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Why Did Roman Polanski Run Away?

 
 
Robert Gentel
 
  4  
Reply Sun 11 Oct, 2009 06:51 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
if you can evade the law long enough that justice is not longer possible then you should be free. This is not a strange idea, this is what the statutes of limitations are all about.


No it isn't. This evasion is a separate crime, the law is simply not on your side at all and the statue of limitations do not apply to this case.

Quote:
It is our fault that we did not catch up with Polanski before now, we failed justice. But he should not take the fall for our collective failure


What? It's our fault that he fled his sentencing? That is ridiculous.

Quote:
we have already shown that our sex law punishment is outrageous by European standards...you have no legs to stand on here


Who is "we"? You certainly have done nothing of the sort. The punishments he would face for this crime in Europe are similar to California law. You have no idea what you are babbling about.
roger
 
  4  
Reply Sun 11 Oct, 2009 06:53 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:


if you can evade the law long enough that justice is not longer possible then you should be free. This is not a strange idea, this is what the statutes of limitations are all about. It is our fault that we did not catch up with Polanski before now, we failed justice. But he should not take the fall for our collective failure


No, statutes of limitations are for those who haven't been charged with a crime. But wait, I think I'm repeating myself.
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Sun 11 Oct, 2009 07:06 pm

It is very, very well established law
that statutes of limitations do not run
while the defendant has fled the jurisdiction.

In order to get the benefit of a statute of limitations,
a defendant must be able to show that he was present
in the jurisdiction within the designated period of the statute
without having been served with judicial process,
or being criminally arrested.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 11 Oct, 2009 08:14 pm
@roger,
Quote:
No, statutes of limitations are for those who haven't been charged with a crime. But wait, I think I'm repeating myself


we have established that the statues of limitations laws do not apply. I am however saying that the theory is transportable to this case. We have over the years greatly weakened statutes of limitations because our vengeance knows little moderation. Both the weakening if the laws, as well as the failure to apply these principles of justice to this case, cheapen us.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Oct, 2009 10:39 pm
@Robert Gentel,
Quote:
The punishments he would face for this crime in Europe are similar to California law


You keep running your mouth but you have no evidence to support your claim. I do.

Quote:
Key figures in the largest child abuse trial ever held in France were sentenced to up to 28 years in jail yesterday after a jury convicted them of raping, molesting and prostituting children, including their own.

The court found that between January 1999 and February 2002, the 65 defendants had sexually abused 45 children, then aged from six months to 14 years, sometimes in exchange for cash, drink, cartons of cigarettes or, on one occasion, a car tyre.

After a five-month trial, the jury sent three repeat offenders to prison for between 26 and 28 years. Other suspects were handed sentences ranging from six months suspended, to 18 years in jail.

The offences took place in flats, sheds and allotments on a rundown housing estate in the Loire town of Angers, 165 miles from Paris, better known for its medieval chateau.

The abuse came to light five years ago when a 16-year-old girl told a social worker she had been raped by her mother's boyfriend and his brother.

The inquiry started slowly but snowballed into France's biggest criminal investigation.

More than half the defendants, 39 men and 26 women aged from 27 to 73 - who cannot be fully identified under a French law designed to preserve the anonymity of child victims - are unemployed.

The case has been described by lawyers and social workers involved as a barely imaginable example of the breakdown of all social, moral and human values in a closed and deprived community.

A 28-year prison term was given to Philippe V, 59, who had already served a 13-year term for child abuse and was described by prosecutors as an "indifferent monster" who had, over the years, raped his daughter, son and four grandchildren. He told the court that he "couldn't give a toss" about his offspring.

Eric J, an alleged ringleader, was convicted of raping 15 children and also given 28 years.

The majority of the abuse sessions took place in the apartment of Franck and Patricia V, Philippe V's son and former daughter-in-law, with whom he was living.

Franck V, 36, was sentenced to 18 years for the rape of 14 children, including his own two daughters and young son.

Patricia, 32, his now ex-wife, was found guilty of raping one of her daughters and of prostituting her other two children, and was given 16 years.

During his summing up, the chief prosecutor, Yvan Auriel, said that the couple were among "those people who must unfortunately be removed for a long period of time from our society in order that they become fully aware of the horror of their acts".

Investigators said the couple, aided by Franck V's father, persuaded their own children and those of friends, relatives and neighbours to submit to the abuse by saying they were going to "play doctors and nurses" or "the lock and key game", and offering them a "first prize" of a camping trip.

The case revealed stories of incest and rape going back several generations. More than a dozen of the defendants had suffered sexual abuse themselves as children.

Many are also illiterate, and at the trial appeared not to grasp the gravity of the offences. Asked at one stage what she considered her greatest failings as a mother, Patricia V said: "I'm not great at cleaning, and I smoke. I can't think of anything else."

The victims, 26 girls and 19 boys, now in care or living with foster parents, had simply been "demolished", lawyers said. Some barely speak, or scream when approached by strangers; one girl was forced to perform oral sex so often that she cannot eat in the company of adults.

Another, identified only as Marine, was raped by 45 people including her father.

Residents of Angers said yesterday that they were simply relieved the trial was over. "Nobody sane can identify with what's been said, with what we've heard since March," a woman told French radio. "You can't imagine you're talking about human beings."

http://www.buzzle.com/editorials/7-27-2005-73796.asp

2005 in France, no sex criminal registry, the guilty can not be named, and look at those jail terms!!!In America we would be crying for the death penalty, never mind ever getting out of jail.

Being a bully and mocking your opposition only works in some settings, here at a2k one is expected to show up with some actual evidence.
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Oct, 2009 11:22 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
The punishments he would face for this crime in Europe are similar to California law


You keep running your mouth but you have no evidence to support your claim. I do.

As is pretty much always the case; Shorteyes has no clue what he’s talking about:

Francis wrote:

Unlawful sexual intercourse

In France the law stipulates a maximum of 15 years in jail for a rape on a minor.

The judges have all latitude to adapt the penalty to the case and the average sentencing is 6 years in jail.

Meanwhile, California appears to break up the elements of the crime… but overall appears to be rather lenient by comparison… except when an offender’s crime meets a lot of demented criteria.

How Robert remains patient enough to pretend this troll is anything but a demented piece of garbage who knows virtually nothing of what he laughably thinks he speaks for more than just himself about, I have no idea.
hawkeye10 wrote:
Being a bully and mocking your opposition only works in some settings, here at a2k one is expected to show up with some actual evidence.
And being a demented idiot works pretty much the same in every setting... only when you're allowed to be a demented idiot, while cowering behind a fake name and a phony avatar, you get your ass kicked less.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 12:18 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Sex law in France is a new idea, they did not do it till relatively recently.


Depends on what you call "new": the French penal code is from 1791...
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 12:32 am
@engineer,
engineer wrote:

The typical US age of consent in 1880 was 10. All sorts of age of consent laws have been considered all over the world. That doesn't mean they were implemented and it doesn't mean the French are any different than the rest of Europe or the US. The French were among the first countries to codify an age of consent in their legal code and as it spread around Europe, so did age of consent laws. When European countries increased the age of consent in the 19th century, the US did not follow suit. I don't know why you consider the US as a paragon of child safety. History doesn't back this up.



Well, in France there have various reginal/local "laws" in the Middle Ages 'regulating' such.
These local/regional laws were combined for the very first by the Code pénal in national law.

In Germany, the numerous (independent) countries and cities has laws on that as well, as had the Preussische Landrecht (1794) for the Prussian countries or the Sachsenspiegel from around the 12th century.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 05:03 am
@OCCOM BILL,
Bill can you offer any support for that assertion?
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Try googling the subject it is all there every little detail is there for anyone who can read.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 05:06 am
@Francis,
Just check out my post about the penalties incurred for "unlawful sexual intercourse".

Just apply those penalties.
-----------------------------------------------
No need to apply those penalties as the plea deal was never approve by the judge and he was not found guilty or sentence for any crime at all he is facing charges that carry far more prison time.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  3  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 05:15 am
@hawkeye10,
I think that one of the reasons this is highly emotionally charged is that all of us realize on some level that the age of consent laws are built upon sand. The arguments supporting setting the age as high as America does are very weak, and the laws ignore the factual reality of teen sexuality. Those like bill who support such laws become emotionally unhinged when the laws are challanged in part because they know as well as they rest of us do that they don't have much of an argument
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hmm so having sex with a 13 year old girl by a 40 plus year old man should not be against the law?

Side note Polanski rape this girl in the old fashion way accounting to the victim by force so even removing the age of consent would not help him greatly.

And how about a 10 year old or a 5 year old Hawkeye10?

Every time I read your nonsense the word pedophile keep jumping into my mind for some strange reason.


0 Replies
 
Francis
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 05:24 am
BillRM wrote:
he is facing charges that carry far more prison time.

That's why I fear that case is already judged by people whose knowledge of justice is close to zero.
Are you pro-death penalty?
BillRM
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 05:55 am
@Francis,
That's why I fear that case is already judged by people whose knowledge of justice is close to zero.
Are you pro-death penalty?
-------------------------------------------------------
What support do you offer to your claim that your knowledge of American law is great then mine or that mine is near zero for that matter<grin>?

Or are you just claiming that you are far more moral then me in some strange manner?

LOL do you mean do I think that say a man who kill a 6 year old by burying her alive should be put to death or someone who had taken part in killing a few hundred fellow citizens including children by blowing up a government building?

YES.............I am barbarian enough to think that someone who had done such deeds should be put down like we put down a mad dog.

Francis
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 06:33 am
@BillRM,
No, I'm saying that a nation is better of if governed by barbers and taxi drivers...
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 06:50 am

For quite a few years I have supported the death penalty.
I cheered when we fried the Rosenbergs in 1953.

Upon re-consideration -- I 'm not sure that life in prison
is not a more severe sentence. By killing him, u rescue him
from the sentence of life in prison -- many years -- before he dies.

No matter WHAT, he 's gonna die anyway.


I don 't mean to suggest that this guy shoud be killed.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 06:53 am
@Francis,
Francis wrote:

That's why I fear that case is already judged by people whose knowledge of justice is close to zero.
Are you pro-death penalty?

But this just comes down to one judge. No jury since the case is settled, just sentencing. I posted a case earlier in the thread where someone got one year. Why do you think a judge would do something dramatically different?
BillRM
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:16 am
@Francis,

No, I'm saying that a nation is better of if governed by barbers and taxi drivers...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Europeans seem never to learn from their own history if would seem.

So you are far more moral and have far more right to have your voice hear by government then a man who earn his living by driving a cab by your own judgment?

Sorry but I do not see that as following and Americans as a whole does not see that as following and looking at the sad sad history of Europe compare to the US you would have a hard road to travel to convince us that a self appointed elite is a better way of governing a country.

So good old Prince Charles for example has a higher IQ then his driver? I would not bet a large sum on that being true or even that he had a better understanding of the world or economic or whatever other subject you might bring up.

Knowledge and education is no longer tie so tightly into class and IQ never had any real connection with class.

Europe class driven to this day how sad for your society.


0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:26 am
@engineer,
But this just comes down to one judge. No jury since the case is settled, just sentencing. I posted a case earlier in the thread where someone got one year. Why do you think a judge would do something dramatically different?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why do you not google the subject and learn the facts ? The case is not settle in any manner the plea deal was never approve by the judge and the whole manner is wide open and had been since the man ran.
engineer
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:57 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Why do you not google the subject and learn the facts ? The case is not settle in any manner the plea deal was never approve by the judge and the whole manner is wide open and had been since the man ran.

I did and it seems like everything was accepted with certain expectations on the sentence. The judge was not bound by those expectations. What is your interpretation? Do you expect this to go before a jury for some reason?
Robert Gentel
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 09:08 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
You keep running your mouth but you have no evidence to support your claim. I do.


Nonsense. Your "evidence" is not even for the same crime.

Quote:
2005 in France, no sex criminal registry, the guilty can not be named, and look at those jail terms!!!In America we would be crying for the death penalty, never mind ever getting out of jail.


The crime Polanski plead guilty to is sentenced just as harshly in France as in California. You don't have a shred of evidence to support the notion that our sentencing would be "unreasonable" by European standards, so you are fishing for other irrelevant cases.

Quote:
Being a bully and mocking your opposition only works in some settings, here at a2k one is expected to show up with some actual evidence.


Then put up the evidence, stop fishing for irrelevant things you can try to portray as evidence.
0 Replies
 
 

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