind? Most people try first to stop the mind with the mind itself, but that's as impossible as lifting oneself by one's own bootstraps. Others learn about calming oneself or breathing regularly, etc. But in the practice of union I described in the last section, something else is counted on altogether.

In the practice of union, one learns to find something inside oneself that is already still and already one. Through a series of steps, one learns to sort of surrender to this simple core of peace and oneness, and that is when absorption can occur. When absorbed into this plane or realm, its stillness and oneness will make consciousness that way effortlessly. Practicing from there onward is learning how to "ride" with this very, very powerful but very, very subtle wave.

Now, why have I spoke of God epistemology "As Self-evolution of Consciousness"? For two reasons.

The first is, union practice really does open up awareness of reality in a way that isn't there in the "fragmented" condition (recall I said that union resulted in an experience of oneness--two types of oneness really--the first is the oneness of integrating all of the practitioner's energies, and the second is experiencing becoming one with something vast). The compartmentalizing achieved by the intellect and fed information by the senses, is most valuable to thinking about the complex details of reality. Physical reality, for example, is utterly multifaceted and operating with incredible regularity, so being able to fashion an aspect of consciousness to match that, and then use it to calculate and predict and plan and create, etc. is useful.

But all that expert fragmentation the intellect achieves tends to cause us to miss the whole, and oneness adds that naturally to one's perspective. Now rather than trying to synthesize parts and guess where it fits with other stuff, one sees the whole too and therefore where a part fits into the whole, a tremendous advantage to understanding. So, I am saying that as an expansion of consciousness that we have the potential to develop, that is evolutive.

The second way union is evolution is even more powerful in my opinion. No matter how smart or successful we become, it doesn't seem to equate to happiness. You can be rich or a genius and still be miserable, hurt others, start wars, be selfish, and so on. If you think about it, all of it is due to seeking fulfillment of one sort or another. The unfulfilled person is the source of virtually all misery on this planet (except for natural disasters); even perverse evil acts are what some seem to think satisfies.

A theory of union practitioners has long been that people don't know their own "heart" (i.e., that still core the union practitioner finds inside to become one with), and this lack of self-knowledge creates a longing. Because we attempt to fulfill the longing by external means, we fail, and that in turn leads to frustration, unhappiness, anger, fruitless pursuits, and then the venting of all that lack of fulfillment on others and the world. So even if we become the geniuses of the universe, why should we assume it will translate into happiness, contentment, love, and peace?

How cool would it be to be able to feel love, happiness, and at peace without being dependent on things outside ourselves? The ups and downs of the external world sends our moods up and down right with it because of our dependence on things being "a certain way." Things go well, and we are happy; things go poorly, and we are upset. But when a person can rely on something inside for happiness, that separates it from the incessant fluctuations of the external world and so gives us a means for constancy.


In conclusion, union experience is self-directed evolution because it takes advantage of a fundamental aspect of consciousness, base sensitivity, to both enhance our intelligence (by adding the wisdom of the "whole-view"), and provide us with a means for making our experience of fulfillment independent of external circumstances.

Also, there is no need for religion to practice oneness, and neither is there reason to believe or disbelieve in God to practice. However, there is also no reason why someone can't practice religion and union experience together either. It really doesn't matter if one has the actual experience available. But if, as I propose, the most credible claims of a conscious universe have stemmed from union experience, then it may be that the only way we can decide the God issue is to become proficient in that practice and discover the truth for ourselves.

The next post finishes up this thread.
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LWSleeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Feb, 2009 04:11 pm
@LWSleeth,
[SIZE="4"]I've chosen these individuals to quote for their interest in a "self" quite different from the personality self, or the ego self, or the mind-body self. Not all the individuals quoted were union/samadhi practitioners, some I chose because they seemed to have an intuitive sense of the oneness realm. But it's accurate to say most of them did practice, and in fact, were devoted monastics as well.

Take note of the span of times and cultures represented, and the fact that people approach practice a variety of ways. Some prefer a more yogic approach, and so represent their experience non-theistically. Others (by far the favorite way) represent their experience devotionally, as though in a loving relationship with the vast mind they claim they are experiencing.

Some call it samadhi meditation, others (in the West) call it union prayer or prayer of the heart. Notice how often "heart" and "soul" and other such "inner" terms show up, everyone knows the way to union begins inside oneself.

Finally, notice how little of what is said makes any sense to our normal way of viewing reality, such as the great union practitioner Kabir's remark about God being the breath inside the breath. Maybe it will be easier to understand why the sense-mind translation refers to such utterances as "mystical." Yet from Kabir's perspective, it wasn't "mystical"; he was merely describing what he was experiencing first hand. It is only mystifying if one can't see and feel the realm he is observing.


Quotes

"Student, tell me, what is God? He is the breath inside the breath." Kabir, 1488-1512, India

" . . . all merge in No-Thing. This heaven is so vast no message can stain it. How may a snowflake exist in a raging fire?" Kakuan, 12th century A.D., China

"[the soul achieves] union with Him who is above all knowledge . . . . Our thought is restrained in proportion to the height of our ascent; but when our ascent is accomplished, thought will cease altogether and be absorbed into the ineffable." Dionysius the Areopagite, 5th century A.D., Syria

"Thou commands me to love my neighbor [but] . . . I [cannot] admit anything else to be mingled with Thee . . . . My me is God, nor do I know my selfhood, save in Him!" Catherine of Genoa, 1447-1510, Italy

"Farid, why wander from jungle to jungle, breaking the thorny branches in search of the Lord? In my heart and not in the jungle does my Lord reside." Sheikh Farid, 1173-1265, Pakistan

". . . between us and God this unity forever ceaselessly renews itself; for the spirit of God, outflowing and indrawing, touches and stirs our spirit . . ." Ruysbroeck, 1293-1381, Flanders

"Self of my Self, for Thou are but I, Self of my Self, for I am Thou, The two of us in one shall never die, What do they matter-the why and how?" Lalleswari, 14th century A.D., India

"And I say that if this prayer is the union of all the faculties, the soul is unable to communicate its joy even though it may desire to do so-I mean while being in the prayer. And if it were able, then this wouldn't be union. How this prayer they call union comes about and what it is . . . . we already know since it means that two separate things become one. . . . While the soul is seeking God in this way, it feels with the most marvelous and gentlest delight that everything is almost fading away through a kind of swoon in which breathing and all the bodily energies gradually fail." Teresa of Avila, Spain 16th century A.D., writing in Life
0 Replies
 
hammersklavier
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Feb, 2009 03:00 pm
@LWSleeth,
LWSleeth wrote:

Emotions obviously do involve feeling, but the feeling element of emotion is typically intensified or altered by hormones and a particular state of mind (romantic love or panic, as examples). I am talking about feeling unaffected by body chemistry or mind status. In other words, I'm using the term "feel" as a synonym for sensitivity. The potentials of sensitivity are significant because except for how consciousness is foundationally structured, sensitivity is more basic to conscious experience than any other single factor. I call this most fundamental aspect base sensitivity.
Can you argue for this idea a little bit more? Yes, emotions involve feeling (and so forth), but 1) why do you say that sensitivity is not an emotion as prescribed above, and 2) why do you say that sensitivity is one of the foundational structures of consciousness? I feel this is the crux of your terminology and you're being a little bit fuzzy here...
Dichanthelium
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Feb, 2009 01:20 pm
@LWSleeth,
Thanks for a very generous, informative, and thought-provoking series.
LWSleeth
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Feb, 2009 02:23 pm
@hammersklavier,
hammersklavier;48863 wrote:
Can you argue for this idea a little bit [SIZE="4"]more? Yes, emotions involve feeling (and so forth), but 1) why do you say that sensitivity is not an emotion as prescribed above, and 2) why do you say that sensitivity is one of the foundational structures of consciousness? I feel this is the crux of your terminology and you're being a little bit fuzzy here...


The thing about discussing feeling in humans is that it is almost always interpreted as emotions, so it is difficult to talk about without the discussion going off course. But I am saying feeling itself is a neutral quality which is incorporated into various operations of consciousness. Emotion is just one way feeling is incorporated (the worst way IMO). What I really am trying to talk about is feeling before it becomes part of any conscious function, and what potential for conscious development learning to work with feeling on that level that holds.

To explain more, how does a microphone detect our voice, or a Geiger counter detect radiation, or a motion sensor detect movement? They all maintain a field of sensitivity that you could say "feel" respective vibrations.

We too detect by feeling . . . the eyes "feel" light waves, the ears feel air vibrating, etc. We detect by feeling literally everything we can. The fields for maintaining sensitivity to our environment is accomplished by optical, auditor, etc. nerves.

However, unlike a motion sensor or microphone, we also know we feel/detect. That's what makes us conscious; without that knowing part, we be as dumb as a microphone.

Instead of saying we know that we feel, we could say we feel
0 Replies
 
LWSleeth
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Feb, 2009 02:38 pm
@Dichanthelium,
[SIZE="4"]
Dichanthelium;49047 wrote:
Thanks for a very generous, informative, and thought-provoking series.


Thanks, I'm glad someone has appreciated it. Actually, I decided to write it (I know it's long) after reading WithoutReason's sincere opening post of his thread "Do any atheists/agnostics want to believe?"

I started to do just the first part on reasoning blunders, but some time back Didymos Thomas (I think it was) mentioned wanting to hear more about the history of union. Because I think a lot of people are atheists or agnostic due to some of the foolishness of religion, I thought it might help to show how openness to the possibility of a conscious universe shouldn't be decided by what some religious do or believe.

I also felt that people don't look at the best evidence when it comes time to investigate the conscious universe idea. If experience is the basis of knowing (as we seem to have settled on for human epistemology), then why refer to the huge conceptual, unverified body of thought of religion for evidence?

The really serious investigators were experientialists, and I say that is where we should look to see if anything was really being discovered.[/SIZE]
Dichanthelium
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Feb, 2009 03:33 pm
@LWSleeth,
I'm curious about your interpretation of Jesus as a mystic. I'm aware of some passages in the gospels that are consistent with that, but I think most who follow some form of Christianity focus on Jesus as moralist, god-incarnation, or a cosmic sacrifice.

I think the gospel record implies that he was originally a disciple of John the Baptist, but by the time he was about 30 yrs old had developed his own perspective, which, although it was probably never inconsistent with John's, apparently took on a more profound character.
hammersklavier
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Feb, 2009 02:23 pm
@LWSleeth,
Thanks for your clarification. The way I think I see it you're saying that since what we think we know about the world we learn from sensing what is about is, and thus this faculty for sensitivity is what you're talking about; mastering it allows one to achieve communion with the Union...?
LWSleeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Feb, 2009 05:05 pm
@Dichanthelium,
[SIZE="4"]
Dichanthelium;49069 wrote:
I'm curious about your interpretation of Jesus as a mystic. I'm aware of some passages in the gospels that are consistent with that, but I think most who follow some form of Christianity focus on Jesus as moralist, god-incarnation, or a cosmic sacrifice.

I think the gospel record implies that he was originally a disciple of John the Baptist, but by the time he was about 30 yrs old had developed his own perspective, which, although it was probably never inconsistent with John's, apparently took on a more profound character.



Using the term "mystic" makes it more difficult to answer the question. I wish the term had never been applied because it conveys no understanding about what was going on with Jesus or anybody else supposedly within the "mystical" experience. So what I'll do is talk about what I think was going on with Jesus.

But first, although it's been speculated that Jesus and John the Baptist were linked (beyond being cousins), the more accepted view is that John was sort of a wandering prophet, but when Jesus returned to the area (from wherever he'd been - India?) John seemed to acknowledge Jesus was onto something John wasn't, even though Jesus humbled himself by requesting baptism.

You are correct, the religious interpretation has Jesus as a supernatural moralist, cosmic whatever.

If you've read what I wrote about "union experience" in Part 2 of this series, then you might understand I'm proposing what attracted people to not only Jesus, but all the great teachers like the Buddha, Mohammad, Nanak, Moses, etc., was that they were absorbed into full union.

This full condition is different from those who attain it periodically but are drawn back to a lesser condition by the activities of life. I understand it is hard to understand what union is if you have not had the experience (or known someone in the "full" experience), but the utter stillness of the mind, the depth of love felt, the ability to see a far bigger picture than anyone else tends to "mystify" people.

It also causes what I called "sense-mind translation." A perfect example is Jesus' use of the phrase "kingdom of heaven." Without union experience to guide one's understanding, our tendency is to translate everything Jesus says into something that relates to our typical external view of things, or to turn it into a principle for living life.

But to the experienced, the "kingdom of heaven" is very easy to understand. When one attains union, it gives one the perspective that one has joined a large mind, as if one mind has become part of the entire universe. When Jesus said, "I and my Father are One," he was referring the vast mind as the "Father," and saying he was one with that shows the depth and permanence of his union. We, as "children of God," have the same potential for conscious development awaiting us.

So the "kingdom of heaven" is well known in union experience, and anyone hearing it would instantly understand Jesus was talking about an experience, not a place. People so the same thing with the Buddha's term "nirvana," thinking it is a place rather than the exact experience that Jesus was describing.

Even the idea of Jesus or the Buddha being primarily a teacher of morality or a way of life is a sense-mind translation. All fully-merged individuals I've studied taught union to individuals willing to withdraw from normal life and submit to the teaching (as in the 72 following Jesus, or the Sangha of the Buddha).

If you practice union with the goal of permanently merging, your biggest enemy is the habits you acquired before you began practicing. The so-called morals and life prescriptions Jesus and the Buddha are known for are actually part of the method of staying closer, consciousness-wise, to how you must be to practice union. It is extremely hard to be wicked all day and then try to practice union.

Even if you accept that's what Jesus was doing when I spoke of being good, I still think most people wonder how Jesus could have been so good when it seems so hard for the rest of us. Once I was having a conversation about that with some Christians who were discussing how humanity could be so good as Jesus recommended (and seemed to be), and therefore if it was even possible to be a true Christian.

A couple of them gave the time-honored Christian answer that humanity is born into sin but Jesus, as the son of God, was born "perfect" and therefore only he could gracefully live the Christian ideal. I disagreed and said, "I think Jesus was having an experience where 'goodness' naturally results." They asked me to elaborate.

I said, "If, for instance, you didn't know there was such an experience as happiness, you'd wonder why someone who was happy smiled so much; and not knowing about happiness, to get a smile for yourself you might train your lips to turn upward or in some other way focus on facial expressions. But if you knew how to be happy you wouldn't focus on smiling, just on being happy. In the same way, what if there is an experience where goodness isn't the goal, but simply results from being within a certain conscious experience?"

Of course, they wanted to know what the experience was, and so like now, I tried to explain what it is like to experience union.
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0 Replies
 
LWSleeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Feb, 2009 05:16 pm
@hammersklavier,
[SIZE="4"]
hammersklavier;49338 wrote:
Thanks for your clarification. The way I think I see it you're saying that since what we think we know about the world we learn from sensing what is about is, and thus this faculty for sensitivity is what you're talking about; mastering it allows one to achieve communion with the Union...?
union.

I was also trying to say that since both aspects are types of sensitivity, making progress in union is actually done through an advanced use and development of our most foundational feeling nature (that is why I suggested it is a type of self evolution).[/SIZE]
hammersklavier
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Feb, 2009 06:55 am
@LWSleeth,
LWSleeth wrote:
union.

I was also trying to say that since both aspects are types of sensitivity, making progress in union is actually done through an advanced use and development of our most foundational feeling nature (that is why I suggested it is a type of self evolution).

Can you try to develop this argument in formal logic? I think one of your problems is that language is actually too weak for it. Don't forget, my friend, what you're proposing is somewhat radical in many circles and so what you're going to need is the clearest, best, most logical and cogent argument possible to articulate it... Smile
LWSleeth
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Feb, 2009 10:11 am
@hammersklavier,
hammersklavier;49479 wrote:
Can you try to develop this argument in formal logic? I think one of your problems is that language is actually too weak for it. Don't forget, my friend, what you're proposing is somewhat radical in many circles and so what you're going to need is the clearest, best, most logical and cogent argument possible to articulate it... Smile


I don't see how. The process has always been the same, turn your own attention around, withdraw from sense perception to feel the "heart" of your own consciousness, stay quietly with that until you attain union . . . experience and know, that's it.

To make any kind of logic out of it requires segmenting so it can be thought about; you know, if A and B then C, and so on.

But union is a ONENESS experience, not a segmented experience, so the instant you segment it for thought you've lost all potential for knowing it. That is why I have focused on how its practiced, who practiced it, and what practitioners report who are actually experiencing it.

It is impossible to understand without your own personal experience. I reserved my "formal logic" arguments for those who argue against the possibility of a conscious universe based on the beliefs and practices of religion, instead of studying the devoted inner practitioners who, rather than focusing on theorizing, focused on experiencing.
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