All Europeans are vegetarian, right?

EU has come up with many laws which are hypocritical.
I don´t know if these laws have changed but they were there not so long ago.
If a Dane wants to buy local food he would buy Danish chickens. A German would buy German chickens.
The thing is/was (?) that chickens are not citizens of the country they were born and grew up in , but in the country they got slaughtered. So chickens are exported over the border, slaughtered and then sold as native chickens.
Then we have/had(?) the subventions for cattles. The Germans or whoever ships off a truckload of cattle to GB and get subvention for them. The British made the cattles English as fast as possible and send a truckload with these now British cows off to France - of course getting a nice subvention.
By the time the British cattles arrive in France they are rather sick and tired of travelling back packed in a truck, so making them French goes fast again with the subvention and off they go to Spain or Italy.
By the time they arrive there they are dead tired of the whole circus and fall down dead. So Italy or Spain get help for the dead cattle.

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@saab,

saab wrote:

The reason why the hunting has been forbidden has nothing to do with the meat.
Seal babies are hunted for their fur and the fur is pulled off the live seals.
It is cruelty............You don´t know anything about the problem but make a big thing about it and even make fun of cruelty to animals. ............

More amazing yet, the ignorance persists even after the detailed explanations by persons in possession of the facts. An additional (minor) fact not mentioned here so far is the French-Canadian spat over the continental shelf:

http://media.economist.com/images/20090509/CAM955.gif

Quote:

The 6,000 residents of this last remnant of the French empire in North America hope the future lies with offshore oil and gas, which has enriched its neighbour, Newfoundland. Pressed by the islanders, the French government plans to file a claim to an area of the extended continental shelf south of the archipelago to a United Nations body which has been set up to administer claims to the seabed around the world.

1 Reply

@High Seas,

Then Danes and the Canadians are also "fighting" about Hans Island - there could be oil and gas.
Hans Island (Greenlandic/Inuktitut: Tartupaluk; Danish: Hans Ø; French: Île Hans) is a small, uninhabited barren knoll measuring 1.3 km² (0.5 sq mi), located in the centre of the Kennedy Channel of Nares Strait"the strait that separates Ellesmere Island from northern Greenland and connects Baffin Bay with the Lincoln Sea. Hans Island is the smallest of three islands located in Kennedy Channel; the others are Franklin Island and Crozier Island.

The island is claimed by both Canada and Denmark.

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@saab,

Russia is with the EU on the baby seals (the vote in the European Parliament was 550 in favor, only 49 against - do you know their nationalities, btw, Saab?) but Norway is against.

Quote:

In the White Sea area, the hunting of baby seals has been strongly critizised. Earlier this winter Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin called the hunting of baby seals "a bloody industry."

But still the baby cows don't get dragged away from their mothers, bashed over the head until they stop moving, then skinned alive while the mother is watching. So the title of this thread is really irrelevant, or even misleading, because nobody eats seals and many people do eat steak.

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@High Seas,

I can´t find out who voted yes or no.
According to some European newapapers Canada does not tell the truth about hunting babyseals.
Russia has forbidden hunting of babyseals.
Norway is not in EU and is interested in seal hunting but not in hunting baby seals.
Sweden is for hunting grown seals in a limited amount in Sweden to protect the fisher and the fishing
The Social Democrats in Denmark are against seal hunting (babies? and or grown ups?) but they are for halal slaughtering.

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@saab,

The Canadian parliementarians voting in response to the EU ban were widely ridiculed in the western Canadian provinces, especially due to their anxiety with bad publicity during forthcoming Olympic games in Vancouver - and no baby seals, unlike the eastern Canadian provinces. But not even those parliamentarians managed to reach quite the depths of ridicule as the dimwitted poster who, incapable of coherent argument, marks posts down - as if anyone cares.

How do you mean, though, that Canada is "not telling the truth"? Many pelts sold in Europe marked "Greenland" were found to have originated in Canada, but that may just be mislabelling by the exporters, not the government itself.

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So, I don't know enough, which is my own fault - I'll just say I'm following the thread, though I don't do my homework by following every link, which, of course, I should. (Gimme a sammich). This has to do with my own laziness. But I may surprise you and read them all.
I'm glad for input from differing people analyzing all this.

1 Reply

@ossobuco,

I'll add, I don't get the marking up and down, that happens in practice. All that doesn't make sense if you look at the early how to a2k clues.

One is not supposed to mark up and down on opinion -

but if someone comes up with some actual wit (urm, rare), or especially well spokenness. Alternately, thumbs down at ad hominems and more.

It is the clarity of explication of opinion that is useful, and should be rewarded, even if you disagree.
Not that I'm good at opinion explicating..

Slamming those with different opinion because they are different is very junior high.

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Look, obviously humour and sarcasm didn't work. The entire reason behind my post was to ask a serious question.
I'll preface it by saying. I don't hunt. I don't wear fur. I don't think animal cruelty is funny, fair or really a something a decent society should stand for. Many of the people stating opinion for fact, ie. clubbing and skinning live seal pups should really read more info. While this was, at one time common practice it is now, and has been illegal in Canada for a very long time.
Now, my point from the beginning was... why is it ok for the European Union to penalize the practices of one country or industry without first taking the same steps to remove such practices from it's own back yard. I've given several examples of ironic situations such as veal, foie gras, bottom scraping trawlers, I'll add one more, bull fighting and then there's the herding of dolphins into shallow bays in the farrow island where they are shot and skinned in one fell swoop. Horrible zoos, Blood Diamonds and dancing bears and I'm sure there are many other things I could point to.
Doesn't any one else see the hypocrisy?
I have the same feeling about the US in Iraq. How noble of them to have brought war in order to pursue democracy. Why does every one else push their morals on everybody else without leading by example?
Why is it all right for the European Union to decide it's pro Native hunting but opposed to white guys making a living?
I don't understand the motives? the puritanical, I'm right and you're wrong attitude.
If one of you can explain this to me, I'd love to hear it justified.

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@Ceili,

I wish I could give you good reason for EU to come up with laws which are hypocritical - I cant.
On the other hand I am against much what EU does, they try to come up with laws for all of Europe without thinking about how different we are within the Union.
I am not stating an opinion about if Canada clubs and skin live seal pups - I have tried to get the information by reading European newspapers. They as a rule state that Canada is still doing so and even lying about the fact and say they don´t.
When we get the wrong information from the media - which happens all the time - we have opinions based on what the media wants us to believe.
Why is it pro Native hunting and opposed to white guys making a living.
It is PC. Any minority has rights to protect them.If the majority is in any way against this they cannot win. There are many examples of this.
It is good in that sence that there should be space for all of us, but when it goes so far that the minority wins over the majority something is wrong.
It has nothing to do with being puritanical but as I said Political Correct.
Farmers are are subsidized - reindeer keepers are not - they are not farmers as they have no stable for their reihdeers. They are living of a heard of cattles too but that does not count.
EU as such does not even have laws against forced marriages - some individual countries do.

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@Ceili,

Ceili wrote:

Now, my point from the beginning was... why is it ok for the European Union to penalize the practices of one country or industry without first taking the same steps to remove such practices from it's own back yard. I've given several examples of ironic situations such as veal, foie gras, bottom scraping trawlers, I'll add one more, bull fighting and then there's the herding of dolphins into shallow bays in the farrow island where they are shot and skinned in one fell swoop. Horrible zoos, Blood Diamonds and dancing bears and I'm sure there are many other things I could point to.
Doesn't any one else see the hypocrisy?

saab wrote:

On the other hand I am against much what EU does, they try to come up with laws for all of Europe without thinking about how different we are within the Union.

I suppose that any law anywhere is ... kind of discriminating someone, some group.
We've quite a different (cultural) diversity in Germany as well - thus, some state laws differ from one part of Germany to the other.
But federal law is the same for all of us ...
National laws in the EU differ as well - but there are some (stupid) EU-laws for all of us.

This law about seals might become national law or not.
But it's most certainly a very populist law.

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@ossobuco,

Please don't worry about the insane, non-posting stalkers (probably a pleonasm, just plain "stalker" should suffice), not worth anybody's time.

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@Ceili,

Ceili wrote:

Look, obviously humour and sarcasm didn't work.

Gross misrepresentation might be construed as humor or sarcasm - please btw let us know if you plan any humorous remarks about lampshades made with human skin, and other such funny topics, same as torturing animals, or even just plain killing them unless they are to be eaten.

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@High Seas,

Grow up.

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Speaking of gross misrepresentation, people here, and in the media in Europe are going on and on about killing baby seals. The harp seals and hooded seals who are taken are not "babies." They are usually 25 days old or older before they are hunted. Nevertheless, the pressure groups and the animal rights lunatic fringe still makes a loud noise about baby seals being killed. The Canadian Veterinary Journal reported for 2002 that 98% of the animals it examined had been humanely killed, and were not "skinned alive" as the pressure groups claim. The Royal Commission on Seals and Sealing in Canada found that methods were "at least as humane as killing methods in commercial slaughterhouses." The Canadian Department of Fisheries and Oceans states that it has never claimed that the seals are a danger to the recovery of cod stocks, and that this is a strawman set up by opponents of the seal hunt.

Click here to read the FAQ at CBC on the Atlantic seal hunt.

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@Setanta,

The Economist's euro-expert blogger agrees with you:
http://www.economist.com/blogs/charlemagne/2009/05/hunting_cuddly_baby_seals_euro.cfm

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@High Seas,

The Encyclopedia Brittanica supports the baby seals, however:

Quote:

the eastern coast of Newfoundland and Labrador turn bloody, as some 300,000 harp seal pups, virtually all between 2 and 12 weeks old, are beaten to death"their skulls crushed with a heavy club called a hakapik"or shot. They are then skinned on the ice or in nearby hunting vessels after being dragged to the ships with boat hooks. The skinned carcasses are usually left on the ice or tossed in the ocean.

Thousands of other wounded pups (estimates range from 15,000 to 150,000 per year) manage to escape the hunters but die later of their injuries or drown after falling off the ice (pups younger than about 5 weeks cannot swim).

http://advocacy.britannica.com/blog/advocacy/2007/04/the-canadian-seal-hunt/

Caution: horrific pictures at above weblink.

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Governor General eats seal's heart

Quote:

Tuesday May 26,2009

Canada's governor general ate a slaughtered seal's raw heart in a show of support to the country's seal hunters - a display that a European Unionspokeswoman has called "too bizarre to acknowledge."

Governor General Michaelle Jean, the representative of the Queen as Canada's head of state, gutted the seal and swallowed a slice of the mammal's organ.

Asked if her actions were a message to the EU, which this month voted to impose a ban on seal products on grounds of cruelty, Jean replied: "Take from that what you will."

Hundreds of Inuit at a community festival gathered on Monday night as Jean knelt above a pair of seal carcasses and used a traditional ulu blade to slice the meat off the skin.

After cutting through the flesh, Jean turned to the woman beside her and asked: "Could I try the heart?"

She swallowed a piece whole and deemed it tasty, saying: "It's like sushi. And it's very rich in protein."

... ... ...

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@Walter Hinteler,

Great, fantastic, and magnificent - thank you, Walter. I myself have, by way of reference, eaten eyeballs of sheep while working in Saudi Arabia and being seated to the right of the host (senior member of the royal family) at dinner (after being declared an honorary man, as their local custom requires) and I want to tell you that disgusting and horrendous as the poor sheep's eyes were, at least I KNEW the poor animal had been killed in the most humane manner possible, by cutting off its carotid arteries with extremely sharp knives on both sides - n0 anatomy expertise required here to tell you that procedure is fairly instantaneous, since our own carotid arteries lie in the same location.

So THEREFORE I question your motives (your expertise and/or your search capabilities never having been in question) in CONFLATING the above with ANYTHING relating to torture of newborn animals or of ANY other animals as UNQUESTIONABLY happens in the Arctic.

I know there are questions about Guantanamo torture of human prisoners but I don't worry about everything in the universe - only what I want and can change massively FOR THE BETTER. Tschuess.

PS you know my family, so you never will wonder why we believe (better late than never) that the biggest caliber guns should be used immediately upon commencement of any hostile action Smile

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@Walter Hinteler,

Walter Hinteler wrote:

Canada's governor general ate a slaughtered seal's raw heart..............

In case nobody here knows who this "governor general" IS, she's a Haitian immigrant born in a family where they habitually tore up chickens from limb to limb by brute force while the birds were still alive. And, naturally, ate them raw, since there was no firewood left in Haiti - they just cut trees down, never replant anything, as is the primitive African manner - in order make a fire to cook the bits of the tortured bird - unless Walter, our local presumed Haitian-quasi-Canadian (misrule Brittania?) VOODOO expert, is of another opinion.

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All Europeans are vegetarian, right?

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