Michelle single handedly destroys British/American alliance.

What I want to know is why there has been SO MUCH attention on what Michelle Obama and Sarah Brown have been wearing this last week. It's been absolutely ridiculous, at least a 2 page spread in each paper on weds, and more in the weekend papers.

What made me really cross was whilst the men were busy making plans to save the world economy on weds, their wives met each other, exchanged gifts of bracelets and childrens books, then went to some place to put MAKE-UP on cancer patients. What the ****? So much for challenging conservative gender roles. I'd have ******* refused, it's a ******* insult. They might as well have put aprons on, cleaned parliament a bit and cooked the men their ******* dinner.

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@The Pentacle Queen,

Come on now! Don't you think Bill would have done the same thing?

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@The Pentacle Queen,

The Pentacle Queen wrote:

What made me really cross was whilst the men were busy making plans to save the world economy on weds, their wives met each other, exchanged gifts of bracelets and childrens books, then went to some place to put MAKE-UP on cancer patients. What the ****? So much for challenging conservative gender roles. I'd have ******* refused, it's a ******* insult. They might as well have put aprons on, cleaned parliament a bit and cooked the men their ******* dinner.

Why so upset? Read this:

Obama, née Robinson, was born and grew up on the South Side of Chicago and graduated from Princeton University and Harvard Law School. After completing her formal education, she returned to Chicago and accepted a position with the law firm Sidley Austin, where she met her future husband. Subsequently, she worked as part of the staff of Chicago mayor Richard M. Daley, and for the University of Chicago Medical Center. Throughout 2007 and 2008, she helped campaign for her husband's presidential bid and delivered a keynote address at the 2008 Democratic National Convention.

~~~~
She's not an idiot and she's not exactly conforming to "gender roles". She's an intelligent, educated, forward-thinking person. These women were not the ones discussing what they were wearing - that's the press. What's wrong with an exchange of gifts? What's wrong with children's books? What's wrong with helping make cancer patients feel better?

Simmer down.

1 Reply

@Mame,

I know, it was the press that made me angry, not the women themselves.
Apparently the only thing that can be reported about women is what they're wearing.

I don't see anything wrong with children's books, since that would be a kind of reverse sexism, but putting make up on cancer patients? Come on, it fits into the presumption that women and image go hand in hand all to easily.

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@The Pentacle Queen,

Quote:

I don't see anything wrong with children's books, since that would be a kind of reverse sexism, but putting make up on cancer patients? Come on, it fits into the presumption that women and image go hand in hand all to easily.

You are not making any sense Queen... there are both male and female cancer patients.

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@The Pentacle Queen,

A lot of cancer patients try hard to feel 'normal'; prettiness for women can really matter. I am sure that in many cases, getting a makeup treatment would be a boost.

1 Reply

@The Pentacle Queen,

The Pentacle Queen wrote:

their wives

In this particular case, the woman you refer to are not elected officials, they are spouses/companions/wives. There is no reason they should have any active role in what happened at the meetings. In fact, there would have likely been horrid negative media if there had been any sense that the women referred to were influencing the decisions being made.

If you're interested in challenging gender roles, run for elected office yourself.

As we said in the 90's, walk the talk.

1 Reply

@The Pentacle Queen,

Quote:

What I want to know is why there has been SO MUCH attention on what Michelle Obama and Sarah Brown have been wearing this last week. It's been absolutely ridiculous, at least a 2 page spread in each paper on weds, and more in the weekend papers.

What made me really cross was whilst the men were busy making plans to save the world economy on weds, their wives met each other, exchanged gifts of bracelets and childrens books, then went to some place to put MAKE-UP on cancer patients. What the ****? So much for challenging conservative gender roles. I'd have ******* refused, it's a ******* insult. They might as well have put aprons on, cleaned parliament a bit and cooked the men their ******* dinner.

I had the exact same reaction when I read that. In fact I was sitting with a friend as we were reading our separate papers and I showed him the article and said, 'If I were Michelle Obama and they asked me who designed my dress - I'd have said-'******* google it yourself if that's what's so interesting to you.' Unfortunately - I'm sure she knew she just had to smile patiently- and so she probably did.

I did like the article about Sarah Brown though - I can't remember if it was in the Times or the Independent in which they talked about her personal strength of character.
Of course then they had to ruin it all on the next page when they talked about her navy blue dress designed by whoever and Michelle O'Bama's sporty sequined cardy and mini skirt in lime green by J. Crew. Was it too CASUAL? Does she not take any or all of this stuff SERIOUSLY enough?

How ridiculous!

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@aidan,

I don't get who you ladies are angry at...

1) The newspapers? They are profit-making businesses. They print the news that their readers what to read. You can't blame them for writing what sells papers (see #2).

2) Newspaper readers? Well that is funny-- the target audience for these articles are women. I promise you that men don't know or care what Michelle is wearing.

3) Michelle herself? Are you saying that in the interest of empowering women we should forbid them from baking cookies?

4) Barack himself? Do you see him as forcing Michelle to do womanly things (rather than Michelle herself choosing to be womanly). I see no evidence that this is the case.

Who is the villain here?

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@aidan,

Quote:

I had the exact same reaction when I read that. In fact I was sitting with a friend as we were reading our separate papers and I showed him the article and said, 'If I were Michelle Obama and they asked me who designed my dress - I'd have said-'******* google it yourself if that's what's so interesting to you.' Unfortunately - I'm sure she knew she just had to smile patiently- and so she probably did.

I did like the article about Sarah Brown though - I can't remember if it was in the Times or the Independent in which they talked about her personal strength of character.
Of course then they had to ruin it all on the next page when they talked about her navy blue dress designed by whoever and Michelle O'Bama's sporty sequined cardy and mini skirt in lime green by J. Crew. Was it too CASUAL? Does she not take any or all of this stuff SERIOUSLY enough?

How ridiculous!

Thank you.

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@ebrown p,

I'm not angry at anyone - actually only pretty sadly resigned- that's just the way it is - you know?

If she were ugly and not stylish - they'd have done a two page spread on her facial and figure flaws and fashion gaffs.

I guess it's telling of society in general. That's why I'm happy to hear that it pisses PQ off. Maybe that's a sign that women her age are tired of it and we as a society can then get past and around such immaterial surface trivia, in general, as it refers to and reflects upon the mindset and interests of men and women, and not only as it refers to and affects women.

You should read that article about Sarah Brown though. It was lovely - really balanced and talked about her as a PERSON - not as a wife, not as a professional of any sort - but as a good, strong person. I thought it was pretty much one of a kind in terms of what is written about a public figure outside of an eventual obituary.
Or if it's not - I haven't read many like it in a newspaper - and I read a lot of newspapers.

1 Reply

@ebrown p,

Quote:

Michelle herself? Are you saying that in the interest of empowering women we should forbid them from baking cookies?

No that is not what I'm saying at all, which is what I meant when I said that I didn't oppose them giving each other childrens books. If I suggest they should give each other gifts not related to children it suggests that I think being a mother is a 'weakened position.' Which is a sexism.

Yes well my speech wasn't particularly articulate.
There's no 'villain.' I just thought the situation was ridiculous in general, as aidan said, which prompted the swearing.
I'm sorry but i don't really support the whole cancer patient thing. It was too easily spun into a nice 'girls day out' themed story. The Evening Standard loved it.

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@aidan,

Quote:

I guess it's telling of society in general. That's why I'm happy to hear that it pisses PQ off. Maybe that's a sign that women her age are tired of it and we as a society can then get past and around such immaterial surface trivia, in general, as it refers to and reflects upon the mindset and interests of men and women, and not only as it refers to and affects women.

I doubt it. Unfortunately.

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@ehBeth,

Quote:

If you're interested in challenging gender roles, run for elected office yourself.

As we said in the 90's, walk the talk.

I think the only way to 'challenge' gender roles is to pretend they don't exist, is that what you're getting at?
It's like that joke: having 'womans day' only confirms that the remaining 364 in the year are for men.

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@ossobuco,

Quote:

A lot of cancer patients try hard to feel 'normal'; prettiness for women can really matter. I am sure that in many cases, getting a makeup treatment would be a boost.

Would getting a make-over by Michelle Obama make you feel normal Osso?

1 Reply

@The Pentacle Queen,

I am sorry Queen... this women as victims thing wears awfully thin, especially after the whining during last years primary. Quite often, it is women who benefit from gender roles, and more often then not it is women who propagate them.

You started complaining about the focus on fashion. I will ask again... why is there such a focus on Michelle's fashion? Men don't give a crap and men aren't the one's who are driving or consuming the media obsession. If this is sexism, it is sexism by women for women.

The irony is that target of your attack is Michelle who happens to be a successful and strong woman who widely regarded for her intelligence in the very media who you complain for praising for her fashion sense (as if a woman can't be both fashionable and intelligent at the same time).

To answer the question: I would feel damn special to get a visit in the hospital from Michelle Obama-- I very much doubt the cancer patients in question feel like the victims you paint them as.

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The good news is that the U.S.A. just has a First Lady and no Queen. Can we leave it at that?

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@The Pentacle Queen,

Well, I've had cancer and have felt the pleasure of people being nice to me then... and it did help my sense of well being. I might have gotten a kick out of getting my nails done, or, since I still had hair, a good hair cut. Makeup hasn't been very interesting to me since I was in my twenties, and barely so then.

Many women do feel sort of out of it, blankfaced, without makeup.. I can easily see some pals really appreciating it if this were their situation and they were feeling low. Plus the visitors in the news are interesting women - unless I were busy throwing up, etc., I figure I'd have enjoyed seeing them if it were me they were visiting.

On fashion, I'm not so much interested in fashion and its changing sets of rules -
more in personal style. I do like the design fields in general. Some aspects of design, all kinds of design, are of more interest to me than others, but I can still be amused by the trivial.

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@The Pentacle Queen,

Not "pretend they don't exist", but to ignore them. Many "male" jobs today are held by women, and many women are accepted in those positions by the men. Things HAVE changed over the past 20 or 30 years, so don't knock the progress, however small you think it is. Rome wasn't built in a day. And yes, some women are not helping the "cause", as it were, but at least it's a lot different than it was. Even 20 years ago, I got pinched and ogled at geology conferences. If it happens today, I haven't noticed (of course, my advanced years may have something to do with that). That's one sign that we have progressed, however small you may think it is.''

Regarding make up on cancer patients, what did you want Michelle et al to do - change the oil in their cars? They're in the hospital and they're suffering. Any attention is good attention. And what's wrong with a 'girly' afternoon, anyway? Michelle IS a female, after all. She's done enough public speaking since Barack started campaigning for you to know that she's not Ms. Prissy-prissy-frou-frou.

And a last point, the press didn't "make you mad" - you CHOSE to be upset. And there's nothing wrong with that. BE upset if you want, but why not just take comments like that and ignore them? I don't care what she's wearing, either, but I just read it and let it go. It's not a reflection on her, but on our society. If we're not where you want us to be, you'll have to be resigned for some time yet.

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This sort of reminds me..

I was in the grocery store line about ten days ago behind a woman with a turban thing and no sign of hair. I liked the turban, more of a cleverly wrapped scarf that I might wear any time, not just in case of chemo. I didn't know whether to say anything and kept quiet.

She checked out and turned to me and asked if I wanted the little packets Albertson's gives away for their strange win-a-prize contest going on now. I said yes, since I fitfully participate in that. Who knows, maybe a new car (fat chance).
Then I told her I like the turban, and she grinned at me.
I was glad that happened.

People going through this stuff are normal.. but attention can help, at least sometimes, to keep you from feeling in some very strange..isolated..zone.

1 Reply

Michelle single handedly destroys British/American alliance.

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