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Catholic church is deadly!

 
 
Reply Sun 2 Nov, 2003 07:32 pm
I couldn't believe what I was reading when I came across this:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/aids/story/0,7369,1059068,00.html?=rss

Vatican: condoms don't stop Aids

Steve Bradshaw
Thursday October 9, 2003
The Guardian

The Catholic Church is telling people in countries stricken by Aids not to use condoms because they have tiny holes in them through which HIV can pass - potentially exposing thousands of people to risk.
The church is making the claims across four continents despite a widespread scientific consensus that condoms are impermeable to HIV.

A senior Vatican spokesman backs the claims about permeable condoms, despite assurances by the World Health Organisation that they are untrue.

The church's claims are revealed in a BBC1 Panorama programme, Sex and the Holy City, to be broadcast on Sunday. The president of the Vatican's Pontifical Council for the Family, Cardinal Alfonso Lopez Trujillo, told the programme: "The Aids virus is roughly 450 times smaller than the spermatozoon. The spermatozoon can easily pass through the 'net' that is formed by the condom.

"These margins of uncertainty... should represent an obligation on the part of the health ministries and all these campaigns to act in the same way as they do with regard to cigarettes, which they state to be a danger."

The WHO has condemned the Vatican's views, saying: "These incorrect statements about condoms and HIV are dangerous when we are facing a global pandemic which has already killed more than 20 million people, and currently affects at least 42 million."

The organisation says "consistent and correct" condom use reduces the risk of HIV infection by 90%. There may be breakage or slippage of condoms - but not, the WHO says, holes through which the virus can pass .

Scientific research by a group including the US National Institutes of Health and the WHO found "intact condoms... are essentially impermeable to particles the size of STD pathogens including the smallest sexually transmitted virus... condoms provide a highly effective barrier to transmission of particles of similar size to those of the smallest STD viruses".

The Vatican's Cardinal Trujillo said: "They are wrong about that... this is an easily recognisable fact."

The church opposes any kind of contraception because it claims it breaks the link between sex and procreation - a position Pope John Paul II has fought to defend.

In Kenya - where an estimated 20% of people have HIV - the church condemns condoms for promoting promiscuity and repeats the claim about permeability. The archbishop of Nairobi, Raphael Ndingi Nzeki, said: "Aids... has grown so fast because of the availability of condoms."

Sex and the Holy City includes a Catholic nun advising her HIV-infected choirmaster against using condoms with his wife because "the virus can pass through".

In Lwak, near Lake Victoria, the director of an Aids testing centre says he cannot distribute condoms because of church opposition. Gordon Wambi told the programme: "Some priests have even been saying that condoms are laced with HIV/Aids."

Panorama found the claims about permeable condoms repeated by Catholics as far apart as Asia and Latin America.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 1,920 • Replies: 38
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JamesMorrison
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 12:37 am
phineasf


Let's see...

Water into wine, a couple of fish and 3 loafs of bread feeding hundreds of people, a woman with an abdominal tumor on day1 presents sans tumor on day2 after a visit from a cranky old Nun who won't let the Nuns of the order she established food shop a few days ahead of time even though the refrigerator has been invented (for her efforts the Old Nun in question receives the Noble Peace prize, perhaps it was because she saved those members of the same Order from the evil efficiencies of the electric dryer by banning its use), the Virgin Mary appearing on a pane of glass or as a stain on the bricks making up the wall of a Post Office. No meat on Friday...but wait it's the 20th century so, ...meat's OK!

The above is merely accepted church doctrine here; need I plumb the depths of pedophile harboring, Middle Age Papal polygamy, or the religious wars known as the Crusades?

By necessity the word from on high is always, I repeat, always interpreted by mere mortals.

Sad fact is that most of the population of the Catholic Church has no choice but to believe...

Remedy? Education, especially that including science and its methods of discovery. You see, an educated public is problematic to all authoritarian regimes.

Oh, just for balance, if you absolutely must get a Catholic School education for your kids let the Jesuits do it. If this sounds confusing google this: Cardinal Richelieu (the inventor of) Raison d'état

One could do worse. Hint: for this education somebody must pay, well...dearly.

JM
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Ceili
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 01:22 pm
It's shameful.
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dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 03:18 pm
Oh good grief!!!!
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phineasf
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 07:21 pm
JamesMorrison wrote:
phineasf

Sad fact is that most of the population of the Catholic Church has no choice but to believe...

Remedy? Education, ....

JM


Jim - are you ready to pack it in and head to Africa and some parts of southeast Asia, with me right now? We could start an educational tour, AND have you pick right back up with lead vocals!

Yes, DAMN sad - but it's actually very frightening. Catholicism is neck and neck with Islam in their quests for converts - each with well over a billion now, worldwide.

I don't understand this 'condom dogma' at all.
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 08:20 am
No surprise that. The Catholic church like most religions is still living in the middle ages. Next I expect them to proclaim that the earth is flat. Rolling Eyes
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gustavratzenhofer
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 08:23 am
I think this conversation is getting a little out of hand. Maybe you people could show me just a little respect.
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Diane
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 08:34 am
Hey Pope, I thought you were an enlightened type of pope. BTW, is it possible to get you to be the next pope for real? Would they take votes from a2k? We could even make banners and signs and picket the Vatican. Wanna do it?
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BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 08:55 am
Gus
Gus, I was wondering: What would happen if the College of Cardinals were unable to agree on a new pope and their disagreement went on and on, and no new pope was ever elected?

How should the we reward the indecisive bunch for failing to inflict a new pope of the world? Could we encourage them to keep arguing popeless for the next one hundred years? Or maybe the next one thousand?

Just think of it, if no new pope was elected, then no new cardinals could be appointed. As the old red caps die off, their numbers would shrink until there was no one left but the bishops.

Repeat the process with the bishops through the priests---right down to the alter boys.

WHOOEE!

BBB
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 09:50 am
Religion is deadly!
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 10:10 am
Quote:
I was wondering: What would happen if the College of Cardinals were unable to agree on a new pope and their disagreement went on and on, and no new pope was ever elected?

One of the Hohenzollerns solved this problem by cutting off food and water to the conclave. Voila! Instant Pope!
Very Happy
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 10:15 am
The answer is! More money for vouchers to get a religious education. Evil or Very Mad
0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 10:26 am
What's next?
OK, we've got the catholic church down to one alter boy who is not potty trained. Which religion do we take on next?


BBB
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hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 10:30 am
How about the crazy fundies? Anyone who thinks they are going to zip into the sky like a punctured baloon is missing a few important brain cells!
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BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 10:32 am
Hobit
Hobit, I don't know about that. We just finished the Albuquerque International Balloon festival and the sky was full of balloons. Do you think all of those gas bags were fundies in disquise---and on their way to heaven?

bbb
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Ceili
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 11:47 am
Who the hell are the fundies? Should I live in fear?
Ceili
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phineasf
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 12:56 pm
Ceili wrote:
Who the hell are the fundies? Should I live in fear?
Ceili


you know the fundies. they're the fundamentalists, like fundamentalist southern baptists, or Pat Robertson and his 700 club (Pat did recently sell his racehorses recently, to atone for his sins, and guarantee his seat in heaven, 3rd row, 2 seats from the right center), or evangelicals like the Pentecostals (you can tell them at the grocery store because they're always buying extra armpit deodeorant - ya know, waving their arms in the air and singing praises for an hour can make for one stinky church).

I think fundies are just Catholics that don't believe in virginity (or is it the virgin birth by Mary - hmmm?)
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phineasf
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 01:06 pm
Frank Apisa wrote:
Religion is deadly!


It sure was deadly for those 5 young children whose mother drowned them one by one in the bathtub, a year ago, in Texas. I think her schizophrenic reasoning for the killing spree was to save her children from the wrath of the devil or God, or some such crap.

How's the golf game coming Frank? :-)
0 Replies
 
Ceili
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 01:10 pm
Oh, I like it, I thought we were talking about a new sect, like the moonies or something. I'd never heard the term fundies.
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phineasf
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Nov, 2003 01:11 pm
Re: What's next?
BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:
Which religion do we take on next?
BBB



LOL - Bee, I've got a few bones to pick with a few Islamic Imams. On second thought though, maybe I shouldn't, after recalling that the STATE is the CHURCH and the CHURCH is the STATE, according to that religion. Yeah, maybe that type of system will work out well. Why didn't we think of that here in the USA?
0 Replies
 
 

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