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How to ruin a day at the museum

 
 
dadpad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Mar, 2008 07:32 pm
boomerang wrote:
dadpad wrote:
boomerang wrote:
If Jesus really loved us he would have created a cherry tree that the aborist didn't want to charge me $600 to prune.


Wish I could help boomer. Pruning is what I do.
'

I could probably buy you and mumpad tickets to Oregon and rent you tools for the price he wants to clean up our backyard. And that is just the trees. Mo and I have filled 14 30 gallon lawn sacks with ivy and woody residue from plants killed by the ivy over the last two days.

Damn you Jesus and your stupid nature!


$2000 AUD will get me there and back. I'll need a sthil 200T and a harness.

I'll go pack and check my account when I finish.
0 Replies
 
Chai
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Mar, 2008 08:02 pm
bookmark
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Chai
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Mar, 2008 06:21 am
wow

looking at the childrens smiling faces, I didn't see the excitement of learning and discovery, but the smugness of "See? I'm right."
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Mar, 2008 06:33 am
Cal wrote-

Quote:
One more reason, why I am so against home schooling. They are ruining perfect little minds with such utter rubbish.


Come on Cal--we've all had our minds ruined. Perfect little minds are feral.
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BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Mar, 2008 08:07 am
BBB
It appears that all of the great minds have gathered on this thread topic. Is the world at risk?

BBB
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rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Mar, 2008 12:01 pm
Re: How to ruin a day at the museum
BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:
How to ruin a day at the museum video

http://www.glumbert.com/media/ruinmuseum


Quote:
Because the Bible Tells Me So?
(By BRIAN ROONEY and MELIA PATRIA, ABC Nightline, March 19, 2008)

Standing in the lobby of the Denver Museum of Nature & Science, Bill Jack and Rusty Carter pointed to the enormous teeth on the reproduced skeleton of a Tyrannosaurs Rex, and told a group of children and their parents that the fearsome T-Rex was really a vegetarian.

The bananas back in the Jurasic were really mean, to the T-Rex had to have big teeth to handle them.
0 Replies
 
dadpad
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Mar, 2008 03:29 am
The money isn't showing boomer.
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boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Mar, 2008 07:39 am
I'm waiting a bit to see if Jesus shows up to fix his mistakes.
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dadpad
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Mar, 2008 08:18 am
boomerang wrote:
I'm waiting a bit to see if Jesus shows up to fix his mistakes.


and you know its his fault cause everyone who looks at the job says Jesus what a mess!!!!

bit off topic here boomer.
0 Replies
 
boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Mar, 2008 08:36 am
Maybe not so off topic.

If those guys could have seen the face of the poor yard debris/recycle truck drivers face this morning when confronted by 450 gallons of ivy they wouldn't think the earth was so young after all.

The sad thing is -- I'm only about 1/3 of the way through with ivy removal.

That doesn't even begin to tackle the backyard cleanup process. There are still all the shrubs I've dug up that didn't make it to the recyling this time, the 15' cherry tree "stump" that needs to be removed, the sad little maple that never received enough sun to grow strong, the pathetic little holly tree which suffers from the same problem.

And then, of course, we get to the "real" trees -- two birchs and a cherry that are all at least 40' high.

Oh no.... the earth is not young.

Or Jesus has a mean sense of humor.

I'm not sure which.....
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wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Mar, 2008 09:06 am
Here is a transcript of the video news report:
Quote:
Because the Bible Tells Me So?
(By BRIAN ROONEY and MELIA PATRIA, ABC Nightline, March 19, 2008)

Standing in the lobby of the Denver Museum of Nature & Science, Bill Jack and Rusty Carter pointed to the enormous teeth on the reproduced skeleton of a Tyrannosaurs Rex, and told a group of children and their parents that the fearsome T-Rex was really a vegetarian.

They said the T-Rex was vegetarian because at the time of the Creation, there was no such thing as death, so a T-Rex could not have eaten meat. There was no death until Adam and Eve ate forbidden fruit from the tree of knowledge, they continued, and God's revenge was to curse the world with death.

Jack asked, "If this creature was designed to eat meat from the very start, what would he have to do until Adam and Eve sinned and death entered the world? What would he have to do?" The children replied in chorus, "Starve."

"Fast and pray for The Fall. Is that likely?" Jack asked. "The answer is, everyone look at me and say, 'No.' Try that with me.'"

"No!" the children replied.

Jack and Carter operate what they call BC Tours: "BC" stands for Biblically Correct. They take paying customers on tours of such places as the Denver Museum, the zoo, and fossil sites, giving an explanation of nature, biology and paleontology with a strictly Biblical interpretation. They lead 100 tours a year and have reached thousands of children since starting their company in 1988.

"We believe Jesus is our designer and our creator of everything that was ever made," Carter tells the group of about 30 home-schooled Christian children and parents.

Known as "young Earth creationists," Jack and Carter say the Bible tells them Earth is only 6,000 to 10,000 years old. In the scientific community, the earth is estimated to be 4.5 billion years old. Jack and Carter describe both Creationism and the theory of evolution as "philosophies" and "world views" that are essentially on a par with each other; it's just a question of which you choose.

They believe that the life that populates Earth is not the product of billions of years of evolution, but created by God in six 24 hour days. And they believe Adam and Eve walked the Earth with dinosaurs, and that all the dinosaur fossils found all over the world are probably the result of one catastrophic event, such as Noah's flood, and not 4.5 billion years of life and death.

A 2007 Gallup Poll found that more Americans accept the theory of creationism than evolution. When those surveyed were asked about their views on the origins of life, 66 percent said creation, defined as "the idea that God created human beings pretty much in their present form at one time within the last 10,000 years," is probably or definitely true. In comparison, 53 percent said evolution, defined as "the idea that human beings developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life," is probably or definitely true.

Carter asked the children, "Is evolution a religion?" and they replied "Yes."

"Yes it's a religious belief," Carter said. "It's a philosophy."

In a witty and playful manner, they dismiss much of what's on display in the museum as "pseudo-science" and describe many of the graphic depictions of paleontology and evolution as merely "artwork." Standing before a display on "Life in the Cenozoic Seas," Jack told the group, "This is a great museum if they would take out the propaganda, if they take out the pseudo-science. It's appalling because students go away thinking that cows turned into whales."

They deride the notion that anything so complex as the human eye could be the result of random mutations, or that the scales of a fish could over millions of years become teeth.

Pointing to the fossil of a giant fish found in Kansas, Carter said, "Who likes to fish? Who would believe you could catch a fish this big in Kansas."

The tours are tolerated but not sponsored by the museum curators.

"They selectively ignore the vast majority of science in their presentation," paleontologist Kirk Johnson said.

Johnson, who was raised himself to believe the world was only 6,000 years old, said that personal observation and a long education have taught him the evolution is the only way that biology makes sense.

"All of science understands that evolution is a central tenet of biology," Johnson said. "That's how biology makes sense. That's how we make better medicines. That's how we understand food crops.

"If you want to map out life through time, the fossil record is really great for doing that," Johnson said. "There's a really nice record of what happened on this planet from the first real life forms we know of about 3.4 billion years ago until today."

Out on the museum floor, Jack and Carter stopped the group in front of a window display that contains samples of sandstone that have ripples created by water and fossils of ancient life. Bill Jack asked his group, "How do they date the fossil? By the layer in which they find it. They date the layer by the fossil and the fossil by the layer," he said. "That's circular reasoning."

In the next moment he stepped past and turned his back to a display on radiometric dating, the method by which scientists determine the age of rocks through the rate of decay of their natural radioactivity.

When later asked why he skipped the display, Jack said simply, "We can't cover everything."

Inside the museum's expansive bone and fossil storage room, Johnson said, "They have no clue about how accurate it is … Now it's plus or minus a tenth of a percent."

Jack and Carter are usually preaching to an agreeable audience. Many of their customers also are creationists, some looking for ways to further instruct their children or bolster their own beliefs.

Stacia Martin, who brought her 14-year-old son Shawn, said she had learned how to defend her faith in Jesus Christ.

"I learned that when you look at exhibits, don't take them at face value just because they're exciting looking or because they're interesting," she said.

Her son Shawn said he thinks the world is 10,000 years old, "Because the Bible says that."

According to Johnson there are benefits to the BC Tours, even if children are given a message diametrically opposed to what the museum presents.

"Regardless of what the tour guide is saying, some of those kids are going to start thinking for themselves," Johnson said.

Jack and Carter said that's exactly what they are teaching: that people should think for themselves, but think within a framework of Creationist belief. They say that life makes sense if you believe that God created all life, and man in his own image.

Otherwise, Jack said, "It is naturalism. All there really is, is nature, and everything comes from nature. And yes, that is antithetical to a supernaturalist world view, if you will, that there is a God who created, put order into the universe."

Jack and Carter are now training other people around the country to hold similar tours at their local museums, and they are also putting together tour materials for Christian teachers.

"I've chosen to believe the God of the Bible," said Jack. "Now the evolutionist has chosen not to believe the God of the Bible. So we've chosen to believe they're both matters of faith."
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Mar, 2008 02:55 pm
wandeljw wrote:
Here is a transcript of the video news report:
Quote:
Because the Bible Tells Me So?
(By BRIAN ROONEY and MELIA PATRIA, ABC Nightline, March 19, 2008)
Jack and Carter said that's exactly what they are teaching: that people should think for themselves, but think within a framework of Creationist belief. They say that life makes sense if you believe that God created all life, and man in his own image.

Otherwise, Jack said, "It is naturalism. All there really is, is nature, and everything comes from nature. And yes, that is antithetical to a supernaturalist world view, if you will, that there is a God who created, put order into the universe."

There ya go. There's the real problem. All of this discussion of evidence and carbon dating and interpretation of facts and science versus religion, is just a smoke screen for the core issue above.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Mar, 2008 05:38 am
That needs to be made into a a bumper sticker in order to paste on RL's forehead whenever he tries to present his smoke screen about the "different' interpretations" of scientific data. Very Happy
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rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Apr, 2008 12:25 pm
Walking With Dinosaurs Live is coming to Manchester NH.

If they put saddles on them and show them marching into an ark I'm gonna puke.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Apr, 2008 05:20 pm
Why would anybody want to ruin a day at a museum.

They are good fun.

The exhibits, in the main, are a bit tiresome I'll admit but not always.

I suppose if you look at them in a pedantic twitty sort of way, as Beatrice Webb might have done, they might well seem to be ruining your day but if you have got Jennifer Whiteside in the corner seat all the way there and all the way back, and some fried onion hamburgers from the van on the car park and the curator looks like Peter Lorre it can only be construed as a ruined day under certain highly extrapolated circumstances.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Apr, 2008 05:23 pm
Im afraid hes been dipping into the vanilla extract again.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Apr, 2008 05:36 pm
Not scared of vanilla are you fm.

It's okay. Nothing to worry about.

I've seen them giving it to 2 year olds and they seem to like it.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 09:22 am
The evidence from museum collections and their (private) sample collections provides the most compelling evidence of the way evolution has worked. Origins aside. Whenever a cataclysmic environmental event occured on the planet, the evolutionary pallette has always displayed the many options of new bodily responses to the new environment. Example, Shortly after the great extinction were the appearances of many different reptilian, dinsoaurian, and mammalian forms. With time each of these forms appears to have "Settled down" to a shorter list of options as the most successful competed out the others. For example, 7 orders of mammals crossed the KT boundary and only 3 survived and of those only one has really dominated with monotremes held captive by their own special niches.This evidence counterclaims Schroeder's claim of the "proof of a designer"

To state that T rex was a vegetarian is about the dummest piece of shithead science that surrounds the Creationis school. (IDjist get a pass on this because even they agree that dentition defines diet). There are only 2 or 3 species of dinosaur that showed transition from carnivore to an omnivorous lifestyle. This coincided with a special development of molar like teeth from their pre existing meat slicers. T rex has none of that, instead his teeth were like a great white shark(who doesnt visit the salad bar much)
To deny functional interpretations from clear and accurate evidence is just plain stupid stupid stupid. Then giving the Creationists any inches by "respect of their viewpoints" is caving in to these clowns.

Museums are great repositories of forensic evidence, Creationists have no business trying to change the underlying assumptions that govern life 's morphology and then try to project that backward to coincide with their own comfort zones.

ANy animals that are omnivorous have got a special dentition pattern or have developed beaks. There is no evidence to the contrary.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Apr, 2008 11:49 am
Yes fm, but it's all so simple.

If evolutionary success is measured in numbers then the modern chicken is much more successful than that lot of beasts. And that species has been evolved before our eyes in relation to human needs and tastes which are the critical environment. The ability to turn feedstock into edible meat more efficiently being the principle factor.

And not just chickens. Expensive domestic pets are living creatures which no known environment could have produced outside of human folly.

Perhaps evolution theory might be better taught to kids using those sorts of examples and instead of days out to the museums, where infinity goes up on trial as Bob Dylan said, the kids could have field trips to industrial chicken units and such like abominations and see what the "Naked Lunch" looks like forensically rather than in Jurassic Park settings or in picture books where a certain artistic licence is possible.

Genetically modified crops as well.
0 Replies
 
 

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